Z9 1st Impressions & Firmware Wishlist: Brad Hill

[fcotterill]

His first overview based on 6 days testing a prototype is positive. Not surprisingly. A few new features not yet mentioned (at least in my reading).
It is now possible to"...copy an entire shooting (or custom) bank to another bank."; expanded Recall shooting Functions are two.

It's also not surprising the EVF strikes him as excellent.... contrary to negative condemnations by spec-obsessives, despite never even touching a Z9

Natural Art Images: Voice: Brad Hill Blog

The Blog of Brad Hill, wildlife photographer. Cameras, lenses, camera gear, field tests, conservation, photo tours, and other bits of questionable wisdom from a young-at-heart nature photographer!

www.naturalart.ca

 

[Steve W]

His first overview based on 6 days testing a prototype is positive. Not surprisingly. A few new features not yet mentioned (at least in my reading).
It is now possible to"...copy an entire shooting (or custom) bank to another bank."; expanded Recall shooting Functions are two.

It's also not surprising the EVF strikes him as excellent.... contrary to negative condemnations by spec-obsessives, despite never even touching a Z9

Natural Art Images: Voice: Brad Hill Blog

The Blog of Brad Hill, wildlife photographer. Cameras, lenses, camera gear, field tests, conservation, photo tours, and other bits of questionable wisdom from a young-at-heart nature photographer!

www.naturalart.ca

I think spec obsessed and brand defensive sums it up entirely.

 

[thelordofthelight]

TFS. Was waiting to hear Brad's first impression. His assessment has always been spot on from the perspective of a wildlife photographer.

His first overview based on 6 days testing a prototype is positive. Not surprisingly. A few new features not yet mentioned (at least in my reading).
It is now possible to"...copy an entire shooting (or custom) bank to another bank."; expanded Recall shooting Functions are two.

It's also not surprising the EVF strikes him as excellent.... contrary to negative condemnations by spec-obsessives, despite never even touching a Z9

Natural Art Images: Voice: Brad Hill Blog

The Blog of Brad Hill, wildlife photographer. Cameras, lenses, camera gear, field tests, conservation, photo tours, and other bits of questionable wisdom from a young-at-heart nature photographer!

www.naturalart.ca

 

[thelordofthelight]

Ricci mentioned in his earlier videos that subject detection (on/off) can't be set to a custom control button. Brad Hill's initial impression on the Z9 says the recall shooting functions (RSF) has an option to set subject detection feature. This could mean there is a workaround to quickly turn the subject detection on or off ( auto or off) using RSF.
The default shooting menu can have subject detection set to auto and RSF can be used to turn it to off.

 

[fcotterill]

Yes, it will be interesting to know more.... RSF now includes "AF subject detection options", does this mean an AF mode can be restricted to 'Animals' only, and no others?

If this can be restricted, then can a Fn button be set to activate Subject-Detection [Animals] + AFOn?

Or does this mean RSF enables one to disable/enable subject detection (ie on or off)?

In that recent interview/live discussion, I interpreted Ricci Chera, Nikon UK, to answer 'No' to the question: "In the Z9 Custom Settings, is it possible to assign a subset in the Tracking AF mode to a Fn mode? eg Bird-Only+AFOn or Animal-Only+AFOn ?"

It's hard to believe the ability (already possible) to assign AFMode+AFOn to a Fn button greys out the subject detection feature? But Nikon has a bad record in the department!

Ricci mentioned in his earlier videos that subject detection (on/off) can't be set to a custom control button. Brad Hill's initial impression on the Z9 says the recall custom functions (RCF) has an option to set subject detection feature. This could mean there is a workaround to quickly turn the subject detection on or off ( auto or off) using RCF.
The default shooting menu can have subject detection set to auto and RCF can be used to turn it to off.

 

[eft]

From Brad Hill's blog post

setting it up (again and again as I learn more about the camera!)

