Z9 autofocus button assignment- opinions?

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jmurthy

jmurthy

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Short Background: As a new user of Z9, went shooting with it last evening- blown away!!! This is after coming from D500/D850 and I am still using 500PF with FTZ II ( I am loving that combo- avid hiker, less weight is better for me).

Specific question for BIF autofocus settings for users who already have some experience with it:

I found from my ONE evening of shooting BIF in low light, the Autoarea AF works fantastic for birds against less busy backgrounds, even in low light pushing 12800 (my max limit for AutoISO). As long as I have the bird in frame it latches on to the eye (animal, people detection on AUTO) even on birds that are underexposed as a silhouettes. Impressive!

On backgrounds that are busy or where there is not much of a contrast between subject and background, the camera needs a little push. AF is not bad by any means, but to capture certain fleeting moments, how can I help the camera, and squeeze every ounce of juice out of this system?

Please don't hesitate to correct me with these settings- hope I am not completely off:

I have set back button to AF- AF restricted to AF-C, AF area- single point (default) + 3D tracking; when I engage back button focus- engages 3D tracking as AF area mode; under focus menu (a7) set focus point persistence to auto (NIKON has a guide for AF modes in sports on their website for z9); also AF lock on for a blocked shot set as "erratic" for BIF at "3"; bird, animal people eye detection- is on AUTO
- Fn1- set AF area mode + AFON (set to AUTOarea AF)
- Fn2- set to AF area mode + AF-ON (single point)

I have to retrain my muscle memory- but my process would start as such
when you see a bird again a clean background- press fn1 to engage Autoarea AF , then engage back button focus, let go of Fn1- engages 3D tracking from the focus points that detected the bird from Autoarea AF and locates the eye and continues to track the bird. recomposing the shot keeps the birds eye in focus as long as it is in frame. If it goes out of frame, then press fn1 until you see it back in frame and af is engaged and then continue with back button focus like before.

when there is a bird against a busy or a less contrasty background, engage fn2 on the birds eye, press the back button AF and let go of the fn2 to start tracking the eye.

Sorry for the long post.
Does this make sense? love to hear thoughts, experiences. Eagerly await Steve's guide :)

Thank you

one image from last night processed from HIE* in NX studio on M1 MacBook Pro (surprisingly fast and stable)

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You might also try using Wide (L or S) as your primary AF point and, when you see the camera has recognized the subject, have another button set to engage 3D. I've been trying that and it works well for me,

I am using shutter release AF with Wide (L) selected as my AF area. When I press AF-On, it switches to 3D and picks up using the AF point the camera was using (AF persistence setting is on). That way, my initial lock is pretty easy - but the area not too large - and once I'm on the subject and can see subject recognition at work, I just press AF-On and can track all over the frame. I think it's easier than trying to get the small 3D area on the bird and I don't have to trust Auto not to pick the wrong thing :)

Still testing and playing though. I'm FAR from convinced my current method is the "best" method, but it might be something to try.
 
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Steve said:
You might also try using Wide (L or S) as your primary AF point and, when you see the camera has recognized the subject, have another button set to engage 3D. I've been trying that and it works well for me,

I am using shutter release AF with Wide (L) selected as my AF area. When I press AF-On, it switches to 3D and picks up using the AF point the camera was using (AF persistence setting is on). That way, my initial lock is pretty easy - but the area not too large - and once I'm on the subject and can see subject recognition at work, I just press AF-On and can track all over the frame. I think it's easier than trying to get the small 3D area on the bird and I don't have to trust Auto not to pick the wrong thing :)

Still testing and playing though. I'm FAR from convinced my current method is the "best" method, but it might be something to try.
Click to expand...
Thanks Steve... your input is so welcome to help some of us with the Z9 to get started with BIF Settings. Looking towards your continued testing and sharing your best practices.
 
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Steve said:
You might also try using Wide (L or S) as your primary AF point and, when you see the camera has recognized the subject, have another button set to engage 3D. I've been trying that and it works well for me,

I am using shutter release AF with Wide (L) selected as my AF area. When I press AF-On, it switches to 3D and picks up using the AF point the camera was using (AF persistence setting is on). That way, my initial lock is pretty easy - but the area not too large - and once I'm on the subject and can see subject recognition at work, I just press AF-On and can track all over the frame. I think it's easier than trying to get the small 3D area on the bird and I don't have to trust Auto not to pick the wrong thing :)

Still testing and playing though. I'm FAR from convinced my current method is the "best" method, but it might be something to try.
Click to expand...
I’m using the same setup, but, instead of 3D now, I am using Auto AF with 5 lock on. The 3D was jumping around more then if I just used Auto AF after acquiring the subject with Wide.
 
