Is this photo any good?

[mikemyers]

I took the following photo in Fellsmere, Florida a week ago. I had my Nikon D780 and the 70-300 "P" lens which I bought last year. The bird came flying out of a tree next to a small pond, flew away, then came back flying over my head. I had the Nikon in "burst" mode, while pressing on the back-button focus button the whole time. With "only" 300mm, the lens captured the image, using a small part of the file, shown below...




Questions - is this photo any good, or worthless?
I expect to buy a 500mm Nikon lens soon, but don't have it yet.

What might I have done to improve it?
(I can post the original .nef file here, if that would help.

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[mikemyers]

I guess I should never have posted this here. I don't yet have a 500 or 600mm lens, only my 300, and I've been using it for photographing flying birds even though the resulting image is quite pixelated

From what I read in this forum, and what Steve shows/writes, that is beyond my current capabilities, but I take the photos anyway. Most "people" like them. Better photographers probably feel I'm wasting my time, and theirs.

It's discouraging, thinking that for a thousand dollars I might conquer this kind of photography, which will still have a long learning curve, but maybe I shouldn't even bother.

To me, while it is NOTHING like what Steve shows us in this forum, in a small size, as posted above, I like it anyway.

 

[MatthewK]

If you’re happy with it, that’s all that matters, friend.

 

[JDG Photo]

Very good photo for 300mm and cropped. Post some photos with the subject filling more of the frame.

 

[Doomrider74]

Don't let anyone discourage you. That's a an excellent photo but, as others have said, you need to fill the frame more, either by using a longer lens or looking for opportunities to get closer. My experience with Ospreys is if you hang around unobtrusively for long enough, you will get those opportunities.

Also, having the attitude that the experience is way more important than the photograph is vital: Even if that photograph wins World Wildlife Photographer of the Year, the experience is still way more important, so enjoy it.

 

[John Navitsky]

I guess I should never have posted this here. I don't yet have a 500 or 600mm lens, only my 300, and I've been using it for photographing flying birds even though the resulting image is quite pixelated

From what I read in this forum, and what Steve shows/writes, that is beyond my current capabilities, but I take the photos anyway. Most "people" like them. Better photographers probably feel I'm wasting my time, and theirs.

It's discouraging, thinking that for a thousand dollars I might conquer this kind of photography, which will still have a long learning curve, but maybe I shouldn't even bother.

To me, while it is NOTHING like what Steve shows us in this forum, in a small size, as posted above, I like it anyway.

one thing i’ve found, and it applies to what gear you have, but it’s a more general principle is to figure out how to maximize the gear and situation you have.

so in this context, it might mean finding subject matter that is closer

i’m totally not opposed to taking shots that are too far away and occasionally it’ll work out, but i keep my expectations modest and for the most part i’m trying to figure out how to best use the gear i have with me and how to best maximize my current situation and to seek out and/or manipulate situations where i can be more successful

so a personal example i keep beating myself against a wall trying to capture shots in poor lighting and someone pointed out to me that i’m trying to get something out that was never really a possibility in the first place. i wanted a result the situation didn’t offer. which isn’t to say there aren’t cases where you want to try to take a shot when the odds are stacked against you, but just you need to be aware

basically the tl;dr is try to set yourself up for success

 

[Phil Seu]

Most of wildlife photography is finding the right situation. If your subject is too far away, it will never look great regardless of the equipment one uses or the skill/experience of the photographer. To get a great image which shows good detail, most people are surprised at how close you actually have to be to a relatively small subject like a raptor, even with the best pro lenses.

 

[mikemyers]

Very good photo for 300mm and cropped. Post some photos with the subject filling more of the frame.

As requested, a photo from a few seconds later:
(....but doesn't this exaggerate the lack of sharpness???)

