New Rule - No More Brand Bashing / Bragging Threads

[smkunder]

Support this 100%, here to learn about nature photography.

 

[Anjin San]

What you describe here basically says no change needed. Do we all agree on what pornography is? I doubt it. Do we all agree on what brand bashing is? Most certainly not. I suspect most of us think that criticizing brands other than those we own is justified or we would be using those other brands. "Done nicely if it's a fact then it's a fact"? WTH does that mean? Virtually everything that's discussed other than hard specifications about equipment is opinion, not fact. And even specs can be used to slant conversations. Play nice in kindergarten? Some kids come home with black eyes.

Not saying no change is needed…but slippery slope and all that…and not really knowing what Steve and/or other mods will determine is bashing can limit discussion. Not sure what you’re WTHing…but for instance…many people have stated here and in reviews that the A1 gives a higher keeper rate than the Z9 although both are excellent. I have no idea myself if that is true…but assuming that it is factual the question arises. If a post says the A1 is better than the Z9 for BIF…that’s a fact so is saying so brand bashing Nikon? I don’t think so unless the post said A1 is better so Z9 sucks…I would consider that bashing but a simple A1 is better for BIF is not.

I don’t brand bash so no biggie for me…but a very strict stomping on any brand comparison will affect discussions and can I do better sort of threads. And…there have only been a few instances of what I would call brand bashing and most of those were from 1 or 2 people. There was a thread recently where a person said they changed from brand A to brand B because of features in B and lack of responsiveness from A…but IMO that wasn’t bashing A, merely explaining what they did and why. Maybe it was an extraneous/unnecessary post…but there was some discussion following and I didn’t think the thread was bashing at all…but then I’ve been on UHH so maybe I’ve been desensitized somewhat…I just ignore bashing and move to the next reply or next topic.

 

[NorthernFocus]

Not saying no change is needed…but slippery slope and all that…and not really knowing what Steve and/or other mods will determine is bashing can limit discussion. Not sure what you’re WTHing…but for instance…many people have stated here and in reviews that the A1 gives a higher keeper rate than the Z9 although both are excellent. I have no idea myself if that is true…but assuming that it is factual the question arises. If a post says the A1 is better than the Z9 for BIF…that’s a fact so is saying so brand bashing Nikon? I don’t think so unless the post said A1 is better so Z9 sucks…I would consider that bashing but a simple A1 is better for BIF is not.

I don’t brand bash so no biggie for me…but a very strict stomping on any brand comparison will affect discussions and can I do better sort of threads.

I think we're demonstrating the proverbial slippery slope

 

[bleirer]

Not saying no change is needed…but slippery slope and all that…and not really knowing what Steve and/or other mods will determine is bashing can limit discussion. Not sure what you’re WTHing…but for instance…many people have stated here and in reviews that the A1 gives a higher keeper rate than the Z9 although both are excellent. I have no idea myself if that is true…but assuming that it is factual the question arises. If a post says the A1 is better than the Z9 for BIF…that’s a fact so is saying so brand bashing Nikon? I don’t think so unless the post said A1 is better so Z9 sucks…I would consider that bashing but a simple A1 is better for BIF is not.

I don’t brand bash so no biggie for me…but a very strict stomping on any brand comparison will affect discussions and can I do better sort of threads. And…there have only been a few instances of what I would call brand bashing and most of those were from 1 or 2 people. There was a thread recently where a person said they changed from brand A to brand B because of features in B and lack of responsiveness from A…but IMO that wasn’t bashing A, merely explaining what they did and why. Maybe it was an extraneous/unnecessary post…but there was some discussion following and I didn’t think the thread was bashing at all…but then I’ve been on UHH so maybe I’ve been desensitized somewhat…I just ignore bashing and move to the next reply or next topic.

I think if people remain civil and keep emotions and defensive remarks out of it then that is the test. We'll all know it when we see it, and now we know there will be zero tolerance at the first hint of interpersonal arguments. I'm against censorship as a rule, but sometimes harsh remarks especially by a well know member also can be a form of censorship. So there is usually an uh-oh moment when you know the thread is going downhill.

 

[John Navitsky]

fwiw, i run a dog sport photography fb group of several thousand photographers, and i try to have minimal rules and there have been a number of topics that have come up which i think are very good topics and would love to see a robust and civil discussion of those topics.

but......

we just can't.

these threads inevitably end up with people start taking things personal and spiral out of control. attempts keeping these threads under control with warnings, selectively pruning all end up failing and we inevitably end up deleting the whole thread.

it's not even like we can give a list of topics topics that will cause problems. it can happen with a variety of topics and i can smell the threads better than i can describe them.

in the end, we tend to notice a thread with the potential to go bad, watch it, try to keep it on course, but if we need to, whack it.

i think people just have a very hard time discussing topics they feel passionately about, or that they wrap up their self identity in, in a reasonable manner. i think the latter being the bigger issue.

ironically, brand wars has yet to hit us (knocks on wood)

 

[John Navitsky]

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

for those worried about "does this mean any discussion about brands is disallowed", just re-read Steve's initial comment.