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Questions for jmurthy:

I am trying to set up my Z9 with your suggestions. I have 2 questions as these are unclear in your instructions:
1. Did you use the Custom Controls menu f2 to re-assign the AF-ON button to 3D or did you assign it to become AF-area mode + AF ON +3D tracking?
2. Did you set a6 AF activation to Shutter/AF-ON or did you set it to AF-ON only?
 
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jpawlan said:
Questions for jmurthy:

I am trying to set up my Z9 with your suggestions. I have 2 questions as these are unclear in your instructions:
1. Did you use the Custom Controls menu f2 to re-assign the AF-ON button to 3D or did you assign it to become AF-area mode + AF ON +3D tracking?
2. Did you set a6 AF activation to Shutter/AF-ON or did you set it to AF-ON only?
Click to expand...

Not sure if this was for me, I apologize if I'm stepping on toes :)

1. Yes, but I only have it assigned to switch the AF area, not to focus. I still focus using the half-press. Not sure I'm loving it yet, but time will tell.
2. Right this second, I'm set to Shutter/AF-on. Again, not sure I'm loving shutter release AF or not, but trying it for now.
 
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Steve said:
You might also try using Wide (L or S) as your primary AF point and, when you see the camera has recognized the subject, have another button set to engage 3D. I've been trying that and it works well for me,

I am using shutter release AF with Wide (L) selected as my AF area. When I press AF-On, it switches to 3D and picks up using the AF point the camera was using (AF persistence setting is on). That way, my initial lock is pretty easy - but the area not too large - and once I'm on the subject and can see subject recognition at work, I just press AF-On and can track all over the frame. I think it's easier than trying to get the small 3D area on the bird and I don't have to trust Auto not to pick the wrong thing :)

Still testing and playing though. I'm FAR from convinced my current method is the "best" method, but it might be something to try.
Click to expand...
Steve,
Thank you 🙏🏽
I greatly appreciate your wisdom and quick response! look forward to your detailed analysis at a later date.

I will definitely try the wide area L mode instead of autoarea for initial focus acquisition.
Have you noticed any advantage in using alternating focal points instead of “all” for focus acquisition?
 
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jpawlan said:
Questions for jmurthy:

I am trying to set up my Z9 with your suggestions. I have 2 questions as these are unclear in your instructions:
1. Did you use the Custom Controls menu f2 to re-assign the AF-ON button to 3D or did you assign it to become AF-area mode + AF ON +3D tracking?
2. Did you set a6 AF activation to Shutter/AF-ON or did you set it to AF-ON only?
Click to expand...

I have fn1 and fn2 assigned to Afarea mode +AF ON- that way , one button press changes the af area and engages AF-C; Fn1 engages wider area AF points for quick acquisition and the FN2 engages single point AF for precise focus. 3 D tracking in my case is on back button AF as default. i think i will be spending more time with 3D tracking once the initial focus is acquired by wide area or single point. ( this might change) . I have just realized i am a back button focus guy and its just easier for me. I will own and embrace that and move forward :)
 
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Darwin said:
I’m using the same setup, but, instead of 3D now, I am using Auto AF with 5 lock on. The 3D was jumping around more then if I just used Auto AF after acquiring the subject with Wide.
Click to expand...
thank you for that observation! will have to try that.. to confirm: blocked shot is on at 5 and subject set as erratic ?
 
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jmurthy said:
Steve,
Thank you 🙏🏽
I greatly appreciate your wisdom and quick response! look forward to your detailed analysis at a later date.

I will definitely try the wide area L mode instead of autoarea for initial focus acquisition.
Have you noticed any advantage in using alternating focal points instead of “all” for focus acquisition?
Click to expand...
That's only for you, not the camera :) It just makes it faster for you to move the AF areas around.
 
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I have set the following:
Shooting Bank A:
Shutter Release: AF-C, Single Pt - AF-ON
AF-ON: 3D Tracking, AF-ON, Auto subject
F1: Wide Area (L) , AF-ON, Auto subject
F2: Wide Area (S) , AF-ON, Auto subject
With this config, I can quickly release any of my programmed buttons and just use the shutter release to place focus point where I want it and focus (since subject tracking is not engaged in single-point, it effectively acts like ‘subject detection off’). It also works well as a way to pre-focus on a point. I may switch the the AF-ON and F1 settings.

