Audio recording challenges -- anybody used a blimp on camera or with wireless remote?

[Alistair]

Long story short is no - I ended up with a Zoom F3. It was much less expensive and offers a lot more value and functionality for the money with it's on-board 32bit recording capability. It doesn't need gain controls and provides phantom power to my Sennheiser 416. It's also smaller and easier to mount, but there's no mic holder. I'm using it in pass-through mode so audio is being recorded by the camera -- no post synching needed. So far it seems to work quite well.

I am very tempted by the F3. The only other contender for me is a Tascam X6 which also records 32 bit but also has inbuilt ambient mics and a 3.5mm input both of which I find useful. But the F3 seems to have slightly better quality preamps, is more robust and a lot more compact. Decisions.

 

[Garfield]

Nice setup @Garfield

Although it might prove a tad ungainly for me to handhold w/my Z9&400TC from a safari vehicle filming cheetah hunts, etc.

Have you tried it hand holding, if so how is the balance?

Hand holding might be doable for some...it all comes down to total weight, but it's not something I'd plan on doing. The Zoom F3 is quite small and reasonably light, but then you have to mount it, possibly using a cage, and add the mic and holder of course. It all adds up, but physically there's nothing to "get in the way" of shooting, provided the Zoom is mounted far enough forward and you use compact cables.

 

[Garfield]

I am very tempted by the F3. The only other contender for me is a Tascam X6 which also records 32 bit but also has inbuilt ambient mics and a 3.5mm input both of which I find useful. But the F3 seems to have slightly better quality preamps, is more robust and a lot more compact. Decisions.

Yes, I considered a larger recorder with built-in mics for ambient recordings but I didn't like the size and I carry a Zoom H1n for that -- I typically just overlay ambient sounds later in post since they're so hard to get at the time, and just concentrate on capturing the subject's sounds.

I'm still thinking about add the blimp and a parabolic dish mounted on a tripod plugged into the second channel on the F3 for the ultimate setup. Hmmm....

 

[uday592]

Long story short is no - I ended up with a Zoom F3. It was much less expensive and offers a lot more value and functionality for the money with it's on-board 32bit recording capability. It doesn't need gain controls and provides phantom power to my Sennheiser 416. It's also smaller and easier to mount, but there's no mic holder. I'm using it in pass-through mode so audio is being recorded by the camera -- no post synching needed. So far it seems to work quite well.

This is an awesome setup. So you are connecting the Zoom F3 to your camera and the Sennheiser 416 to the Zoom.
How are you mounting these on the camera.
Does this set up give good bird song recordings from 40 - 50ft.
Also how much does the F3 weigh?

 

[Nimi]

Long story short is no - I ended up with a Zoom F3. It was much less expensive and offers a lot more value and functionality for the money with it's on-board 32bit recording capability. It doesn't need gain controls and provides phantom power to my Sennheiser 416. It's also smaller and easier to mount, but there's no mic holder. I'm using it in pass-through mode so audio is being recorded by the camera -- no post synching needed. So far it seems to work quite well.

Love mine. I don't go into camera, otherwise similar setup. Works with all my mics.

 

[Garfield]

This is an awesome setup. So you are connecting the Zoom F3 to your camera and the Sennheiser 416 to the Zoom.
How are you mounting these on the camera.
Does this set up give good bird song recordings from 40 - 50ft.
Also how much does the F3 weigh?

The Sennheiser is mounted on a Smallrig shotgun microphone mount with cold-shoe base which in turn is mounted on a cold shoe on the right side of the Tilta cage.

The F3 has a 1/4-20 threaded hole on the bottom which is attached to a Smallrig NATO quick release monitor mount which is in turn clamped onto a short NATO rail screwed onto the Tilta cage. The 416 mic is connected to the F3's channel 1 using a short 1-foot long right-angle XLR cable I bought from Amazon and I use a 1/8" TRS cable connecting the line out from the F3 to the camera. Everything is powered by two AA batteries in the F3.

It's a pretty simple setup.

Shotgun mics are not intended to record sounds at distances -- for that you ideally need a parabolic dish. It will easily record birds within 50 feet but you may need to boost output in post -- I use a long shotgun for it's selectivity and sensitivity since birds can be very quiet.

The F3 weighs 8.5 oz with AA batteries.

 

[Calson]

I make use of a light stand to hold the sound recorder and one or more mics. The stand works well with both shotgun (with a blimp) and parabolic dish recording setups.

If I record with the camera's internal mics it is not difficult to use an application to overlay the audio from the recorder over the audio of the camera.

