Nikon Flash for Birding/Songbird

[78Staff]

So, starting out I should say that I have pretty much completely moved over to the Godox/Flashpoint ecosystem... currently have 3 V1's and FP's version of the Pro Controller. But, I needed a normal non-round head unit to use with a beamer, so I picked up the 860VIII, as it has the newer battery and menu same as the V1's. Figured it was a slam dunk, as I could also integrate it into my existing kit as well.

Didn't read close enough I guess, turns out you can't connect an external battery ie the FP PB-960 power pack kit to the v860's. So, I am looking to add a single Nikon Speedlight. Will specifically be used with 500+ lens, for shooting stationary-ish (if there ever was such a thing birds or other small wildlife, manual mode camera and flash setting, HSS of course due to shutter speed, with MagBeam (which I chose over the BB) so no excessive zoom setting required), and be able to be used with an external battery, ie the Flashpoint PB-960. Using D850 mostly but sometimes D810, if it makes a difference. Would be nice to adjust flash power on camera body vs reaching up to flash body every time as well.

Basically boils down to the SB-800 vs 910 best I can tell - any reason to choose one over the other for this specific use case? 800 a touch more powerful and more compact, vs 910 larger and has supposed better menu interface and screen, and greater zoom (although not needed in this case). It will pretty much live in my wildlife kit bag, as for any other flash work I would be using the Godox setups.

 

[dabhand16]

I have SB800s and SB900. The SB800 menu is legendary for being clunky, but you do get used too it. My SB900 menu and controls are much better and I believe that the SB910 has the same layout.

Now, like you, I'm a Godox boy! In the UK there are a few sellers of rebranded Godox kit, I've recently started using Pixapro. Cheaper than Godox, 2 year warranty v 1 year, and excellent customer service. What's not to like?

On my V860iis and Pixapro Li-ion 580ii (V860ii equivalent), the lithium power pack lasts for a very long time. If you want a power pack for long battery life why not just get another battery or batteries so you can swap out as needed? They claim 600 full power flashes with around 1.7 second recycling. Will a power pack reduce the recycling time? I know that the extra battery holder on the Nikons did, but as that just added another AA battery and did indeed lower recycling times, with the lithium power packs the the Godox/FP/Pixapro units have, I'm not sure that a power pack will (or should) increase voltage like an extra AA does, or reduce recycling time.

 

[78Staff]

I'm looking for faster recycling times... The PB-960 definitely reduces recycling time based on some YT video reviews I've seen, but they are comparing to standard AA battery flashes ie Nikon or Canon. I haven't found one that shows a comparison to a Godox with Li-ion battery though.

Here is one review example... testing begins around 2:20 mark.

 

[dabhand16]

Is that FP PB-960 not for use with the FP equivalent to the Godox AD360? For me there is no point in the review that compares apples with pears. If it was me, I'd be buying one or two more lithium batteries.

FWIW, recycling times can be reduced by reducing the flash power I rarely use mine at full power and the recycling time is zero once you get down to under1/4 power. Just instant flashes.

 

[Warren D]

I have 6 SB800's and no complaints. You should be able to find an aux battery pack (IIRC it holds 8 AA's) but I always use the 5th battery accessory with my SB800's and find the recycle times acceptable.

 

[dabhand16]

Just found these that might be of interest.

SB 910 user manual showing recycling times with Nikon external power sources. Note that they all use AA batteries and it appears that the flashes are spaced out between 30 and 120 seconds per flash, presumably to stop the thermal cut out from kicking in.

Nikon SB-910 - Manual (Page 123)

Nikon SB-910 User Manual • H –12, Tips on speedlight care and reference information, Specifi cations • Nikon For the car

www.manualsdir.com

Here is a forum discussion on exactly your question:

sb910 with a extetnal battery/Godox pb960

Hi guys, thinking of using a sb910 with a godox pb960. External battery. Has anyone used this combination ?

forum.nikonrumors.com

FWIW - I've hardly used my Nikon flashguns since I got my first Godox.