I programmed ‘shooting bank’ to the record button. I can quickly change to another adjacent bank.
Shooting Bank B is setup for land scape photography. AF-S, Pin Point. Since it is AF-S, the programmed AF-ON defaults to the AF-S Pin Pt setting as well (from 3D Tracking). In this way it acts like ’back button auto focus), however the shutter release still focuses as well.

As mentioned by many others. It will take a lot of HANDS-ON time and practice/settings experimentation with the Z9 to determine the set-up best for my requirements and style of shooting.

Regards,
Marty
 
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Quick update:
moved to shutter button af wide- small with back button to 3Dtracking .. fn1 AFon SF wide and Fn2 to single point AF. “Blocked shot” set at 4 for erratic subject

Tried photographing swallows - with D500/850 i used to struggle to get 4-5 good shots out of 50-100, now i have about 60-70 sharp shots out of 156. the process of culling has become something like whether i like the wing position or is there a catch light in eye etc.
The bird eye detection did not work most of the time , but wide open, the pf is 5.6 lens and hence there was sufficient depth of field for the entire bird to remain sharp.


I had accidentally left the raw quality at lossless compression, but never had a problem with the buffer as the bursts were all short considering the erratic movement. Looking at the focus point s in NX studio, the tracking was pretty spot on if I could keep the bird in the frame.

Loving it!
 
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With three days of Z9 experience so far, I've found that Wide-Area L (sometimes S) is the best mode to start off with as long as the subject isn't too erratic where you can't accurately get the Wide-Area onto it. I use Wide-Area L on my shutter button. My AF-ON button is Auto AF. I was starting with Wide-Area and then would switch over to Auto as it started tracking just to allow me to be a little more sloppy with my tracking and have the Auto keep tracking over the entire frame.

However, I came to the realization yesterday that Wide-Area L and S will track over the entire frame but only for the length of time governed by the "Blocked Shot" setting. So at a low setting it will try to refocus under the Wide-Area outline fairly quickly and stop tracking the bird outside the Wide-Area. But with a high setting of 5 it will usually be long enough to keep tracking the bird for an average length BIF sequence/burst. That simplifies things a bit as you can just use Wide-Area with a setting of 5 and have it track full frame if the burst isn't too long.

I haven't found 3D to be all that useful. Auto AF as a starting point works only if the background is clean and distant. Wide-Area is much safer to start off in.

Every day I went out I learned a few more nuances from this camera. I'm sure some of my methods may continue to evolve after some more days out....hopefully with some good light as my first 3 days were shooting ISO 2000-6400 most of the time for just borderline BIF shutter speeds.
 
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arbitrage said:
With three days of Z9 experience so far, I've found that Wide-Area L (sometimes S) is the best mode to start off with as long as the subject isn't too erratic where you can't accurately get the Wide-Area onto it. I use Wide-Area L on my shutter button. My AF-ON button is Auto AF. I was starting with Wide-Area and then would switch over to Auto as it started tracking just to allow me to be a little more sloppy with my tracking and have the Auto keep tracking over the entire frame.

However, I came to the realization yesterday that Wide-Area L and S will track over the entire frame but only for the length of time governed by the "Blocked Shot" setting. So at a low setting it will try to refocus under the Wide-Area outline fairly quickly and stop tracking the bird outside the Wide-Area. But with a high setting of 5 it will usually be long enough to keep tracking the bird for an average length BIF sequence/burst. That simplifies things a bit as you can just use Wide-Area with a setting of 5 and have it track full frame if the burst isn't too long.

I haven't found 3D to be all that useful. Auto AF as a starting point works only if the background is clean and distant. Wide-Area is much safer to start off in.

Every day I went out I learned a few more nuances from this camera. I'm sure some of my methods may continue to evolve after some more days out....hopefully with some good light as my first 3 days were shooting ISO 2000-6400 most of the time for just borderline BIF shutter speeds.
Click to expand...
Thank you! that makes sense! when shooting some other birds in flight or taking off , i noticed that the birds eyes were completely off from the focus area but still remained very sharp for multiple frames, enough to choose the correct wing position-probably from my setting of blocked shot at 4 like you mentioned.
 
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Steve said:
Not sure if this was for me, I apologize if I'm stepping on toes :)

1. Yes, but I only have it assigned to switch the AF area, not to focus. I still focus using the half-press. Not sure I'm loving it yet, but time will tell.
2. Right this second, I'm set to Shutter/AF-on. Again, not sure I'm loving shutter release AF or not, but trying it for now.
Click to expand...
If you forego BBAF, what do you assign to that button?
 