+++ to this

Also, I watched his TCSTV Live: Six Easy Steps to Capturing Great Wildlife Images seminar. I was interested in his comments on zoom lenses and how much he uses them, particularly on mirrorless cameras that appear to produce better results with TCs. In Steve's most recent video How To Nail The Shot - Tanzania Edition he also talked about situations where subjects are constantly moving towards and away from the photographer. I've ordered a Z9 but I "only" have a Nikon 200-500mm f5.6 zoom for distant shots. I will be interested to see how the lens performs when paired with the Z9 and if I can use it with a TC (partly because I am moving from a DX D500 to the Z9).

 

[fcotterill]

IME Steve is 100% correct a zoom allows so much more flexibility in framing the scene (also landscapes with an UWide). In his tests of the 180-400 f4E TC14 and 120-300 f2.8E SR, Brad Hill makes a strong case for Aperture Independent-Sharpness with the latest exotic tele zooms. Remarkably, both these Nikkors also have high quality bokeh-3D rendering. the 70-200 f2.8E FL was the first to deliver this prime-like quality, even with TC14 III (and the 120-300 also pairs well with TCs).

Remarkably, with constant f2.8, the 120-300 f2.8E matches the faster primes available (200 f2G the partial exception).

The feedback on the 70-200 f2.8S are equally positive, and ambassador's feedback on the 100-400 S, hopefully these reports hold up to independent scrutiny; if so it's my next lens in the distant future (once the Z9 is paid off!).

If one can afford the RRP, a zoom telephoto for wildlife has so many benefits: less kit to pack and lug, on airlines especially, let alone in the field. Be interesting to see how the 200-600 Z Nikkor performs

From Brad Hill's blog post
+++ to this
Also, I watched his TCSTV Live: Six Easy Steps to Capturing Great Wildlife Images seminar. I was interested in his comments on zoom lenses and how much he uses them, particularly on mirrorless cameras that appear to produce better results with TCs. In Steve's most recent video How To Nail The Shot - Tanzania Edition he also talked about situations where subjects are constantly moving towards and away from the photographer. I've ordered a Z9 but I "only" have a Nikon 200-500mm f5.6 zoom for distant shots. I will be interested to see how the lens performs when paired with the Z9 and if I can use it with a TC (partly because I am moving from a DX D500 to the Z9).

 

[thelordofthelight]

Yes Ricci mentioned it in a couple of panel discussions that subject tracking can't be configured in conjunction with AF-ON and AF area modes.
I think the only workaround at this point is to use RSF and keep subject detection to off, while keeping subject detection to Auto in the standard shooting mode.

Another good option with Z9 is, if one doesn't want subject tracking, we can simply use the single point or dynamic modes and those do not have tracking features. I'm planning to configure 3D tracking with subject detection for shutter press, AF-On for wide area S or L, again with subject tracking and then the joystick for single point AF and one of the front fn/pv buttons to dynamic area.

Yes, it will be interesting to know more.... RSF now includes "AF subject detection options", does this mean an AF mode can be restricted to 'Animals' only, and no others?

If this can be restricted, then can a Fn button be set to activate Subject-Detection [Animals] + AFOn?

Or does this mean RSF enables one to disable/enable subject detection (ie on or off)?

In that recent interview/live discussion, I interpreted Ricci Chera, Nikon UK, to answer 'No' to the question: "In the Z9 Custom Settings, is it possible to assign a subset in the Tracking AF mode to a Fn mode? eg Bird-Only+AFOn or Animal-Only+AFOn ?"

It's hard to believe the ability (already possible) to assign AFMode+AFOn to a Fn button greys out the subject detection feature? But Nikon has a bad record in the department!

 

[arbitrage]

Yes Ricci mentioned it in a couple of panel discussions that subject tracking can't be configured in conjunction with AF-ON and AF area modes.
I think the only workaround at this point is to use RSF and keep subject detection to off, while keeping subject detection to Auto in the standard shooting mode.

Another good option with Z9 is, if one doesn't want subject tracking, we can simply use the single point or dynamic modes and those do not have tracking features. I'm planning to configure 3D tracking with subject detection for shutter press, AF-On for wide area S or L, again with subject tracking and then the joystick for single point AF and one of the front fn/pv buttons to dynamic area.