 

[dabhand16]

Just had a thought. IIRC the Godox TT685 (or Adorama FP equivalent) is likely to be cheaper than a Nikon SB910 and has an external power input. Problem solved?

https://www.adorama.com/fplfsmznk.html

 

[78Staff]

Is that FP PB-960 not for use with the FP equivalent to the Godox AD360? For me there is no point in the review that compares apples with pears. If it was me, I'd be buying one or two more lithium batteries.

FWIW, recycling times can be reduced by reducing the flash power I rarely use mine at full power and the recycling time is zero once you get down to under1/4 power. Just instant flashes.

Typically shooting at 1/128 - 1/32 range, but am not seeing zero recycle times though. Not sure about the AD360, I'm strictly looking at flashes I can use Better Beamer/MagBeam setup with, so no round heads. Buying more Lithium batteries only nets more capacity, not reduced recycle time (although I do have a couple extras .

 

[78Staff]

Just had a thought. IIRC the Godox TT685 (or Adorama FP equivalent) is likely to be cheaper than a Nikon SB910 and has an external power input. Problem solved?

https://www.adorama.com/fplfsmznk.html

Actually I had forgot about the 685... might be worth a look, thanks. I think it uses canon cable pinout so should be able to use the 960 with the right cable.

Looking to do a few (3-4 maybe) shot burst without losing flash, if that's possible. Going to do some more testing - really I need to figure out if the battery pack setup will net a tangible difference in recycle time vs just using the li-ion v860iii...

I've found that with a fresh battery, with the v860viii I can quickly fire off say 4-5 shots or so at reduced power 1/128 with no issues. But, if I try to do it again the next run of shots I might only get 2 or 3 out of the 5 where the flash fires. But if I wait say 30 seconds, I'm back to getting 5/5 again. If I am shooting at 1/64 or 1/32 it gets worse though, with less shots and longer waits required. I was hoping the ext pack would help there.

 

[78Staff]

Just found these that might be of interest.

SB 910 user manual showing recycling times with Nikon external power sources. Note that they all use AA batteries and it appears that the flashes are spaced out between 30 and 120 seconds per flash, presumably to stop the thermal cut out from kicking in.

Nikon SB-910 - Manual (Page 123)

Nikon SB-910 User Manual • H –12, Tips on speedlight care and reference information, Specifi cations • Nikon For the car

www.manualsdir.com

Here is a forum discussion on exactly your question:

sb910 with a extetnal battery/Godox pb960

Hi guys, thinking of using a sb910 with a godox pb960. External battery. Has anyone used this combination ?

forum.nikonrumors.com

FWIW - I've hardly used my Nikon flashguns since I got my first Godox.

Good links, thanks

 

[dabhand16]

Actually I had forgot about the 685... might be worth a look, thanks. I think it uses cannon cable pinout so should be able to use the 960 with the right cable.

Going to do some more testing - really I need to figure out if the battery pack setup will net a tangible difference in recycle time vs the li-ion v860iii...

Adorama should be able to tell you. The TT685 at $110 has to be a better buy than a used SB910 for around the same cost - and it will be compatible with all of your other kit.

EDIT: Just realised you don't want round heads, but left this in for info.

The Adorama equivalent to the Godox AD 180/360 might have faster recycling

GODOX PHOTO EQUIPMENT CO.,LTD Studio Flash AD360 AD180

GODOX is a professional photo equipment manufacturer. Products include studio lighting system and camera lighting system. +86-755-25736373

www.godox.com

Quote from link

* Professional Power Pack
Use lithium battery pack (11.1V/4500mAh)
AD180 and AD360 separately offer 900 and 450 full power flashes
AD180 recycles in 0.05-2.6 seconds & AD360 in 0.05-4.5 seconds

There are a lot of these units out there - especially Godox, so will be available used.