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RichF said:
If you forego BBAF, what do you assign to that button?
Click to expand...

I can't speak for Steve, but I have my AF-ON set to "AF-Area" with Auto AF selected. So if I hold in AF-ON it performs Auto AF instead of my default AF mode that is Wide-Area AF (L) on my shutter button. I don't have it set to "AF Area + AF-ON". AF is still only performed once the shutter is half pressed. As long as the AF-ON button is being pushed the shutter does not override back to the default Wide-Area.

As mentioned previously, the Z9 seems to do best by starting tracking in Wide-Area (either size depending on subject) and then switching instantly to Auto (or 3D) in order to allow a bit more freedom in tracking the bird across the entire frame. That said, if the BIF burst is going to be short and you use a Blocked Shot Response of 5 you can just let the system track the bird around the frame in Wide-Area and don't need to switch to Auto (or 3D).
 
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Thanks everyone for sharing your settings! I'm gaming out exactly how I want to set this up on the Z9. Right now I'm:

AF-ON: Wide (L) w/animal or auto
Fn1: AF-ON 3D
Fn2: Recall shooting functions (this is very powerful - need to explore it more)
Fn3: Zoom, but for wildlife work will likely be another AF oriented setting
Lens button needs to be rolled into this of course.

Notes:
1) I'd really rather have a lot of these functions be a toggle (e.g. 3D) rather than having to hold the button down
2) The joystick button is _much_ easier to hit than the one on my D850, which almost always also moved the focus point when I tried to just depress the joystick
3) I do a lot of landscapery too, and would like to keep button assignments consistent between the banks to facilitate muscle memory speed during field work, but somehow I think I'll end up with some controls being diff for landscape/portrait work. The most important one here is wildlife that demands as-quick-as-possible response (AQAP? new acronym? haha)

Cheers!

...Dave...
 
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FWIW (probably not much;)) this is how my Z9 is setup for now....we shall see if I change this after next weekend.....

I shoot in full M changing my SS, aperture and ISO as needed and watching the histogram and live EVF preview.
AF-C, Release Priority, Blocked Shot : 5, Erratic. Eye-AF set to Animal
AF modes limited to Single, Wide-Area (S, L), Auto, 3D
AF limited to AF-C
Shutter button AF usually set to Wide-Area L or Wide-Area S
AF-ON set to Auto AF via the "AF Area" option
Joystick: Recall Shooting Function for my perched birds set to change SS: 1/320, ISO: Auto-ISO, AF Area: Single pt (I may change this to Wide-Area AF (S)), Blocked shot response 3, Steady
REC: Switch DX/FX
Fn1: Change AF Area modes
Fn2: SHOOT
Fn3: Go to top item My Menu (set to Battery but may set this to Subject detection settings)
OK: centers AF point
L-Fn: AF Area Mode changes to 3D

A few thoughts:
* I've been having some difficulty pushing the joystick straight in to bring up my RSF, if I don't concentrate I move AF point. So I tried setting my main AF mode on shutter to Auto and having the AF-ON do the Wide-Area. Set like that there is no AF point to move. However, the issue I ran into with that setup is there is no way to move my Single AF point when pushing in the joystick to bring up my RSF. If I leave Wide-Area on shutter and move the point off center then the Single point brought up by RSF goes to that position. So I think I'm going to have to just concentrate more on pushing the joystick straight in.

* Vertical shooting I have it save a different AF-Area mode and position. I have it on Wide-Area L positioned up in the frame as the only time I shoot vertical I'm shooting something like a close up heron where the head will be on the top 1/3 of the frame.

* So far I'm not really a fan of 3D. I prefer Auto. But I will give 3D a bit more testing time to see how it behaves. I found it jumping off even a straightforward perched subject with distant, grossly OOF background. It still may be okay to run instead of Auto for a BIF after initiation with Wide-Area.
 
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arbitrage said:
FWIW (probably not much;)) this is how my Z9 is setup for now....we shall see if I change this after next weekend.....

