Thinking about 5d Mark iv

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Durandall

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Hello there.
I am an aspiring wildlife photographer based in Denmark. I currently shoot with a Canon 77d, but right now I am finding that the ISO capabilities of the camera is holding me back. I use a 100-400 MK II for all my wildlife photography. The issue is the fact that a lot of wildlife here in Denmark is quite shy, so it’s not always easy to get close, and whilst I can sit in a hide for a long period of time waiting, it is not what I want to do every single time I’m out and about. I’m scared that if I buy a 5d mark iv, I will not be able to get close enough and that I’m gonna have to also buy a 1.4 tc and basically marry it to the lens. Do you think it would be worth the splurge on the 5d mark iv? Or do you think something else would work better for me? Switching systems is not an option and mirrorless is still way to expensive compared to DSLR here in Denmark.
Best regards
Durandall
 
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Durandall said:
Do you think it would be worth the splurge on the 5d mark iv?
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Tough call, as you imply the lower noise at higher ISO advantage of the full frame camera only applies when you can sufficiently fill the frame. If you end up cropping back to the APS-C sensor size of the 77D the noise performance is about the same (slight edge to the 5D Mk iv). And if you add a 1.4x TC for the 5D MK IV you'll still end up with a bit smaller subject size at the same working distance compared to the 77D with its 1.6x crop factor.

Basically, if you can fill the frame of the 5D MK IV then you'll likely be very happy with its low light performance but that might require a longer focal length lens, a TC as you mention(which will cost a stop of light and drive ISO up for the same aperture and shutter speed) or getting closer to your subjects but that's tough with a 400mm lens unless that wildlife is very large and approachable. If you end up having to crop to APS-C or further you won't really get a low light advantage with the full frame camera.

That said, there are other features of the 5D MK IV that make it an excellent camera and it's a big advantage for landscapes, astro, portraits and other kinds of work that don't require the kind of long lenses that wildlife often demands. But if low light wildlife, especially smaller or harder to approach wildlife is your primary focus you might not get the big performance jump you're hoping for by switching to full frame.
 
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DRwyoming said:
Tough call, as you imply the lower noise at higher ISO advantage of the full frame camera only applies when you can sufficiently fill the frame. If you end up cropping back to the APS-C sensor size of the 77D the noise performance is about the same (slight edge to the 5D Mk iv). And if you add a 1.4x TC for the 5D MK IV you'll still end up with a bit smaller subject size at the same working distance compared to the 77D with its 1.6x crop factor.

Basically, if you can fill the frame of the 5D MK IV then you'll likely be very happy with its low light performance but that might require a longer focal length lens, a TC as you mention(which will cost a stop of light and drive ISO up for the same aperture and shutter speed) or getting closer to your subjects but that's tough with a 400mm lens unless that wildlife is very large and approachable. If you end up having to crop to APS-C or further you won't really get a low light advantage with the full frame camera.

That said, there are other features of the 5D MK IV that make it an excellent camera and it's a big advantage for landscapes, astro, portraits and other kinds of work that don't require the kind of long lenses that wildlife often demands. But if low light wildlife, especially smaller or harder to approach wildlife is your primary focus you might not get the big performance jump you're hoping for by switching to full frame.
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Thanks for the answer, I would also like it for landscapes sometimes, even if that would require a new 24-70. I am also talking to one of my friends who has a 100-400 and full frame camera here, but his is an r6. It’s gonna be thought about for some time though
 
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Durandall said:
right now I am finding that the ISO capabilities of the camera is holding me back
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Are you using any of the recent AI noise reduction software? If you're not already using one of these programs, you might find that with them you can extend the acceptable ISO range with your current camera and lens. The results are better on some images than others, but there is generally an improvement over non-AI noise reduction. The cost is minimal compared to new bodies and lenses. Topaz Denoise AI, DxO PureRaw, and ON1 NoNoise AI all have free trials so you can see for yourself.
 
