VR or Image Stabilization on Z9 with Nikon Z 600mm f6.3 pf lens

[joe43]

I just got my new Z 600mm pf and was testing it out this weekend. I had VR set to Sport on the Z9. I read Steve's guide on the Z9 about VR and IBIS but did not see any information about the proper VR camera setting if you are shooting at high shutter speeds like 1/1000 and higher. The lens itself has no VR switch like most F mount tele lenses.

At high shutter speeds should VR be set to Off , Normal or Sport on the Z9 with the 600mm f6,4 pf and other Z mount tele lenses?

(I was blown away by how sharp the images were that I took at my bird feeder in Wilde L and Auto Area with Bird detection.)

 

[NorthernFocus]

I just got my new Z 600mm pf and was testing it out this weekend. I had VR set to Sport on the Z9....(I was blown away by how sharp the images were that I took at my bird feeder in Wilde L and Auto Area with Bird detection.)

I think you answered your own question.

 

[JAJohnson]

I just got my new Z 600mm pf and was testing it out this weekend. I had VR set to Sport on the Z9. I read Steve's guide on the Z9 about VR and IBIS but did not see any information about the proper VR camera setting if you are shooting at high shutter speeds like 1/1000 and higher. The lens itself has no VR switch like most F mount tele lenses.

At high shutter speeds should VR be set to Off , Normal or Sport on the Z9 with the 600mm f6,4 pf and other Z mount tele lenses?

I think @Steve's advice in the video below is the best I’ve seen on this topic.

 

[MrFotoFool]

Nikon Z cameras work with VR on all the time, even at high shutter speed or (conversely) slow shutter speed. If you do a lot of moving subjects leave it on Sport; if you do mostly static subjects, leave it on Normal.

 

[EricKlees]

There hasn't been a need to turn off VR off if you are using Sport mode. There hasn't been a need since Sport mode was introduced years ago on DSLRs. With the Z9 and Z8 there is even less of a need. I shoot my Z9+800PF with VR Sport mode on 100% of the time and I shoot my SS as high as 1/8000 at times with zero issues

 

[Calson]

90% of the image stabilization is provided inside the camera. Nikon in the past has recommended turning VR off when using shutter speeds great than 1/500s. That was in part due to problems with autofocus speed. With the 80-400mm VR lens I could see in the viewfinder that image stabilization needed to finish before autofocus would start and this resulted in a significant delay and lost opportunities. With the Z9 at least that is not an issue.

Nikon has a few lenses that provide Synchro VR whereby the camera and lens stabilization are supposed to work in tandem. The new 28-400mm is one such lens. The 600mm PF and 600mm f/.4 TC are other lenses with this capability.

https://www.nikonimgsupport.com/eu/BV_article?articleNo=000066751&ctry=gb&lang=en_GB

 

[Fishboy1952]

I shoot the Z9 with the 600PF. Since I purchased that lens it has been married to that camera . I shoot from as slow as 1/100 up to 1/4000 shutter speed. VR is on all the time in Sport mode and I’ve never had a reason to turn it off.

 

[EricKlees]

90% of the image stabilization is provided inside the camera. Nikon in the past has recommended turning VR off when using shutter speeds great than 1/500s. That was in part due to problems with autofocus speed. With the 80-400mm VR lens I could see in the viewfinder that image stabilization needed to finish before autofocus would start and this resulted in a significant delay and lost opportunities. With the Z9 at least that is not an issue.

Nikon has a few lenses that provide Synchro VR whereby the camera and lens stabilization are supposed to work in tandem. The new 28-400mm is one such lens. The 600mm PF and 600mm f/.4 TC are other lenses with this capability.

https://www.nikonimgsupport.com/eu/BV_article?articleNo=000066751&ctry=gb&lang=en_GB

That recommendation is like 10 years old. That was the recommendation prior to the introduction of VR Sport. That hasn't been a thing for a long time.

 

[Len Shepherd]

That recommendation is like 10 years old. That was the recommendation prior to the introduction of VR Sport. That hasn't been a thing for a long time.

Thom Hogan has I understand upgraded his advice to 1/1000 as safe 80% of the time.
Like Nikon he points out that sometimes (with a very stable tripod etc) even sharper images still are possible with in lens VR switched off.

Is in lens VR is likely more efficient on shutterless and global bodies than previous body types?

A long time ago – probably more than 10 years – Nikon used to say that the VR mechanism sampled for shake every 1/1000 a second.
With improved electronics Z in lens VR (and some late F mount lenses) probably sample and correct distinctly faster than 1/1000 - with better stabilisation in the 1/1000 to 1/2000 range.