I shoot in full M changing my SS, aperture and ISO as needed and watching the histogram and live EVF preview.
AF-C, Release Priority, Blocked Shot : 5, Erratic. Eye-AF set to Animal
AF modes limited to Single, Wide-Area (S, L), Auto, 3D
AF limited to AF-C
Shutter button AF usually set to Wide-Area L or Wide-Area S
AF-ON set to Auto AF via the "AF Area" option
Joystick: Recall Shooting Function for my perched birds set to change SS: 1/320, ISO: Auto-ISO, AF Area: Single pt (I may change this to Wide-Area AF (S)), Blocked shot response 3, Steady
REC: Switch DX/FX
Fn1: Change AF Area modes
Fn2: SHOOT
Fn3: Go to top item My Menu (set to Battery but may set this to Subject detection settings)
OK: centers AF point
L-Fn: AF Area Mode changes to 3D

A few thoughts:
* I've been having some difficulty pushing the joystick straight in to bring up my RSF, if I don't concentrate I move AF point. So I tried setting my main AF mode on shutter to Auto and having the AF-ON do the Wide-Area. Set like that there is no AF point to move. However, the issue I ran into with that setup is there is no way to move my Single AF point when pushing in the joystick to bring up my RSF. If I leave Wide-Area on shutter and move the point off center then the Single point brought up by RSF goes to that position. So I think I'm going to have to just concentrate more on pushing the joystick straight in.

* Vertical shooting I have it save a different AF-Area mode and position. I have it on Wide-Area L positioned up in the frame as the only time I shoot vertical I'm shooting something like a close up heron where the head will be on the top 1/3 of the frame.

* So far I'm not really a fan of 3D. I prefer Auto. But I will give 3D a bit more testing time to see how it behaves. I found it jumping off even a straightforward perched subject with distant, grossly OOF background. It still may be okay to run instead of Auto for a BIF after initiation with Wide-Area.
Click to expand...
Thank you for this! Also, please let us know how well you like it after shooting these settings for a bit. And if you decide to change things and why!
 
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arbitrage said:
FWIW (probably not much;)) this is how my Z9 is setup for now....we shall see if I change this after next weekend.....

I shoot in full M changing my SS, aperture and ISO as needed and watching the histogram and live EVF preview.
AF-C, Release Priority, Blocked Shot : 5, Erratic. Eye-AF set to Animal
AF modes limited to Single, Wide-Area (S, L), Auto, 3D
AF limited to AF-C
Shutter button AF usually set to Wide-Area L or Wide-Area S
AF-ON set to Auto AF via the "AF Area" option
Joystick: Recall Shooting Function for my perched birds set to change SS: 1/320, ISO: Auto-ISO, AF Area: Single pt (I may change this to Wide-Area AF (S)), Blocked shot response 3, Steady
REC: Switch DX/FX
Fn1: Change AF Area modes
Fn2: SHOOT
Fn3: Go to top item My Menu (set to Battery but may set this to Subject detection settings)
OK: centers AF point
L-Fn: AF Area Mode changes to 3D

A few thoughts:
* I've been having some difficulty pushing the joystick straight in to bring up my RSF, if I don't concentrate I move AF point. So I tried setting my main AF mode on shutter to Auto and having the AF-ON do the Wide-Area. Set like that there is no AF point to move. However, the issue I ran into with that setup is there is no way to move my Single AF point when pushing in the joystick to bring up my RSF. If I leave Wide-Area on shutter and move the point off center then the Single point brought up by RSF goes to that position. So I think I'm going to have to just concentrate more on pushing the joystick straight in.

* Vertical shooting I have it save a different AF-Area mode and position. I have it on Wide-Area L positioned up in the frame as the only time I shoot vertical I'm shooting something like a close up heron where the head will be on the top 1/3 of the frame.

* So far I'm not really a fan of 3D. I prefer Auto. But I will give 3D a bit more testing time to see how it behaves. I found it jumping off even a straightforward perched subject with distant, grossly OOF background. It still may be okay to run instead of Auto for a BIF after initiation with Wide-Area.
Click to expand...

thank you!
i was wondering about the release option. i have it on focus + release- where the camera concentrates on getting the first frame in focus and then going to release mode thereafter. I suspect if the camera nails the correct focus in the first frame then the blocked shot setting of 5 will keep that focus going correctly for the subsequent frames at 20fps with the superior tracking ability of the z9. If it misfocuses the first frame then the sticky AF at setting 5 will keep it mis focussed for the subsequent frames on release. just a thought, but this option seems to be working well for me atleast for now and i havent experimented with many other options as yet.
 
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If I'm reading this correctly, Steve is using the shutter button for his focus and Wide AF as the mode, then the AF/ON button to switch to 3D once he has acquired the subject with Wide AF. As a back-button focuser my muscle memory has gone into spasm contemplating this and I'll be anxious to hear the outcome.
 
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