Are we sure that Single point and Dynamic can’t have Tracking enabled? Where you would use the targeted single point to start Tracking on a specific area and then it takes over across the frame from there. I think that omission would be a big negative in my use. Both Canon and Sony allow you to do that and there are benefits. The R5 was very limited, the R3 is more inclusive and as always Sony provides ultimate control.

 

[lwan]

I'm eager to read the next posts!

 

[thelordofthelight]

That's my understanding so far. I think it is clear in Ricci's video about the Z9. But what you intend doing with the Single/Dynamic is what the 3D tracking does. The user selects the starting point and then the camera tracks across the frame.

Are we sure that Single point and Dynamic can’t have Tracking enabled? Where you would use the targeted single point to start Tracking on a specific area and then it takes over across the frame from there. I think that omission would be a big negative in my use. Both Canon and Sony allow you to do that and there are benefits. The R5 was very limited, the R3 is more inclusive and as always Sony provides ultimate control.

 

[arbitrage]

That's my understanding so far. I think it is clear in Ricci's video about the Z9. But what you intend doing with the Single/Dynamic is what the 3D tracking does. The user selects the starting point and then the camera tracks across the frame.

Ok, that is what came to mind after posting that question. So 3D will be the targeted mode and Auto will be the "spray and pray" mode (giving up all control). Single point for precision but no tracking to recompose.

Would be nice if Nikon would release the manual already. But considering Brad notes in the article that even he didn't have a manual doesn't make me hopeful to have one ahead of time.

 

[thelordofthelight]

Yes. Auto AF on Z9 behaves like 3D tracking on Nikon DSLRs. What I'm not sure is how the wide AF S/L work. I know it tracks within the S/L box but will it let the user select a starting AF point or not is unclear.

Ok, that is what came to mind after posting that question. So 3D will be the targeted mode and Auto will be the "spray and pray" mode (giving up all control). Single point for precision but no tracking to recompose.

Would be nice if Nikon would release the manual already. But considering Brad notes in the article that even he didn't have a manual doesn't make me hopeful to have one ahead of time.

 

[arbitrage]

Yes. Auto AF on Z9 behaves like 3D tracking on Nikon DSLRs. What I'm not sure is how the wide AF S/L work. I know it tracks within the S/L box but will it let the user select a starting AF point or not is unclear.

Wouldn't Auto on Z9 just behave like Auto on DSLR and 3D the same as 3D? Changes of course being larger AF coverage and addition of Subject recognition on the Z9.
On DSLR Auto just searches over the entire AF points and 3D gives you a centred box to start Tracking from. Sounds like Z9 is the same...Auto will search without guidance across the entire AF area and 3D gives you a box to target with at first.

I do wonder how Wide modes work....do they just look for subject in the defined area and then only track within that area OR do they look in the area but then continue to track even if subject moves out of that area. On my A1 I have the option to have it do that either way. Use Zone and it just looks for eye in the Zone or use Zone:Tracking where it looks in the Zone but if it finds the subject/eye then it will continue to track across the entire sensor. Sony can make that differentiation all the way down to the smallest Flex Spot AF point. I have a custom button set that when I hold it in it changes my regular (non-tracking) AF mode into the Tracking variation. This is powerful customization. Something Nikon typically lacks.

Brad mentions at the end of the post that he is preparing a more detailed AF post to explain all of these things (I assume based on how he worded that last bit). It sounds like he has some methods worked out. I hope he gets that up in the next week.

From what I've gathered so far about the Z9, I've prepared myself that the Z9 will not be customizable as much as I WANT it to be but it will be customizable as much as I NEED it to be to get the job done and not be overly frustrated.

That said, omissions like Brad mentions of Recall HOLD which is already present in D6, just make me shake my head in disbelief at these decisions.

 

[fcotterill]

Update, I have exchanged a couple of emails with Brad Hill enquiring about what is possible. In short, he promises a detailed post on the AF, hopefully early next week.