However the recycle times quoted look like the higher the power, the longer the time. As with any flash lower power will always give faster recycling so your next question has to be how often will you be using the flash at full power? I seem to recall that the Godox V860 should be able to do 10 fps at 1/32 power.

 

[dabhand16]

Just got my Fuji XT-4 and Pixapro equivalent to Godox V860ii to do 37 shots at 1/32 power at 15 fps before it slowed down. and that is probably a buffer thing.

300bps SD card

 

[78Staff]

Adorama should be able to tell you. The TT685 at $110 has to be a better buy than a used SB910 for around the same cost - and it will be compatible with all of your other kit.

...

However the recycle times quoted look like the higher the power, the longer the time. As with any flash lower power will always give faster recycling so your next question has to be how often will you be using the flash at full power? I seem to recall that the Godox V860 should be able to do 10 fps at 1/32 power.

Actually, yes in testing just now, when firing at 1/250 and 1/64 power, the v860 keeps up with my D850 in CH @ 9FPS no problem. But switching to HSS and shooting at 1/1600 for instance, it will keep up for one or two series of say 5-6 shots, but the next series it can't sustain and will miss shots. If I wait 30 seconds or so it seems to keep up again. So it mostly depends on how often I will fire off a series of shots, I suppose.

 

[dabhand16]

Yes - as I understand it, using HSS actually means the flash is firing pulses of light - almost continuous light - for a relatively long time. This has thermal and battery life issues.

 

[78Staff]

Well I talked to Adorama, who advised the FP-960 with AA powered flash would not improve HSS recycle times vs the li-ion models of the Godox/Flashpoint line. It will improve on any AA-powered flash, regardless of brand, but not vs the li-ion line like the v860/ZoomIII.

 

[Craig Yuill]

I stopped using flash for bird photography several years ago. One reason is the increase in dynamic range that modern sensors can record. I started doing bird photography when Ektachrome and Fujichrome, with their relatively-narrow DRs, we’re my main media for recording images. A Nikon SB-25 proved to be very useful at times. Another reason I stopped using flash is that some feel that flash may cause the birds to feel some distress. This is not a universally-held belief, but it is one I have been mindful of. I tend to rely on natural lighting, careful choice of background, and positioning of the head so that highlights can be seen in the birds’ eyes.

Others have stated they use fractional flash output. A flash that supports several fractional outputs could be a way to get results that you are looking for while bothering birds the least.

Good luck with deciding on a flash.

 

[Calson]

I agree with your going to the SB-800 or the SB-910. The user interface is much better with the SB-910 and it should not have the heat initiated shutdown found with the SB-900. When one of my SB-800 speedlights failed and I wanted to add another one my short list was a used SB-800 or a SB-910. A number of issues with the SB-5000 for use with my D810 and D850 that took it out of serious consideration. With a different camera the choice might be different. I ended up buying another SB-800 from someone on FredMiranda.

I prefer the smaller size of the SB-800 and it has plenty of power and supports every flash function with all Nikon DSLR and Mirrorless cameras. I have 3 of them and use them along with a couple of Quantum Qflash. The Qflash are the best one can buy for people and event photography but for wildlife and product photography I like using the SB-800 speedlights.

If planning on doing a multiflash setup then I would look at the speedlights from Yongnuo that cost considerably less but are Nikon compatible for wireless triggering.

 

[dabhand16]

Well I talked to Adorama, who advised the FP-960 with AA powered flash would not improve HSS recycle times vs the li-ion models of the Godox/Flashpoint line. It will improve on any AA-powered flash, regardless of brand, but not vs the li-ion line like the v860/ZoomIII.

Thought so. So you made the right choice with the V860iii in the first place! I'm not upgrading my 860iis as I have no need for the modelling light in spite of me shooting people a lot and I'm not sold on the V1 rotary dial also having press functions either, but for you I can see the advantages.