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Blue tit photo said:
If you can't get close enough I suggest either 80d or 90d. Yes their ISO is not the best but definitely not bad. On the plus side it is a crop sensor with either 24 or 30 MP respectively and the latter one can give you 10 fps. But that is my suggestion.
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I’ve looked at the 90d, but I just feel like I would be disappointed with its autofocus system. It’s basically the same as the one 77d, just with spot af and a joystick. That’s another reason for the 5d mark iv
 
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One idea would be to see if you can find a used 5Dmk4 at a good price and add a sigma 150-600 contemporary. At the long end it will be slightly longer than the canon zoom + multiplier, it will be 2/3rd of a stop brighter and a bit sharper (or at least no less sharp). Although the AF of the sigma is a bit slower, I don’t know there will be much of a difference versus the canon zoom + multiplier.
That way you get the FF advantage and get back the reach without some of the compromise.
 
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FB101 said:
One idea would be to see if you can find a used 5Dmk4 at a good price and add a sigma 150-600 contemporary. At the long end it will be slightly longer than the canon zoom + multiplier, it will be 2/3rd of a stop brighter and a bit sharper (or at least no less sharp). Although the AF of the sigma is a bit slower, I don’t know there will be much of a difference versus the canon zoom + multiplier.
That way you get the FF advantage and get back the reach without some of the compromise.
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Or he can get the 60-600 if he likes that one more, but it would be slower because of 6.3 versus f5.6 and the same with contemporary 150-600mm.
 
One problem is that the 5div is pretty aged in camera years at this point, introduced in 2016. Its still a good camera and still the most current of the 5d series, but Canon is moving on and committing to mirrorless and the RF lens mount all in. The RF cameras can use your EF lenses flawlessly with a Canon adapter.

That said, you can find a used 5div for pretty cheap. Also you can find a used Canon R for pretty cheap, which is also aged at this point, which uses the exact same sensor as the 5div but is 30 megapixel full frame mirrorless. For even less you can get a new Canon RP, which is now around $1000 US dollars new. It is 26 megapixels. Not as good as the R or 5div in my view, but a lot of camera for the money.

Also, a lot of introductions are expected/rumored by next spring that might make a wait and see attitude the right move. They could possibly have a new lower cost aps-c mirrorless. They are expected to have lower cost full frame mirrorless introductions also.

That said, the smart money bets on the glass. Cameras come and go, but lenses can last as you switch bodies. Canon has stopped developing EF lenses, switching to RF, but there is still plenty of quality new and used EF glass out there that works great on RF mount cameras with the adapter. The only small downside is when you have borh EF and RF lenses you have to keep swapping out the adapter. Plus the adapter adds about an inch to the lens length, not that big a deal. If you have ef-s lenses they will work on the mirrorless bodies, but only in crop mode.

Here is a useful review and recommendation site that I trust:

www.the-digital-picture.com

The-Digital-Picture.com features Mirrorless and DSLR Camera and Lens Reviews and Recommendations

Read clear, detailed camera and lens reviews and recommendations. Get the latest Canon and Sony news and learn from our photography tips. For over 20 years, The-Digital-Picture.com is all about you and making your images amazing!
www.the-digital-picture.com www.the-digital-picture.com

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I own a Canon 5D Mark IV (its my first digital camera going from film) and I cannot begin to describe shots I'm getting that I could never do with my Canon film cameras...Yes, I'm looking to mirrorless for my next camera body, but if you have Canon lenses already as I do (I have several thousands invested in my lenses) then sticking Canon, like me, has a huge value. The 1.4 TC has imperceptible image degradation, and only 1 stop cost, so don't rule that out. Here are two images from my 5D Mark IV....HANDHELD....one 300mm f2.8+1.4TC, the other 100-500mm f5.8+TC. Note that the snowy egret was shot hand held, leaning on a tree, with a mid seventies 300mm f2.8 plus 1.4 TC handheld and that lens has NO IS, and moderately cropped. The heron was photographed, hand held with the lens that has IS II, on a boat while I'm running the trolling motor to hold the boat in position during wind and current, boat moving up and down with small waves, hand held. This camera does an excellent job locking photos in AF Servo mode, good handheld techniques, rolling your finger on the shutter release ever so slowly, photo bursts, back button focus technique.
B45A1679 Snowy Egret.JPG
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GreatBlueHeron F8-0 1-2000 ISO 800.JPG
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