How to get multiple subjects in focus AND maintain image quality?

[SCoombs]

Below is example photo from my trip to the park yesterday.

Thi8s photo is a composite, because I simply could not get both ducks in focus. I was at the time shooting with a 500pf and went up to f11 to try to broaden the depth of field enough to make this work, but it wouldn't - there was just too much compression at 500mm. Going beyond f/11 would of course degrade image quality significantly from higher ISO, diffraction, even worse subject/background separation.

I decided to try to decrease that compression so I swapped to my 180-600 so I could use a lower focal length. This was not only not enough of a difference, but it also created a dynamic where to keep the subjects a decent size in the frame I had to move closer, which of course spooked the ducks, but more to the technical point here also kept making the depth of field more shallow as I lowered the zoom range to try increase depth of field.

So to ask a broader question: how can we get multiple animals in focus while maintaining good image quality? I've seen this sort of discussion before and the answers are frequently the obvious things I've already mentioned: aperture, focal length, subject distance. Repositioning yourself, if possible, so that the subjects are at a more similar distance from the camera, is also a possibility, though due to the terrain this was not really possible for the photo I've posted.

Yet what I have not really seen discussed is how get multiple subjects in focus while maintaining image quality. The biggest issue I have found when trying to do it is subject size/distance. If you're close enough the subjects are reasonably frame filling, it starts to get very, very difficult to get a good depth of field regardless of what settings you use.

You can only see EXIF info for this image if you are logged in.

 

[Calson]

Focus stacking is one option.

 

[Butlerkid]

Already discussed in

DoF - group animal portraits

I sometimes come across group portrait opportunities: a pair of owls, a mother bird and a chick, etc. Often, the two subjects are in slightly different planes of focus, so focusing on one's eye could render the other one OOF. With long (600mm to 800mm) focal lengths, the DoF is rather...

bcgforums.com

 

[bleirer]

Below is example photo from my trip to the park yesterday.

Thi8s photo is a composite, because I simply could not get both ducks in focus. I was at the time shooting with a 500pf and went up to f11 to try to broaden the depth of field enough to make this work, but it wouldn't - there was just too much compression at 500mm. Going beyond f/11 would of course degrade image quality significantly from higher ISO, diffraction, even worse subject/background separation.

I decided to try to decrease that compression so I swapped to my 180-600 so I could use a lower focal length. This was not only not enough of a difference, but it also created a dynamic where to keep the subjects a decent size in the frame I had to move closer, which of course spooked the ducks, but more to the technical point here also kept making the depth of field more shallow as I lowered the zoom range to try increase depth of field.

So to ask a broader question: how can we get multiple animals in focus while maintaining good image quality? I've seen this sort of discussion before and the answers are frequently the obvious things I've already mentioned: aperture, focal length, subject distance. Repositioning yourself, if possible, so that the subjects are at a more similar distance from the camera, is also a possibility, though due to the terrain this was not really possible for the photo I've posted.

Yet what I have not really seen discussed is how get multiple subjects in focus while maintaining image quality. The biggest issue I have found when trying to do it is subject size/distance. If you're close enough the subjects are reasonably frame filling, it starts to get very, very difficult to get a good depth of field regardless of what settings you use.
View attachment 86800

I think you laid out the challenges and possible solutions pretty well.

 

[DRwyoming]

Yet what I have not really seen discussed is how get multiple subjects in focus while maintaining image quality. The biggest issue I have found when trying to do it is subject size/distance. If you're close enough the subjects are reasonably frame filling, it starts to get very, very difficult to get a good depth of field regardless of what settings you use.

Yup, it sounds like you have it figured out. When magnification is high, whether in macro applications or long telephoto applications, DoF gets very shallow and often you can't stop down enough or the tradeoffs are too great when doing so to keep multiple subjects in sharp focus in a single shot.

Focus stacking for stationary subjects is one option and can be as simple as just two images, one focused on each subject's eyes and combined in post can work. It's real tough for frame filling action shots and then it often comes down to positioning and dumb luck that the action occurs with both or multiple subjects in the same focal plane or very close to it.

But there's no simple answer other than stopping down as far as you dare and then accepting backgrounds that are more in focus than you might like in cases where you can't reposition to get both (or multiple) subject's eyes all onto the same plane and same distance from the camera or very close to it.