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[mikemyers]

Also, having the attitude that the experience is way more important than the photograph is vital:

I have to agree with this - the more attempts I make, the better I get at following the bird with my camera.
The first few times were an absolute disaster, but this time I was able to follow the bird for the whole time it was in view.
It's (only) $1000 to buy the Nikon 200-500, which presumably will last a long time.
I'm 80. The older I get, the more difficult this is likely to get.
I should probably post here a lot more, and get feedback.

 

[jeffnles1]

Mike,
First please do not let anyone or any "influencer" discourage you. Enjoying nature photography is not an "arms race." Yes many of us have multiple thousands of dollars tied up in camera gear. Also, many of us have been buying, trading up and expanding our gear collection over several decades. Few of us went out and bought really expensive gear on day 1.

If the gear you have won't capture the kind of super close, feather detail, portrait shots of a tiny bird a half mile away, don't worry. There is an entire genre of wildlife photography that I tend to like and shoot a lot called environmental portraits (for lack of a better phrase). This is a wider angle view of the creature in its natural environment. Many times this type of photograph is far more interesting and impactful than the close up portrait. With the close up portrait, the viewer may marvel at the beauty of the creature and the details of it's body they would never see otherwise, with the environmental shot, often times, the viewer feels more of an emotional attachment and attraction to the creature. Sometimes this shot will show how real the daily struggle for survival is, sometimes it will show a bit of familiarity where the viewer will be looking for such a creature next time they are hiking through a local park or driving down a backcountry road. Sometimes it is even amazement "wow, I didn't know that lived around here.".

Sure, there are some things that more expensive gear (longer lenses, faster cameras, better dynamic range sensors, etc) can allow the photographer to better capture, but none of these are a prerequisite for capturing interesting and compelling photographs.

If your 300 lens turns out to be a little too short for small birds, go after dragonflies, butterflies, frogs, turtles and other woodland creatures which allow you to approach more closely. There are hundreds of thousands of photo opportunities out there for you with the gear you have today.

Please do go out and enjoy nature, capture the beauty you see around you and share that beauty with others so they, too, can appreciate it. After all, very few of us make money doing this and even fewer actually make a "feed the family" living from it. I do believe we all do; however, do it because we love being outside, we genuinely care about the flora and fauna around us and have a desire to see others get as excited about it as we do.

At the end of the day, it matters not what anyone says about one photo or another, are you accomplishing your goals with photography? Are you enjoying it? Do you feel a sense of satisfaction after a day in the field? If yes, keep on keeping on. If not, look at your goals and ask if they are the right ones for you.

Hope this helps.

Jeff.

by the way, nothing wrong with your Osprey photos.
js

 

[jeffnles1]

Michael.
This is one I shot a couple weeks back with a D7200 and Sigma 100-400mm Lens. Not a super expensive combo. The photo isn't great but shows what I was talking about with environmental shots. I was there to photograph the eclipse and heard the redwing blackbird singing off in the marsh. Took a quick photo and moved on. If I were really focused on the blackbird, I would probably have used a little wider angle and captured more of the marsh, especially if there was something interesting (fog, other blackbirds, interesting patterns on the water, etc.). Unfortunately, just a bunch of brown last year's cattails were here but it gives an idea of what I was talking about with gear that is not tens of thousands of dollars.

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[TurtleCat]

There are a lot of inexpensive options to get reach, too, if you consider third parties like the Tamron/Sigma 150-600 lenses. A lot of F mount lenses are going super cheap as well so bargains are all over the place.

As has been said multiple times, being outside and enjoying yourself is the prime reward. I post all sorts of pics on instagram and no one hardly ever looks at them but I don’t do it for social approval but because I like sharing. I don’t make money at it so why get worried about it?

 

[Cameron T]

I'm going to chip in on the non gear side, good or not is up to you. Did you enjoy it and like the photo? Then that's what matters. Wanting technical advice often gets mixed up with enjoying the hobby, and people are all over the spectrum on it too. Some people want high technical quality to consider an image good, some are okay with less IQ as long as the image evokes a good (or bad, depending on intent) feeling.

While I tend to want more technical quality, I've hit a level of 'good enough' for the most part, and focus more on being out for my mental health and fun than nailing perfect images.

