Sell or keep z186 (after acquiring z600 pf)?

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I received the z186 in Dec 2023 and used it with a gimbal tripod and Z TC1.4 for about 5 months. The results were satisfying but the difficulty was the weight (for me). That's why I had to use a tripod and forgo handholding. There were some occasions when I missed taking shots because of inadequate tripod handling for the situation (e.g., aircraft in the high sky) and I couldn't take handhold shooting. So after reading all the positive and commendable sharing and discussion on the Z600 pf in a thread here, I plunged in and purchased the z600 pf in May for a good sale price. Use experience has confirmed the great performance with top IQ and now I can enjoy all shooting by handholding this combo: z8+z600+TC1.4 all the time. I even set up a nice shoulder strap for carrying and using the combo for distance sitings. And now my z186 stays on my gimbal tripod all the time without my z8. Hence I am pondering whether should I sell or keep my z186 now. Could I miss the point that I may need the z186 for better (operational) performance than the z600 in some specific situations (e.g., shoot from blind)? Or I could just keep the z186 for the sake of covering the focus range (I only have another zoom: 24-120)? I like and appreciate hearing your opinions, reasoning, and suggestions. P.S. If to sell, what price do you reckon for?
 
I received the z186 in Dec 2023 and used it with a gimbal tripod and Z TC1.4 for about 5 months. The results were satisfying but the difficulty was the weight (for me). That's why I had to use a tripod and forgo handholding. There were some occasions when I missed taking shots because of inadequate tripod handling for the situation (e.g., aircraft in the high sky) and I couldn't take handhold shooting. So after reading all the positive and commendable sharing and discussion on the Z600 pf in a thread here, I plunged in and purchased the z600 pf in May for a good sale price. Use experience has confirmed the great performance with top IQ and now I can enjoy all shooting by handholding this combo: z8+z600+TC1.4 all the time. I even set up a nice shoulder strap for carrying and using the combo for distance sitings. And now my z186 stays on my gimbal tripod all the time without my z8. Hence I am pondering whether should I sell or keep my z186 now. Could I miss the point that I may need the z186 for better (operational) performance than the z600 in some specific situations (e.g., shoot from blind)? Or I could just keep the z186 for the sake of covering the focus range (I only have another zoom: 24-120)? I like and appreciate hearing your opinions, reasoning, and suggestions. P.S. If to sell, what price do you reckon for?
How often have you used it since buying the 600? Prior, what % of your shots were at about 600?
 
The pertinent questions already posed by @Nimi . If you're like most people I'd bet you'll find that you've shot the 180-600 at 600mm most of the time. It also comes down to a question of preference. Do you prefer zoom or prime lenses. My own preference is zoom for landscape work and prime for wildlife. But it sounds like the weight is an issue to if you're not using the zoom range it seems like an easy decision. Whether or not to sell it depends on whether you mind having money sitting on the shelf gradually losing value.
 
I received the z186 in Dec 2023 and used it with a gimbal tripod and Z TC1.4 for about 5 months. The results were satisfying but the difficulty was the weight (for me). That's why I had to use a tripod and forgo handholding. There were some occasions when I missed taking shots because of inadequate tripod handling for the situation (e.g., aircraft in the high sky) and I couldn't take handhold shooting. So after reading all the positive and commendable sharing and discussion on the Z600 pf in a thread here, I plunged in and purchased the z600 pf in May for a good sale price. Use experience has confirmed the great performance with top IQ and now I can enjoy all shooting by handholding this combo: z8+z600+TC1.4 all the time. I even set up a nice shoulder strap for carrying and using the combo for distance sitings. And now my z186 stays on my gimbal tripod all the time without my z8. Hence I am pondering whether should I sell or keep my z186 now. Could I miss the point that I may need the z186 for better (operational) performance than the z600 in some specific situations (e.g., shoot from blind)? Or I could just keep the z186 for the sake of covering the focus range (I only have another zoom: 24-120)? I like and appreciate hearing your opinions, reasoning, and suggestions. P.S. If to sell, what price do you reckon for?
To me this is a question only you can answer. Are you planning any trips when the 180-600mm would be useful? For example, for Africa, Alaska, etc? One can also rent for a specific trip. How important to you are the funds you can get for this lens? Personally, I find the primes so much easier to use because of the low weight that haven't been tempted (so far) to get a zoom like the 180-600mm.
 