 

[Activert]

Thanks Garfield for this thread! I am also looking for a good sound quality mic and simple and easy way to use. And I am lost and I don’t know what to choose

 

[Garfield]

Thanks Garfield for this thread! I am also looking for a good sound quality mic and simple and easy way to use. And I am lost and I don’t know what to choose

Hey I'm just trying to figure things out too! Recording good wildlife audio may be tougher than getting the shot! I asked the owner of the YT Natural History Channel recently how he records audio in the field and he basically says he doesn't even try -- it's all added in post after the shoot! I think Nimi said that's pretty common too, but I still try my best to bring something usable home!

 

[Activert]

Hey I'm just trying to figure things out too! Recording good wildlife audio may be tougher than getting the shot! I asked the owner of the YT Natural History Channel recently how he records audio in the field and he basically says he doesn't even try -- it's all added in post after the shoot! I think Nimi said that's pretty common too, but I still try my best to bring something usable home!

Me too, I try to get everything in the field, and improve in post processing. I still have to read what members will post.
Thank you!

 

[uday592]

The Sennheiser is mounted on a Smallrig shotgun microphone mount with cold-shoe base which in turn is mounted on a cold shoe on the right side of the Tilta cage.

The F3 has a 1/4-20 threaded hole on the bottom which is attached to a Smallrig NATO quick release monitor mount which is in turn clamped onto a short NATO rail screwed onto the Tilta cage. The 416 mic is connected to the F3's channel 1 using a short 1-foot long right-angle XLR cable I bought from Amazon and I use a 1/8" TRS cable connecting the line out from the F3 to the camera. Everything is powered by two AA batteries in the F3.

It's a pretty simple setup.

Shotgun mics are not intended to record sounds at distances -- for that you ideally need a parabolic dish. It will easily record birds within 50 feet but you may need to boost output in post -- I use a long shotgun for it's selectivity and sensitivity since birds can be very quiet.

The F3 weighs 8.5 oz with AA batteries.

Thanks for the info. I mostly use the Nikon Z8 with 600 tc lens on a monopod as it is difficult to use tripod for video graphing small birds. Is there a simpler way to attach a preamp before the semmheiser microphone

 

[uday592]

Me too, I try to get everything in the field, and improve in post processing. I still have to read what members will post.
Thank you!

So adding audio in post requires precise synchronisation which may be difficult

 

[Nimi]

So adding audio in post requires precise synchronisation which may be difficult

Piece of cake. Record to external (mic to recorder) and internally (use camera's mic). All editors will allow you to synch automatically without timecode, then delete the internal track.

 

[Activert]

So adding audio in post requires precise synchronisation which may be difficult

Thanks for the info

 

[Garfield]

Is there a simpler way to attach a preamp before the semmheiser microphone

Well, "simple" is one of those "in the eye of the beholder" things. LOL Many modern shotgun mics have on-board (battery) power with built-in pre-amps and can work in any mirrorless camera. All you have to do is plug in the mic to the audio-in on the Z8. That lets you turn down the Z's (crappy) preamp and rely on the mic preamp. My Rode NTG supports this as does many others.

But my older Sennheiser 416 requires 48V phantom power (much more than the nominal ~5v the Z's put out on the record line) so I either need a external pre-amp that outputs phantom power like the F3, or I could get one of those battery powered XLR->TRS adapters and simply plug the output into the audi-in on the Z8. There are many options, each with their own pros and cons.

 

[Activert]

Piece of cake. Record to external (mic to recorder) and internally (use camera's mic). All editors will allow you to synch automatically without timecode, then delete the internal track.

So Nimi, if I have the Zoom H1N ( I bought it 4 years ago and hardly used it) can I use it to record externally the audio and with camera internal audio, i will be able to synch in video processing? Is the H1N considered good audio or should I upgrade? I am going to Newfounland this Summer and I like to take videos of one nesting colony of ocean birds. the area is always windy and wet in Summer. I really want to get good audio for the wildlife while I am shooting videos. What is best things to do in such conditions.
We are fortunate to have you on this forum , you are always there to help us. Big thank you

 

[Nimi]

The

So Nimi, if I have the Zoom H1N ( I bought it 4 years ago and hardly used it) can I use it to record externally the audio and with camera internal audio, i will be able to synch in video processing? Is the H1N considered good audio or should I upgrade? I am going to Newfounland this Summer and I like to take videos of one nesting colony of ocean birds. the area is always windy and wet in Summer. I really want to get good audio for the wildlife while I am shooting videos. What is best things to do in such conditions.
We are fortunate to have you on this forum , you are always there to help us. Big thank you

H1n is well regarded, for a $60 recorder+ built-in mics. I haven't used one, so I can't opine on it. I assume it's better than the internal one but it's as "entry level" as it gets and you're trying to record a difficult scene.