In short he expanded on what's already been mentioned in parts by a couple of more capable commentators. 3D tracking is limited to: Auto Area, Wide Area (S), Wide Area (L)
and obviously 3D tracking mode itself. 3D tracking is not supported in pinpoint mode (still only available in AF-S), single point mode, or any Dynamic Area mode (As he points out, each of these already has intrinsic tracking, but within its circumscribed area).

Quote: "As you are suggesting, if you have a specific area mode assigned to a button (for example, Wide Area - S), then when you push the button to activate that AF area mode it will have subject detection on (if you have it turned on) or off (if you have it turned off). So it any AF mode assigned to a button “inherits” the subject recognition state the camera is set to."

 

[thelordofthelight]

Maybe I'm totally wrong about the way 3D works in DSLRs. I never used that mode except to test it the first time. I thought on the DSLRs (except D6) we could never select the 3D starting AF point.
As for small and large AF modes the tracking box won't move outside the box. I asked this qn to Ricci on his panel discussion and think he confirmed this one.
Agree with you in the recall options. I'd love to have the toggle mode on Z9.

Wouldn't Auto on Z9 just behave like Auto on DSLR and 3D the same as 3D? Changes of course being larger AF coverage and addition of Subject recognition on the Z9.
On DSLR Auto just searches over the entire AF points and 3D gives you a centred box to start Tracking from. Sounds like Z9 is the same...Auto will search without guidance across the entire AF area and 3D gives you a box to target with at first.

I do wonder how Wide modes work....do they just look for subject in the defined area and then only track within that area OR do they look in the area but then continue to track even if subject moves out of that area. On my A1 I have the option to have it do that either way. Use Zone and it just looks for eye in the Zone or use Zone:Tracking where it looks in the Zone but if it finds the subject/eye then it will continue to track across the entire sensor. Sony can make that differentiation all the way down to the smallest Flex Spot AF point. I have a custom button set that when I hold it in it changes my regular (non-tracking) AF mode into the Tracking variation. This is powerful customization. Something Nikon typically lacks.

Brad mentions at the end of the post that he is preparing a more detailed AF post to explain all of these things (I assume based on how he worded that last bit). It sounds like he has some methods worked out. I hope he gets that up in the next week.

From what I've gathered so far about the Z9, I've prepared myself that the Z9 will not be customizable as much as I WANT it to be but it will be customizable as much as I NEED it to be to get the job done and not be overly frustrated.

That said, omissions like Brad mentions of Recall HOLD which is already present in D6, just make me shake my head in disbelief at these decisions.

 

[fcotterill]

Now for RSF, from emails:
Overall, a single configuration of RSF is permitted per Custom Bank, so this allows 4 configurations of RSF in total. Currently the only way to switch between custom banks reasonably fast (without diving deep into menus) is to put it into i-Menu.

With 3D Tracking Customization it gets interesting.... RSF allows allows you to turn on either ALL the individual subject detection categories (Animal, People Birds etc) all at once (Auto) or turn them all off. RSF does not allow excluding a category (eg keep Animals and Birds but exclude People vehicles).

Thanks be to Brad, he has deciphered how to setup RSF assigned to a button (Fn1 etc) to toggle Subject-Detection On or Off (depending on how you set it in AF). "You do this by turning off ALL RSF options EXCEPT subject detection....So to be perfectly clear, if you prefer to have subject recognition off most of the time, you CAN turn it on with a button with a “clever” set up of RSF (and it can be set for ALL subject types or only animals or only people, or only vehicles). Or, conversely, if you prefer to have subject recognition on most of the time but want to turn it OFF with the push of a button, you can also do this with RSF."

Besides setting a button to toggle subject recognition (Off or On), Brad extrapolated to explain you can leverage RSF to other uses. Crucially, this gives us the solution to work around Nikon's pruning of Custom menus ie those Functions " Verboden" from assigning to a Button. This is provided the Function is listed in the RSF list (e.g. toggle Auto ISO on or off via a Fn button).