How often have you used it since buying the 600? Prior, what % of your shots were at about 600?
Since I got the z600 late in May, I have been using it almost all the time with my z8. But I also used my z6ii with z24-120 and z105. About 95% of I shot with z8+z186(+TC1.4) are at 600 (840). Of course 100% for z600 (+TC1.4). Now I just lack info about what situations make z186 more useful or mandated vs z600. But still have to consider the weight and tripod factors.
 
As for selling price, someone just sold one on this site for $1300. I checked KEH and MPB and neither one has any for sale at the moment, which means you may be able to get a bit more for yours.

If you were using your 180-600 at maximum focal length almost all the time (95% as you say) and you now have a 600, it seems to me there is no reason to keep the 180-600. If you have both you will always have to decide which one you are going to take out that day and it sounds like you would always choose the 600 PF.
 
The pertinent questions already posed by @Nimi . If you're like most people I'd bet you'll find that you've shot the 180-600 at 600mm most of the time. It also comes down to a question of preference. Do you prefer zoom or prime lenses. My own preference is zoom for landscape work and prime for wildlife. But it sounds like the weight is an issue to if you're not using the zoom range it seems like an easy decision. Whether or not to sell it depends on whether you mind having money sitting on the shelf gradually losing value.
Thanks, Dan. My preference is as yours. Indeed weight is a big issue for me so I have to use a tripod together with losing handholding joy and need. Still, if I didn't hear wrong about people choosing z186 instead of z600 to shoot in a blind, it's clear there's a need for z186 over z600. But then I still have to use a tripod, is it (with a tripod) no good to shoot in a blind? I am planning to have a short trip of shooting in a blind (my first) at a wildlife reserve. Which lens to go?

If I don't mind having $ sitting on the self gradually losing value, I wouldn't post this thread. :sick:
 
Thanks, Dan. My preference is as yours. Indeed weight is a big issue for me so I have to use a tripod together with losing handholding joy and need. Still, if I didn't hear wrong about people choosing z186 instead of z600 to shoot in a blind, it's clear there's a need for z186 over z600. But then I still have to use a tripod, is it (with a tripod) no good to shoot in a blind? I am planning to have a short trip of shooting in a blind (my first) at a wildlife reserve. Which lens to go?

If I don't mind having $ sitting on the self gradually losing value, I wouldn't post this thread. :sick:
I have shot only a few times in a blind and both times used a tripod. I have not heard that it is "no good to shoot with a tripod in a blind". The blinds I was in, one only had a narrow opening so the advantage of shooting handheld is largely negated since one is restricted in motion anyway.
 
As for selling price, someone just sold one on this site for $1300. I checked KEH and MPB and neither one has any for sale at the moment, which means you may be able to get a bit more for yours.

If you were using your 180-600 at maximum focal length almost all the time (95% as you say) and you now have a 600, it seems to me there is no reason to keep the 180-600. If you have both you will always have to decide which one you are going to take out that day and it sounds like you would always choose the 600 PF.
Thanks, Fred. I checked with MPB for a quote of $11xx. The quote is the amount I will receive with the cost of my z186 only (no other fee, shipping, etc.) I wonder what the cost (other than the gear) is for the one sold on this site for $1300.
 
I have shot only a few times in a blind and both times used a tripod. I have not heard that it is "no good to shoot with a tripod in a blind". The blinds I was in, one only had a narrow opening so the advantage of shooting handheld is largely negated since one is restricted in motion anyway.
Thanks, Ricardo. Were you using a zoom or prime (with tripod) in a blind? If the opening is narrow and small, how do you set up the height of your tripod (to make it exactly high to the hole)?
 
Thanks, Fred. I checked with MPB for a quote of $11xx. The quote is the amount I will receive with the cost of my z186 only (no other fee, shipping, etc.) I wonder what the cost (other than the gear) is for the one sold on this site for $1300.
Ok, I see the Sale on the site. $1300 is the net receipt with no other cost (unless there's a background deal).
 
Thanks, Dan. My preference is as yours. Indeed weight is a big issue for me so I have to use a tripod together with losing handholding joy and need. Still, if I didn't hear wrong about people choosing z186 instead of z600 to shoot in a blind, it's clear there's a need for z186 over z600. But then I still have to use a tripod, is it (with a tripod) no good to shoot in a blind? I am planning to have a short trip of shooting in a blind (my first) at a wildlife reserve. Which lens to go?