 

[AlanB313]

I have to agree 100% about just finding what you enjoy about your photography. For me it is just as others have described, it is a part of experiencing nature in a way that helps me understand, and value the natural world. There is so much beauty all around us!

I noticed you live in Florida. When visiting relatives, I used to take pictures of terns, gulls, plovers, and other shorebirds on the beach in the early morning and get full frame pictures with my old d90 and an 18-105mm kit lens. Some of these (accidently) turned out great! These were on the beaches of Sanibel. The birds basically came to me...some even stayedput at the water's edge and just let me walk through them.

This is another strategy I've realized works well! Sit somewhere in the shadows, dressed in clothes that blend with your surroundings and let the wildlife get used to you being there. You'll have an easier time of filling your frame. This has worked for sparrows, towhees, and other small birds.

I since "graduated" to a d500. I still used my 18-105mm lens and was frustrated since the birds were dots in the photo. I got a 28-300mm that helped some. Next, I got a tamron 150-600mm g2 and was in heaven for a while.

But- and this may be true for you too-- it was quite heavy to carry on walks and hikes. And I'm 14 years younger than you. The 200-500 is heavier than the tamron 150-600mm. So think about how you'd use it and whether the weight is an issue.

I ended up with a lightweight prime lens, a 300mm f4 PF with a 1.4 TCiii. This is a very lightweight combo. But it is still only 420mm combined. I do however like the 300mm by itself for fast moving birds that are close. The f4 helps auto focus a lot.

Personally, I'd also consider a 500mm f5.6 PF in your situation. I did this about 9 mos ago, It is heavier than my 300mm/1.4TCiii combo, but very snappy with the AF and optically excellent. I wish I'd gone straight to this a long time ago.

For me, the most important thing I can do right now is improve my "fieldcraft". This means shooting at the right time of day (early, later afternoon), slowing down and letting wildlife come to me, learning how to program my camera buttons to help me choose the right AF and metering, and HAVING FUN! This is the most important.

Don't be discouraged. I'm a beginner and love learning this stuff. I just went out to document birds on a bioblitz and came back and was disappointed with my results. But I took the time to analyze what I did wrong...and still had a great time with good friends. I try to not compare myself with the other great photos I see here. Sometimes I post, mostly not. But I have found this a very welcoming place where I can learn and share a mutual interest with others.

Welcome!

 

[mikemyers]

Thank you VERY much for all the replies. I appreciate every one of them, especially the concept of getting in the practice is more important than the final image. My attitude has been that it's good for me just to follow a bird as I take photos, regardless of knowing the images will be "pixelated".

please do not let anyone or any "influencer" discourage you. Enjoying nature photography is not an "arms race." Yes many of us have multiple thousands of dollars tied up in camera gear. Also, many of us have been buying, trading up and expanding our gear collection over several decades. Few of us went out and bought really expensive gear on day 1.

I will continue to do the best I can, with what I've got. Throwing money at the issue may or may not be a good idea, especially so since a "higher" lens may be a primary concern for me.

I'll continue to thank the people in the other forum who tell me to ignore images for which I don't have the right equipment, and for that matter, I love my Osprey photos I posted here despite the lack of fine detail. Eventually I hope I improve at it.

 

[TurtleCat]

If you can handle a 3 pound lens than this might be a good option for you. https://usedphotopro.com/nikon-nikk...56-g-ed-vr-lens-una-07-9590-4-230465-b6fb0716

It meets your budget needs and will give you 33% more reach than what you have.