 

[thelordofthelight]

Exactly. He was kind enough to respond to my questions on RSF. I asked him if it was possible to turn subject detect to on (auto) vs off using RSF and he tested the camera and confirmed it was possible. So you can configure it either ways. I.e. keep subject detection ON in standard mode and then turn it OFF using RSF button or keep it OFF in standard vs ON using RSF button.

Update, I have exchanged a couple of emails with Brad Hill enquiring about what is possible. In short, he promises a detailed post on the AF, hopefully early next week.

In short he expanded on what's already been mentioned in parts by a couple of more capable commentators. 3D tracking is limited to: Auto Area, Wide Area (S), Wide Area (L)
and obviously 3D tracking mode itself. 3D tracking is not supported in pinpoint mode (still only available in AF-S), single point mode, or any Dynamic Area mode (As he points out, each of these already has intrinsic tracking, but within its circumscribed area).

Quote: "As you are suggesting, if you have a specific area mode assigned to a button (for example, Wide Area - S), then when you push the button to activate that AF area mode it will have subject detection on (if you have it turned on) or off (if you have it turned off). So it any AF mode assigned to a button “inherits” the subject recognition state the camera is set to."

 

[thelordofthelight]

I think we were typing at the same time on the same topic LoL. What's extremely helpful for me is the ability to use RSF to turn subject detection on/off with a button press and also use RSF for AF tracking with lock on settings override (using AF sensitivity to sticky as a standard 1-3 vs more responsive 4 -5 as an override).

Now for RSF, from emails:
Overall, a single configuration of RSF permitted per Custom Banks, which allows 4 configurations of RSF in total. Currently the only way to switch between custom banks reasonably fast (without diving deep into menus) is to put it into i-Menu.

With 3D Tracking Customization it gets interesting.... RSF allows allows you to turn on either ALL the individual subject detection categories (Animal, People Birds etc) all at once (Auto) or turn them all off. RSF does not allow excluding a category (eg keep Animals and Birds but exclude People vehicles).

Thanks be to Brad, he has deciphered how to setup RSF assigned to a button (Fn1 etc) to toggle Subject-Detection On or Off (depending on how you set it in AF). "You do this by turning off ALL RSF options EXCEPT subject detection....So to be perfectly clear, if you prefer to have subject recognition off most of the time, you CAN turn it on with a button with a “clever” set up of RSF (and it can be set for ALL subject types or only animals or only people, or only vehicles). Or, conversely, if you prefer to have subject recognition on most of the time but want to turn it OFF with the push of a button, you can also do this with RSF."

Besides setting a button to toggle subject recognition (Off or On), Brad extrapolated to explain you can leverage RSF to other uses. Crucially, this gives us the solution to work around Nikon's pruning of Custom menus ie those Functions " Verboden" from assigning to a Button. This is provided the Function is listed in the RSF list (e.g. toggle Auto ISO on or off via a Fn button).

 

[arbitrage]

Now for RSF, from emails:


Thanks be to Brad, he has deciphered how to setup RSF assigned to a button (Fn1 etc) to toggle Subject-Detection On or Off (depending on how you set it in AF). "You do this by turning off ALL RSF options EXCEPT subject detection....So to be perfectly clear, if you prefer to have subject recognition off most of the time, you CAN turn it on with a button with a “clever” set up of RSF (and it can be set for ALL subject types or only animals or only people, or only vehicles). Or, conversely, if you prefer to have subject recognition on most of the time but want to turn it OFF with the push of a button, you can also do this with RSF."

The only improvement to that would be if Nikon allowed RSF Hold so that it would act as a toggle and not a button you have to hold down the entire time you want to switch your Subject Detection one way or the other. I wonder why Nikon didn't put the "Hold" option from the D6 in the Z9?

I keep getting confused with the Hold nomenclature as on Sony the Hold option is the one you Hold down the button and the other option is a toggle option (no name given). I guess on Nikon Hold is referring to the setting being Held by the camera without input until you push again to revert back. Most of the time I prefer a toggle option (Hold on Nikon) but there are some setups I use where I like things to only activate while pressing the button as the Z9 does it now.