If I don't mind having $ sitting on the self gradually losing value, I wouldn't post this thread. :sick:
I went back and re-read your previous comments and see that you said you shoot almost all the time at 600mm w/1.4xTC. That should make the decision very easy. So it seems you either shoot a lot of small subjects or shoot from long range. What will you be shooting from the blind? Some of us believe that you can never have too much lens. Sometimes maybe just shoot the subject differently. Headshots, portraits, eyeballs, etc. if the whole subject won't fit in the frame. Also it simplifies life when we just come to terms with the fact that we're going to leave shots in the field. You're never going to make every shot of every opportunity.
 
Thanks, Ricardo. Were you using a zoom or prime (with tripod) in a blind? If the opening is narrow and small, how do you set up the height of your tripod (to make it exactly high to the hole)?
I am a "prime" shooter, my two main lenses are the 400mm f/4.5 (sometimes I add the 1.4TC) and the 800mm PF lens (although I also have and bring a 70-180mm which I rarely use). In the hide, I brought the 400mm and set it on my tripod at the height to match the hole and the lens was poking out of the hole. There was one or two times when a bird got too close to the lens but most of the time it worked perfectly. It was at a sharp-tailed grouse lek. Since we got there before the sun came up, it was quite dark when we started shooting so the f/4.5 on this lens was great (better than a zoom). However I could easily imagine other scenarios at other hides where the 180-600mm would be the preferred lens. Hard to know ahead of time. Having it on the tripod did facilitate me taking some video:
 
Thank you to everyone who replied to my inquiry. After digesting each of your responses of valuable info, comments/opinions, and even experience sharing, I decided to let the z186 go... I have registered it at NikonUSA.com. Does that mean the remaining warranty (~ 6 mo) won't be transferred to the new buyer?
 
Thank you to everyone who replied to my inquiry. After digesting each of your responses of valuable info, comments/opinions, and even experience sharing, I decided to let the z186 go... I have registered it at NikonUSA.com. Does that mean the remaining warranty (~ 6 mo) won't be transferred to the new buyer?
That's correct. Nikon warranties are not transferable. In theory it makes no difference whether you registered it or not the warranty only applies to the original purchaser.
 
z186…. Scratches head….never seen one. Finally figured it’s a lazy way of referring to z180-600. That being the case, it follows then that. the other lens is simply a 6PF or a 6 f/4.
I should get one to go with my 0.7-2 f2.8, the 5 PF, the 0.8-4….etc.
 
I received my 180-600 in March and in April got my hands on a 500pf, with the plan to only keep one. I have been shooting both since and trying to make that decision. While the question of zoom vs prime and the different experiences of using them is one that was on my mind initially, in practice I have rarely ever thought about it. When I have the 180-600 on the camera I will zoom when the opportunity arises. When I have the 500pf on there, I either change the field of view by moving or if that's not possible aim for different compositions which work with the field of view as I have it, with the key being that all of this happens naturally. In other words, I never really think about it and say, "I wish I had the zoom right now" - the photos just come as they present themselves.

So in making a decision that is similar to yours the zoom vs. prime has been a factor, but one that is smaller or I could say is in a broader context than I would have thought.

My initial concern with the 180-600 was in terms of IQ, so I have been doing a lot of comparisons IQ wise, above all. As expected, the 500pf is sharper, but not by much. Thus, when considering the zoom the more nuanced question I've been trying to sort through has been whether the ability to zoom on occasion is worth the difference in IQ I have noticed. This also comes down to cropping. The slightly better IQ of the prime stands up to cropping a bit better than the zoom, so if we assume I am shooting the same smaller subject with both, how much better results can I get from a crop with the prime, and is THAT worth the tradeoff?

A second factor which I have been considering is the AF. The AF on the 500 is definitely faster, but in a way it feels less smooth than the 180-600 and sometimes I wonder if it's almost a kind of disadvantage. For instance, recently trying to photograph swallows zooming around the water I had both lenses to compare and I had better luck getting focus with the 180-600. When I was younger we once saw the kind of extraordinarily expensive sports car on the road next to us that you don't normally see out on a regular road. He commented that when you drive one of them you had better make sure your wheel is pointed where you want to go before you hit the pedal because it is going to go there fast when you hit the gas. That's been my experience with the 500pf's faster AF. It's like it's so fast that if it doesn't quite get focus as the focusing element zooms "towards" a subject that it just flies past and keeps going and so it takes longer to come back to the subject. With the swallows, I had the lens' focusing element flying rapidly to bring them into focus while the birds were literally flying rapidly towards the lens and so in practice by the time the bird came to a certain distance from the camera the focus had already flown past that. With the slower 180-600, the slower speed almost felt like an advantage so that in those fractions of a second that the AF system was evaluating things the focus was just slow enough to still be ahead of the bird and be able to get it when it came into the right plane.