How close will your recoder + mic (assuming built-in) be to the colony?

In most likelihood, the recording will be a mess, and I'm sorry if I sound pessimistic. With that in mind, be prepared to overlay acquired bird sound on top of the footage. When you shoot, capture some footage of grass or trees moving in the wind, that will give context to noise-sound that can't be removed. Also, probably worthwhile to learn some basic editing on software like Adobe Audition with can really help with denoising.

As far as process, yes, record internally at the same time, but I don't think synchronisation will be important. There won't be many instances where you'll photograph a bird chirping close-up, for example, and have high quality enough sound. See the video above on how to synch. There are other tricks, like clapping loudly prior to shooting and using that to synch.

If you want to upgrade the audio and have better chance at capturing nature sounds, it's not crazy hard or expensive. The set up @Garfield has above is really really good. The F3 is an exceptional recorder, absolutely punching above its weight. And learn a sound software, as the sound modules within the video editors are very basic and your task is complex.

PS: Spend 20 minutes just focusing on sound, headphones on, walk around a little, wait for the wind to slow down, etc. That's probably the best sound you're going to acquire.

 

[Activert]

The

H1n is well regarded, for a $60 recorder+ built-in mics. I haven't used one, so I can't opine on it. I assume it's better than the internal one but it's as "entry level" as it gets and you're trying to record a difficult scene.

How close will your recoder + mic (assuming built-in) be to the colony?

In most likelihood, the recording will be a mess, and I'm sorry if I sound pessimistic. With that in mind, be prepared to overlay acquired bird sound on top of the footage. When you shoot, capture some footage of grass or trees moving in the wind, that will give context to noise-sound that can't be removed. Also, probably worthwhile to learn some basic editing on software like Adobe Audition with can really help with denoising.

As far as process, yes, record internally at the same time, but I don't think synchronisation will be important. There won't be many instances where you'll photograph a bird chirping close-up, for example, and have high quality enough sound. See the video above on how to synch. There are other tricks, like clapping loudly prior to shooting and using that to synch.

If you want to upgrade the audio and have better chance at capturing nature sounds, it's not crazy hard or expensive. The set up @Garfield has above is really really good. The F3 is an exceptional recorder, absolutely punching above its weight. And learn a sound software, as the sound modules within the video editors are very basic and your task is complex.

PS: Spend 20 minutes just focusing on sound, headphones on, walk around a little, wait for the wind to slow down, etc. That's probably the best sound you're going to acquire.

Thank you so much, Nimi. As always you are so quick with your well explained reply.
I will be close to the birds and last summer I was there at the same time and I could hear well their sound. However, all the videos I took was with the internal audio and I could more the wind than the sound of the birds.
i will follow your advice as you said by photographing the grass ( there is no tree there) . I will also look at Garfield set up and try to do like him. Thank you again
Lina

 

[uday592]

Well, "simple" is one of those "in the eye of the beholder" things. LOL Many modern shotgun mics have on-board (battery) power with built-in pre-amps and can work in any mirrorless camera. All you have to do is plug in the mic to the audio-in on the Z8. That lets you turn down the Z's (crappy) preamp and rely on the mic preamp. My Rode NTG supports this as does many others.

But my older Sennheiser 416 requires 48V phantom power (much more than the nominal ~5v the Z's put out on the record line) so I either need a external pre-amp that outputs phantom power like the F3, or I could get one of those battery powered XLR->TRS adapters and simply plug the output into the audi-in on the Z8. There are many options, each with their own pros and cons.

I may go with Zoom f3. It is compact and might work with monopod. Any opinion on using Zoom audio interface AMS24. It is very compact ut not sure it will be a good preamp.

 

[Activert]

Long story short is no - I ended up with a Zoom F3. It was much less expensive and offers a lot more value and functionality for the money with it's on-board 32bit recording capability. It doesn't need gain controls and provides phantom power to my Sennheiser 416. It's also smaller and easier to mount, but there's no mic holder. I'm using it in pass-through mode so audio is being recorded by the camera -- no post synching needed. So far it seems to work quite well.

Hi Garfield, I found your set up really good. I want to ask you about the cage, the Zoom F3, how much weight it adds to the camera? My bag is so heavy already and I at I am mostly hiking to get to the bird. iI have to consider the weight that I am adding. Thank you

 

[Nimi]

I may go with Zoom f3. It is compact and might work with monopod. Any opinion on using Zoom audio interface AMS24. It is very compact ut not sure it will be a good preamp.

I use it, but not in videography. Instrument to interface to computer for music track. In your case, it'll be mic to interface to camera? It should work fine, except it isnt built for the elements, so think about a case for it. The F3 acts as pre amp and 32bit recorder and is more rugged for field.