 

[EricBowles]

Yes, it will be interesting to know more.... RSF now includes "AF subject detection options", does this mean an AF mode can be restricted to 'Animals' only, and no others?

If this can be restricted, then can a Fn button be set to activate Subject-Detection [Animals] + AFOn?

Or does this mean RSF enables one to disable/enable subject detection (ie on or off)?

In that recent interview/live discussion, I interpreted Ricci Chera, Nikon UK, to answer 'No' to the question: "In the Z9 Custom Settings, is it possible to assign a subset in the Tracking AF mode to a Fn mode? eg Bird-Only+AFOn or Animal-Only+AFOn ?"

It's hard to believe the ability (already possible) to assign AFMode+AFOn to a Fn button greys out the subject detection feature? But Nikon has a bad record in the department!

My understanding is you can choose a Priority in Area AF mode, but you still have the other traditional modes. If you are using AF Area, it will search for an alternate subject if an Animal is not found. The assumption is you will know when to use subject detection and have alternative settings available.

3D Tracking is a different mode. It starts with you focusing on the subject.

I have not heard anyone complain about the way these modes work, but its not set it and forget it.

I have a webinar with Mark Cruz tonight. I'll ask him about the AF modes.

 

[thelordofthelight]

There we go (Brad's blog):

"Dec 2021: The Nikon Z 9: A Button to Turn OFF Subject Recognition?
This is an unplanned blog entry that I'm offering up in response to a lot of email questions I received after my 30 November post on the Z 9. In a sense I set myself up for the questions by talking a little about the Recall Shooting Functions (RSF) custom option on the Z 9. In a perfect world I would include today's information/explanation in a more complete discussion of the AF system of the Z 9. Why? Because knowing a little more about the Z 9's AF system would help folks better understand what I'm about to say. But I won't have that blog post ready for 4 or 5 days, so I'll try to fill in the blanks on the Z 9 AF system enough for the following to make sense. Today's entry will be a mix of "big picture" issues along with getting a little into the weeds of some custom settings...and I have no doubt at least some of the things I say will spread over the interweb real quick!

OK...what's the question that I'm already being snowed under by? This:

Can you turn off the Z 9's subject recognition feature with the push of a single button?"
http://www.naturalart.ca/voice/blog.html#:~:text=Dec 2021: The,a single button?

 

[fcotterill]

Thank you m'Lord for sharing this

I'm glad he prioritized an explanation of Subject Recognition wrt to customizing its setup with RSF. As he's says, this is following emailed questions. His post has also answered another question I've been wondering about, if the Z9 Autofocus System uses closest Subject Priority?

So far, his testing shows the Z9 does in at least one configuration: "...it appears like the Wide-area modes shift to a "focus on closest object within the focus box" system - just like Group Area mode works on Nikon's DSLR's..."

 

[thelordofthelight]

Wide AF area modes on the Zs have always had CSP bias but I vaguely remember Thom mentioning there's a slight difference between wide area modes on the Zs vs Group AF on DSLRs. Maybe that's the reason Nikon is also planning to port the group modes with customisable boxes to the Z9 via a firmware update. So far I'm so happy about the AF options on the Z9 in that it offers simple and straightforward implementation of tracking and non-tracking modes.

 

[arbitrage]

Wide AF area modes on the Zs have always had CSP bias but I vaguely remember Thom mentioning there's a slight difference between wide area modes on the Zs vs Group AF on DSLRs. Maybe that's the reason Nikon is also planning to port the group modes with customisable boxes to the Z9 via a firmware update. So far I'm so happy about the AF options on the Z9 in that it offers simple and straightforward implementation of tracking and non-tracking modes.

My understanding is that it won't be a new mode called "Group" but will just be fully customizable Wide AF Area mode. Which in the end is all that is needed as long as Wide Area does have a CSP. That is going to be a killer feature. Really only the D6 (D5?) and the Canon R3 have that now.