I've also been considering aperture. I have seen two kinds of reports about the 180-600: some people find their copy sharp at 6.3, while others have found it a bit soft there with dramatic improvement at 7.1. My copy is the latter. At 6.3 it's often disappointing, while at 7.1 it is much better. This means that I am deciding how much the 2/3 of a stop over the 500's 5.6 matters to me. If your 180-600 is sharp enough at 6.3 then this isn't a factor, but if it needs to be stopped down you may need to think about the difference between 7.1 on the zoom vs. 6.3 on the 600 and whether that matters to you enough that in practice it will make you want to avoid the 180-600.

I have been a bit longwinded here, but I suppose my main point was that at least for me, the question of whether the zoom is worth having around has wound up being much more nuanced than just the question of the value of the zoom. The decision is slightly different in that I am deciding which lens to keep and you seem to be deciding whether to keep both or only the prime, but the fundamental point is similar: the zoom itself hasn't provided as much of an advantage over the prime that it makes me think about it on its own terms when making my decision. It matters, but only in a broader context.
 
I received my 180-600 in March and in April got my hands on a 500pf, with the plan to only keep one. I have been shooting both since and trying to make that decision. While the question of zoom vs prime and the different experiences of using them is one that was on my mind initially, in practice I have rarely ever thought about it. When I have the 180-600 on the camera I will zoom when the opportunity arises. When I have the 500pf on there, I either change the field of view by moving or if that's not possible aim for different compositions which work with the field of view as I have it, with the key being that all of this happens naturally. In other words, I never really think about it and say, "I wish I had the zoom right now" - the photos just come as they present themselves.

So in making a decision that is similar to yours the zoom vs. prime has been a factor, but one that is smaller or I could say is in a broader context than I would have thought.

My initial concern with the 180-600 was in terms of IQ, so I have been doing a lot of comparisons IQ wise, above all. As expected, the 500pf is sharper, but not by much. Thus, when considering the zoom the more nuanced question I've been trying to sort through has been whether the ability to zoom on occasion is worth the difference in IQ I have noticed. This also comes down to cropping. The slightly better IQ of the prime stands up to cropping a bit better than the zoom, so if we assume I am shooting the same smaller subject with both, how much better results can I get from a crop with the prime, and is THAT worth the tradeoff?

A second factor which I have been considering is the AF. The AF on the 500 is definitely faster, but in a way it feels less smooth than the 180-600 and sometimes I wonder if it's almost a kind of disadvantage. For instance, recently trying to photograph swallows zooming around the water I had both lenses to compare and I had better luck getting focus with the 180-600. When I was younger we once saw the kind of extraordinarily expensive sports car on the road next to us that you don't normally see out on a regular road. He commented that when you drive one of them you had better make sure your wheel is pointed where you want to go before you hit the pedal because it is going to go there fast when you hit the gas. That's been my experience with the 500pf's faster AF. It's like it's so fast that if it doesn't quite get focus as the focusing element zooms "towards" a subject that it just flies past and keeps going and so it takes longer to come back to the subject. With the swallows, I had the lens' focusing element flying rapidly to bring them into focus while the birds were literally flying rapidly towards the lens and so in practice by the time the bird came to a certain distance from the camera the focus had already flown past that. With the slower 180-600, the slower speed almost felt like an advantage so that in those fractions of a second that the AF system was evaluating things the focus was just slow enough to still be ahead of the bird and be able to get it when it came into the right plane.

I've also been considering aperture. I have seen two kinds of reports about the 180-600: some people find their copy sharp at 6.3, while others have found it a bit soft there with dramatic improvement at 7.1. My copy is the latter. At 6.3 it's often disappointing, while at 7.1 it is much better. This means that I am deciding how much the 2/3 of a stop over the 500's 5.6 matters to me. If your 180-600 is sharp enough at 6.3 then this isn't a factor, but if it needs to be stopped down you may need to think about the difference between 7.1 on the zoom vs. 6.3 on the 600 and whether that matters to you enough that in practice it will make you want to avoid the 180-600.