The actual total shutter open time on a DSLR is about 1/300 with 1/1000 achieved by a moving slit.
If older generation in lens VR lenses corrected at 1/1000 (Nikon did not seem to clarify) this made possible just three VR corrections to different parts of the moving image slit at 1/1000 and seems to be why the 1/500 guide came about.
There are probably fewer missed correction zones with a shuttleless camera than a moving slit, improving VR efficiency.

It is likely with a global shutter where the entire frame is recorded at once that there is a further VR gain with in-lens VR.

History aside, I find distinctly better VR correction at higher shutter speeds with current in lens VR Z lenses than with the original F mount 24–120 VR lens.

 

[EricKlees]

Thom Hogan has I understand upgraded his advice to 1/1000 as safe 80% of the time.
Like Nikon he points out that sometimes (with a very stable tripod etc) even sharper images still are possible with in lens VR switched off.

Is in lens VR is likely more efficient on shutterless and global bodies than previous body types?

A long time ago – probably more than 10 years – Nikon used to say that the VR mechanism sampled for shake every 1/1000 a second.
With improved electronics Z in lens VR (and some late F mount lenses) probably sample and correct distinctly faster than 1/1000 - with better stabilisation in the 1/1000 to 1/2000 range.

The actual total shutter open time on a DSLR is about 1/300 with 1/1000 achieved by a moving slit.
If older generation in lens VR lenses corrected at 1/1000 (Nikon did not seem to clarify) this made possible just three VR corrections to different parts of the moving image slit at 1/1000 and seems to be why the 1/500 guide came about.
There are probably fewer missed correction zones with a shuttleless camera than a moving slit, improving VR efficiency.

It is likely with a global shutter where the entire frame is recorded at once that there is a further VR gain with in-lens VR.

History aside, I find distinctly better VR correction at higher shutter speeds with current in lens VR Z lenses than with the original F mount 24–120 VR lens.

I don't listen to Thom Hogan. Not a fan for a few reasons. I go by my own experience and results. Many I know haven't turned off VR Sport in a long time. At any shutter speed with issues with results. Again, that's old thinking and completely unnecessary., but if you feel more comfortable turning off VR Sport at higher shutter speeds, then by all means

 

[joe43]

Thanks to all for the info. I plan on setting VR to Sport on my Z9 when using my Z mount 600mm. I still shoot with a D500 and D850 with F mount lenses and usually turn off VR at 1/1000 or faster to avoid conflicts between AF and VR which I have experienced.

 

[Fishboy1952]

Thanks to all for the info. I plan on setting VR to Sport on my Z9 when using my Z mount 600mm. I still shoot with a D500 and D850 with F mount lenses and usually turn off VR at 1/1000 or faster to avoid conflicts between AF and VR which I have experienced.

I think you should utilize whatever mode works for you. I started shooting long lenses and DSLRs around 2018. And I tried the various VR modes on my D500 that I primarily hand held. I found that turning VR off, while it might give a sharper image every now and then, also resulted in not as many keepers overall. I’m a little older and not as stable as I used to be. No VR was problematic in keeping the subject steady in the viewfinder. Going to normal VR resulted in the image jumping in the viewfinder. Sport mode seemed to be a good compromise. It was that way with DSLRs and I’ve found no reason to change with mirrorless.
So for me, VR sport is where I’m at 100% of the time. I get a higher keeper rate, in my opinion, regardless of the shutter speed. But as always, YMMV.

 

[Len Shepherd]

if you feel more comfortable turning off VR Sport at higher shutter speeds, then by all means

It is for me not a matter of "feeling comfortable":.
It is much more making initial tests with each new lens (it does not take long) to find out for my style of shooting when VR or VR Sport or VR off gets me my highest resolution images.
Similar initial testing with each metering method, each AF method, each tripod etc I find helps get higher quality images.

 

[EricKlees]

It is for me not a matter of "feeling comfortable":.
It is much more making initial tests with each new lens (it does not take long) to find out for my style of shooting when VR or VR Sport or VR off gets me my highest resolution images.
Similar initial testing with each metering method, each AF method, each tripod etc I find helps get higher quality images.

That was the point. That you feel comfortable that your tests or evaluations get better images with VR turned off at high shutter speeds since VR Sport was introduced.