 

[DRwyoming]

Folks let's keep an eye on what the policy actually is. Per Steve's post:

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed.

The point isn't to stifle discussion of camera model or brand differences but to stop threads posted solely for the purpose of saying I or photographer X just jumped brands. These inevitably go downhill and don't really serve much of a purpose as folks change brands in cameras and all kinds of things all the time for many reasons

Sure if any thread goes downhill, becomes uncivil or turns into ad hominem attacks the posts or threads involved may be locked or deleted per existing forum policies but the new policy is just about starting threads that are only about someone deciding to make a brand change and doesn't stop anyone from posting questions like does Brand A do this thing that Brand B does or how do I set up such and such on this camera I don't currently own or just bought. But yes if the responses to that go off the rails into 'dump that junk and buy Brand C' kind of stuff they'll likely get deleted.

 

[DRwyoming]

for those worried about "does this mean any discussion about brands is disallowed", just re-read Steve's initial comment.

Looks like we doubled there but yeah, I just dropped in to post the same thing.

 

[Bob D]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Going forward, when those kinds of threads pop up, I'm going to delete them. Anytime I see pre-existing threads that are violating this rule I will lock them.

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Steve

Yes, thank you

 

[mslmdr]

Good…now we can all “focus“ on politics!

 

[NorthernFocus]

Folks let's keep an eye on what the policy actually is. Per Steve's post...

This is the internet. Isn't it a global rule to only read the headline/title and over react? Sounds like you're suggesting thoughtful, level headed discourse. Are you mad?

 

[Nature Man]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Going forward, when those kinds of threads pop up, I'm going to delete them. Anytime I see pre-existing threads that are violating this rule I will lock them.

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Steve

A much needed move, Steve! Bravo for you! No need to let a few rotten apples spoil the whole barrel.

 

[gnpToday]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Needed to be done....Thx

 

[Drbobcameraguy]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Going forward, when those kinds of threads pop up, I'm going to delete them. Anytime I see pre-existing threads that are violating this rule I will lock them.

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Steve

It saddens me that people are so critical and at times hateful about for what most of us is a hobby meant to be enjoyed. Sorry you had to go to these lengths. If people would simply say what they would say in person half of the issues on social media would disappear. People in person are more respectful because they understand that if they get very very rude there can be consquences. People seem to lose their manners when the threat of consequences disappear. Thanks Steve but sorry you had to do it. Lol

 

[herjak]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Going forward, when those kinds of threads pop up, I'm going to delete them. Anytime I see pre-existing threads that are violating this rule I will lock them.

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Steve

Thank you getting back to the main objective of this forum

 

[JLT]

Good call!!

 

[Rick Kibbey]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Going forward, when those kinds of threads pop up, I'm going to delete them. Anytime I see pre-existing threads that are violating this rule I will lock them.

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Steve

Well said Steve. I fully concur and am ever so glad to see this. Friendly competition and joking is one thing, but things have gotten out of hand. I read these posts and watch your videos for knowledge and the great exchanges of information. I've unsubscribed to several posts because of it. Thanx Steve for keeping this about learning, fun and photography.

 

[Dmacfarl]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Going forward, when those kinds of threads pop up, I'm going to delete them. Anytime I see pre-existing threads that are violating this rule I will lock them.

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Steve

Good call. I’m here to learn, not to argue!

 

[Ron Mck]

Bravo Zulu Steve. Well said.

 

[AKRaven]

Thanks, Steve. Snarkiness keeps me from posting on this and other sites. My skin is too thin!

 

[TonyDownunder]

Great, thanks. I gave up reading the blog but will now return. Luckily I looked at it this morning while currently at a bird photography conference at the Gold Coast in Queensland, Australia

 

[Activert]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Going forward, when those kinds of threads pop up, I'm going to delete them. Anytime I see pre-existing threads that are violating this rule I will lock them.

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Steve

Thank You!

 

[Barrie]

Could we get on with talking about photography

 

[AnnetteJane]

Effective immediately: threads started with the sole purpose of telling others why you or someone else has either switched to one brand (or gotten rid of one brand) in favor of another will no longer be allowed. They inevitably end up starting a fight and they serve no real purpose. It frankly doesn't matter if you or someone else has decided to move from brand A to brand B and it is making coming to the forum an unpleasant experience for many members - myself included.

Going forward, when those kinds of threads pop up, I'm going to delete them. Anytime I see pre-existing threads that are violating this rule I will lock them.

However, this doesn't apply to asking legitimate questions about what brand is better for what activity or what people's specific experiences are with a given brand. If you have legitimate questions or observations, they are always welcome. What we're trying to avoid are threads that instigate conflict and that do not really add anything to the conversation other than to help rationalize your own purchases.

Finally, remember to keep a civil discourse when discussing various aspects of different brands and their features. Remember that this forum is intended to teach and help others with using their gear and sometimes making purchase decisions. Each photographer is different and has different needs and that idea needs to be respected with every response.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Steve

Thank you Steve !

 

[realspeed]

Not harsh but your site your rules