Does Cropping Make Your Images Noisier?

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Steve

Steve

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Does cropping fill your photos with more noise? In this must-see video, we'll explore comparative output and see first-hand the effects that cropping can have on the noise of our final output image. This is one every photographer who has ever used a crop tool absolutely must see.

This 7 minute video will change your approach to photography - or at least surprise the heck out of you!


BTW - here's that chart in the video (you'll problem need to watch the video for it to make sense)

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Thank you Steve! I know that a good percentage of the time, I am guilty of cropping probably more than I should. When approaching a subject, I get caught in the battle between filling the frame versus not wanting to overly disturb the animal. Being relatively new to wildlife photography, I’m still working on this. This video really demonstrates the costs associated with cropping. A great reminder for me the next time I’m in the field.
 
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The only other advice when facing a challenging ISO / reach situation is to try and compose a picture including more of the environment in a way that lends itself to cropping less while remaining interesting. The subject may be smaller, but I'll always pick a smaller subject with more environment around it but less noise over a very tight crop where the quality falls apart.
Ideally you want tight and high quality but when trade-offs are necessary, I'll keep things wider and put the animal in context rather than get over-zealous with cropping.
 
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Steve said:
Does cropping fill your photos with more noise? In this must-see video, we'll explore comparative output and see first-hand the effects that cropping can have on the noise of our final output image. This is one every photographer who has ever used a crop tool absolutely must see.

This 7 minute video will change your approach to photography - or at least surprise the heck out of you!


BTW - here's that chart in the video (you'll problem need to watch the video for it to make sense)

View attachment 21042
Click to expand...
Heh Steve another excellent and informative video and topic. Cheers mate and I hope you are still doing well.
 
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This video reminded me of when I first started with photography, knowing that the re-sizing or cropping of my slides and Kodacolor prints was always going to be difficult...and expensive: therefore, do one's best to get the framing right in the first place in camera. I think this is timely because with the increasingly high MP sensors, it is tempting to relax that framing discipline in the belief you can crop the picture to your desired spec in post. While I believe I have that variable under control, more recently I've been relaxing (or floating) my ISO ever higher on my D6 in the interest of actually getting the shot (and, in fairness, there have been good shots I don't think I'd have previously got). Topaz has also only encouraged me to "go noisier" with ISO in the belief I'll recover the serviceability of the image. As you said, @Steve, sometimes you need to move on from a subject, the characteristics of which are virtually unshootable. I had exactly that reminder last night at sunset when trying to nab a few shots of some local Barred Owls, only to see shutter speed at less than 1/60, with f 2.8, and ISO 102400. Didn't shoot a frame. Still always the balancing act of variables in this discipline.
 
Excellent video as usual! Made me think about the impact on dynamic range as well, since the noise floor has such a big impact. And also something else you mentioned, how everything is impacted by how the photo is to be viewed, resampling, viewing distance, etc.

Another good topic would be the impact of cropping on depth of field, similar concepts at play, I think.
 
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Appreciate this, I have wrestled with this exact subject, forever it seems. You cleared it up and cleared concerns / questions.
Also, I like the opening music, the other was, well pounding..
Thank you
 
Steve said:
Does cropping fill your photos with more noise? In this must-see video, we'll explore comparative output and see first-hand the effects that cropping can have on the noise of our final output image. This is one every photographer who has ever used a crop tool absolutely must see.

This 7 minute video will change your approach to photography - or at least surprise the heck out of you!


BTW - here's that chart in the video (you'll problem need to watch the video for it to make sense)

View attachment 21042
Click to expand...

I'm wondering if the use of Lightroom's super resolution feature or similar before cropping would impact the noise? Since you would be pulling the crop out with more resolution for downsampling?
 
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bleirer said:
I'm wondering if the use of Lightroom's super resolution feature or similar before cropping would impact the noise? Since you would be pulling the crop out with more resolution for downsampling?
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I don't think so - there's no free lunch. The noise-to-detail ratio that is there will be magnified as you enlarge the image.
 
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I find myself reducing the size of the photo (crop off excess), edit, size to what I want and save. I assume this is incorrect and all editing should be with the full size image?
 
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Charles Loy said:
I find myself reducing the size of the photo (crop off excess), edit, size to what I want and save. I assume this is incorrect and all editing should be with the full size image?
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Not necessarily - I do it your way all the time. There is an argument to be made that if you're using something like Topaz noise reduction software that reducing the noise on the full size image is better since Topaz can examine the entire image and possibly get a better idea on how to handle the noise (i.e. a larger sample) although I don't know if it really matters that much.
 
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Update -

I had quite a few questions on YT and the BCG main site about Lightroom's super resolution feature and using it to increase the size of the image before cropping - and if it makes things any better. So, I did another test. I used super resolution on the heavy crop and then made the same 24 x 16 @200ppi output. Results? About the same...still ne free lunch :)

Lightroom-enhanced.jpg
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Ductape said:
Lol, you are on top of it!
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I was curious too :)

I have a feeling that this may work better if noise reduction is done first, however, you can also do that same noise reduction on the framing filler version. It's basically chasing your tail and the truth is, there's no shortcuts or workarounds that will ever make the crop version equal to the frame filling version because anything you can do to the crop version you can do to the frame-filler.
 
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In a round about way, this is also how I think about filling the frame with a 600mm lens on the D500 vs filling the frame using the same 600mm lens on the Z6II.... (i.e. APC compared to FF with approximately the same number of starting pixels)
I get a bit more reach on the D500... but the ISO needs to be lower to get comparative noise results to the Z6II
Thus treating the FF D500 as a cropped version of the Z7 to compare to the FF Z6. (If that makes any sense at all)

I guess a more direct comparison would be a ~400mm on the D500 to the 600mm on the Z6... but that is a much longer post.
 
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apanella said:
In a round about way, this is also how I think about filling the frame with a 600mm lens on the D500 vs filling the frame using the same 600mm lens on the Z6II.... (i.e. APC compared to FF with approximately the same number of starting pixels)
I get a bit more reach on the D500... but the ISO needs to be lower to get comparative noise results to the Z6II
Thus treating the FF D500 as a cropped version of the Z7 to compare to the FF Z6. (If that makes any sense at all)

I guess a more direct comparison would be a ~400mm on the D500 to the 600mm on the Z6... but that is a much longer post.
Click to expand...
That's how I use to do it with the D5 and D500. If the subject was going to see a DX level crop on the D5, I'd switch to the D500 and put more pixels in the same area.
 
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I'm guilty of over-cropping. Over time I've been working towards including more of the habitat in my images of birds and other critters. Very educational video and discussion here. Thanks Steve (and fellow board members)!
 
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