 

[mikemyers]

If the gear you have won't capture the kind of super close, feather detail, portrait shots of a tiny bird a half mile away, don't worry. There is an entire genre of wildlife photography that I tend to like and shoot a lot called environmental portraits (for lack of a better phrase). This is a wider angle view of the creature in its natural environment. Many times this type of photograph is far more interesting and impactful than the close up portrait. With the close up portrait, the viewer may marvel at the beauty of the creature and the details of it's body they would never see otherwise, with the environmental shot, often times, the viewer feels more of an emotional attachment and attraction to the creature. Sometimes this shot will show how real the daily struggle for survival is, sometimes it will show a bit of familiarity where the viewer will be looking for such a creature next time they are hiking through a local park or driving down a backcountry road. Sometimes it is even amazement "wow, I didn't know that lived around here.".

Don't be discouraged. I'm a beginner and love learning this stuff. I just went out to document birds on a bioblitz and came back and was disappointed with my results. But I took the time to analyze what I did wrong...and still had a great time with good friends. I try to not compare myself with the other great photos I see here. Sometimes I post, mostly not. But I have found this a very welcoming place where I can learn and share a mutual interest with others.

For now, I'm going to follow the advice in this forum, and not buy any new "gear". I'll just do the best I can with what I've got, meaning my D708 and Nikon 70-300 "p" lens.

I'll most likely start making frequent visits to Wakodahatchee Wetlands.

Wakodahatchee Wetlands - Visit Delray Beach

...

www.visitdelraybeach.org

I've already been there once, and still have over 100 photos to review. Maybe I'll post one or two of them here.

​

​

 

[Replytoken]

I'll most likely start making frequent visits to Wakodahatchee Wetlands.

It was a great place to photograph birds when I visited there a number of years ago. If you continue to visit frequently and work on your skills, you will be a better photographer and probably a better birder as you should get to know the habits of the birds there. If/when you do get a longer lens, you will have already done the hard work on skill craft and will enjoy the longer focal length that much more.

Have fun,

--Ken

 

[bleirer]

The thing about asking for a critique of a bird in flight against a plain sky background is that there is a limited number of things to critique. If there were other factors adding to a story being told, and evidence of habitat or environment to talk about or some elements as far as composition, then technical stuff would be slightly less important. So what it leaves to critique is limited. One asks is there an interesting wing position? Can you see eyes and are they sharp? Any catch lights? Is there good feather detail? Is it well exposed and well rendered? Is it sharp? I think you can answer a lot of those yourself. Some is gear, some is technique and sometimes software and know how to get the most out of the gear you do have.

 

[mikemyers]

Here's one more photo.
Minimal cropping.

What size should I use for uploading images to this server?

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[John Navitsky]

whatever size you did seemed to work pretty well. the limit is pretty small. i've gotten into the habit of sharing from flickr, using the "media" link feature

 

[AlanB313]

This page is helpful for answers on how to participate in the forum.... https://bcgforums.com/index.php?help/ . It's the help & how-to tab on the top of the webpage.

 

[Woody Meristem]

Here's one more photo.
Minimal cropping.

What size should I use for uploading images to this server?View attachment 88492

Now that's a very nice photo. One thing I'd recommend is using a lower ISO, you'll get better details in your image (my most used ISO is 1000); 1000 is usually fine unless it's quite darker than it was when either of your photos was taken. I'm a bit older than you are, so you're not finished taking good photos nor are you finished learning and getting better.

 

[Roybon]

The point is not to know if your photo is good or not, far too subjective in my eyes.
for me and a lot around I guess, Wildlife photography is :

1. Be in contact with Wildlife and observe / understand their behaviors
2. Take pictures of what you find good in your eyes AND enjoy taking this picture
3. Share with others by any means

The difficulty on this kind of photo is, for sure, the distance but also the background which is "flat".
I wish you to enjoy this wonderful hobby by spending time in the wild

 

[mikemyers]

First time at doing this - and the Nikon D780 can go to astronomical ISO values, still capturing a good image. The reason I used the high ISO was because I wanted to use a very high shutter speed, and that was the fastest fix I knew of.

I wasn't really out "in the wild"; these were taken at Wakodahatchee Wetlands, two hours from my home, with more birds than I could count. All were hand-held.

One more photo from that day:

(So, what trick can I use, to make the eye more visible, without making the image look fake??????)

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