I have been a bit longwinded here, but I suppose my main point was that at least for me, the question of whether the zoom is worth having around has wound up being much more nuanced than just the question of the value of the zoom. The decision is slightly different in that I am deciding which lens to keep and you seem to be deciding whether to keep both or only the prime, but the fundamental point is similar: the zoom itself hasn't provided as much of an advantage over the prime that it makes me think about it on its own terms when making my decision. It matters, but only in a broader context.
Well said, Shane. Appreciate your sharing of thoughts on my similar (not quite the same) decision to make. You provided quite a near-complete evaluation info for the z186 (zoom) vs z600pf (prime) matter. Based on that and another member's sharing of his useful case of both lenses (in another thread), my decision is now pending... Now looking back, my initial main issue is about the weight of z186 (too much for me). Somehow I managed to set it up with a gimbal tripod so I could comfortably and effectively handle the system with good results. But losing the joy and tackling special scenes by handholding made me acquire the z600pf. Now I feel your view of some advantages of the z186 is quite agreeable with my experience and other's usefulness view of z186 over z600 (in some cases) together may alter my eventual decision. Let's see.

BTW, what is your decision? keep prime, zoom, or both?
 
I have both…and am keeping both. I was using the 60pPF and the 100-400 on the second body…but the 180-600 is my choice unless backpack space for travel or hiking distance selects the lighter/smaller option. It all depends on what you shoot and how…but unless the 10p-180 range is important which for where I shoot mostly is important…the longer zoom is a better option for me.
 
I have both…and am keeping both. I was using the 60pPF and the 100-400 on the second body…but the 180-600 is my choice unless backpack space for travel or hiking distance selects the lighter/smaller option. It all depends on what you shoot and how…but unless the 10p-180 range is important which for where I shoot mostly is important…the longer zoom is a better option for me.
Good to hear. Do you handhold or tripod the 180-600?
 
What other lenses do you have? What are your main use cases? How much do you value zoom flexibility? How much do you care about weight?

In my personal use, I very rarely care for zooms. Only when traveling on vacation - as I may encounter situations where I cannot setup properly (zoom with my feet), I am constrained by size and weight, and I may not return to that place soon, if ever. In those situations - a zoom is handy to ensure I can get a shot.

When I'm shooting locally - it's a prime 99% of the time.

The 600PF + 186 overlap too much for my use case. I found the IQ of the 186 to be as good as the 600PF, so the only advantage was the weight savings. If the 600PF was going to be my "best" lens (IE no 400TC, 600TC, or 800PF) I would pair it with a 100-400 to cover the zoom range. then I would have two lightweight options with different purposes.

FWIW - I handhold all of my gear, 99% of the time. I consider the 186 to be one of the "heavier" lenses in the lineup, which takes away a bit of the element of "fun" when shooting. I generally break up my lenses into categories of light vs heavy and then decide what I need based on the activities surrounding the shooting.
 
What other lenses do you have? What are your main use cases? How much do you value zoom flexibility? How much do you care about weight?

In my personal use, I very rarely care for zooms. Only when traveling on vacation - as I may encounter situations where I cannot setup properly (zoom with my feet), I am constrained by size and weight, and I may not return to that place soon, if ever. In those situations - a zoom is handy to ensure I can get a shot.

When I'm shooting locally - it's a prime 99% of the time.

The 600PF + 186 overlap too much for my use case. I found the IQ of the 186 to be as good as the 600PF, so the only advantage was the weight savings. If the 600PF was going to be my "best" lens (IE no 400TC, 600TC, or 800PF) I would pair it with a 100-400 to cover the zoom range. then I would have two lightweight options with different purposes.

FWIW - I handhold all of my gear, 99% of the time. I consider the 186 to be one of the "heavier" lenses in the lineup, which takes away a bit of the element of "fun" when shooting. I generally break up my lenses into categories of light vs heavy and then decide what I need based on the activities surrounding the shooting.
Thank you for sharing your experience and personal preference for using photo gears. I also have z6ii, 24-120, MC105, and 20f1.8 (I like to explore other photo genre, e.g., landscape, night sky, Macro, etc.). I do value Zoom's flexibility but don't miss it much when shooting Prime. Very much do I care about and consider weight for it to be either handholding or tripod? This is a dilemma for me as I agree that 600pf and 186 overlap over focus length when 90%+ using 186 at 600mm. Still pondering...
 
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