Not many do, especially with mirrorless like the Z9 and Z8 since the AF works directly off the EVF and the more stable the subject in the EVF the better and more accurate the AF and subject detection work. Maybe since you use a tripod you can keep the subject a little more stake in the EVF. I shoot 100% hand held the last 4 years but prior with my D500 I was still shooting VR Sport

 

[Calson]

Steve Perry is recommending turning VR off with a shutter speed that exceeds 1/focal length of the lens. So a 800mm PF would have VR off with shutter speeds of 1/800s or faster and the 400mm lenses at 1/400s or faster.

Sport VR mode has been around for a very long time, only it was called Active mode. How well it works depends on which generation of lens VR is used and unlike the Expeed processors there is no way to know this.

 

[JAJohnson]

Earlier in the thread I posted @Steve’s video on this topic. From browsing the postings in this thread there’s a variety of points of view.

In the absence of guidelines from the manufacturers, Steve’s guidance seems like common sense and is my general approach. When shooting with telephoto lenses at fast shutter speeds (1/2000 and faster) I’m finding I get a somewhat greater percentage of sharper photos with VR off, but it’s a challenge to keep subjects in the viewfinder as well as I’d like. There have been days when I decide to leave VR on because subjects are jittery and fast moving or I’m shooting from an unstable position.

Each photographer has to find what works for them.

 

[Steve]

My advice kind of varies on VR shutter speeds depending on the lens, camera, etc. For Z series, I generally find it doesn't matter. I think that you may get a slightly higher keeper rate sometimes with it off at higher speeds (1/1000th + ) but it's not an all or nothing proposition. Usually, if I see suspected VR softness, it's just a frame here and there. Most of the time I don't bother to shut it off TBH - I just forget and it works out fine.

VR also gives you an edge with viewfinder stability. This not only makes it easier for you to keep on-target, it can also help subject detection as well since the image is more steady in the viewfinder. The bottom line is that any gains you get by turning it off are potentially negated by what you lose in viewfinder stability.

 

[Len Shepherd]

My advice kind of varies on VR shutter speeds depending on the lens, camera, etc. For Z series, I generally find it doesn't matter. I think that you may get a slightly higher keeper rate sometimes with it off at higher speeds (1/1000th + ) but it's not an all or nothing proposition. Usually, if I see suspected VR softness, it's just a frame here and there. Most of the time I don't bother to shut it off TBH - I just forget and it works out fine.

VR also gives you an edge with viewfinder stability. This not only makes it easier for you to keep on-target, it can also help subject detection as well since the image is more steady in the viewfinder. The bottom line is that any gains you get by turning it off are potentially negated by what you lose in viewfinder stability.

IMO a very good summary for using VR with in lens VR Z lenses.

I also consider it a good summary for the F mount 500mm PF.

 

[apakett]

My advice kind of varies on VR shutter speeds depending on the lens, camera, etc. For Z series, I generally find it doesn't matter. I think that you may get a slightly higher keeper rate sometimes with it off at higher speeds (1/1000th + ) but it's not an all or nothing proposition. Usually, if I see suspected VR softness, it's just a frame here and there. Most of the time I don't bother to shut it off TBH - I just forget and it works out fine.

VR also gives you an edge with viewfinder stability. This not only makes it easier for you to keep on-target, it can also help subject detection as well since the image is more steady in the viewfinder. The bottom line is that any gains you get by turning it off are potentially negated by what you lose in viewfinder stability.

The problem with turning VR off at high shutter speeds is forgetting to turn it back when done. It was easier when there was a VR switch on the lens.

 

[EricKlees]

The problem with turning VR off at high shutter speeds is forgetting to turn it back when done. It was easier when there was a VR switch on the lens.

Actually that's just another reason to never turn off VR Sport. With no issues leaving it on at any SS,

 

[Anjin San]

Mine is always on Sport and works just fine…it’s been on a sandbag and got great results with the 1.4TC at 1/50 and even got some no motion blur shots at 1/30. It’s never actually been on either. Tripod or monopod…it’s that easy to handhold. And as noted…the biggest problem with turning it off is…forgetting to turn it back on.

 

[Bevan]

I think @Steve's advice in the video below is the best I’ve seen on this topic.

Wonderful information Steve, thankyou.

 

[Bevan]

Thanks to all for the info. I plan on setting VR to Sport on my Z9 when using my Z mount 600mm. I still shoot with a D500 and D850 with F mount lenses and usually turn off VR at 1/1000 or faster to avoid conflicts between AF and VR which I have experienced.

I haven't moved up to the Z series yet and use my 500mm PF and D850 as my go to camera, I'm getting wicked results as far out as 35m on Kingfisher sized birds, I use a monopod and the VR is never off.

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