600mm PF with 1.4x TC versus 800mm PF

[Anjin San]

How low a shutter speed can you use with the 600 pf + TC on the Z8? The Z8 of course has better low light capabilities than my crop sensor dSLRs, so maybe the need to drop low is reduced.

With the beanbag and 20FBS bursts in Tanzania recently…I got about 15-20% sharp shots at 1/60 with the 600PF and 1.4. There was a little motion blur on the moving tongue of the lion drinking post sunset but the face and eyes were perfectly sharp. At 1/125 or 1/150 more than 50% sharp. Even handheld I think 1/125 would give some sharp images…but a lot depends on how steady one is or do you have a beanbag or monopod or tre or something (wife’s shoulder) to steady against.

 

[Butlerkid]

J'ai le 800 pf et le 400 f4.5, je pense que ça dépend si tu photographies souvent à 800 mm ou pas ? Je pense que pour les sujets en mouvement, le 800 seul sera bien meilleur et donnera un meilleur bokeh. Maintenant si vous photographiez principalement à 600 mm le 600 pf sera plus adapté.
Fabien

J'ai possédé tous les téléobjectifs Nikon Z. Tout dépend de ce que vous appréciez le plus. Focale, ouverture, poids, taille, MFD, etc. J'ai vendu mon 600PF et j'ai gardé le 800PF. Mais je pense que pour les sujets en mouvement, le 600 mm est un bien meilleur choix que le 800 mm. 600 mm facilite la mise en place du sujet dans le cadre. le 600 est également nettement plus court et plus léger, ce qui facilite sa prise en main et la poursuite de sujets plus rapides.

d'accord avec toi je parlais du 600 f6.3 avec le tc pour les sujets en mouvement, le tc va ralentir l'autofocus et l'objectif natif 800 pf sera meilleur

Désolé, j'utilise Google Translate car je suis français.

Quand je pense vraiment que le 800 pf sera meilleur que le 600 avec 1,4 pour le bif.

Avec mon 400 f4.5 et le tc 1.4 j'arrive à bien faire mais le 400 seul c'est vraiment mieux pas pour l'acquisition mais quand je compare la netteté et le nombre de photos ok c'est le jour et la nuit sur les oiseaux et c'était pareil sur le 500 pf avec le tc 1.4 iii.

Pour les oiseaux calmes, oui, le tc est très bien.

Fabien

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Thank you,
Karen

 

[glsmith9823]

Taken back in November 2023 @ Kennedy Space Center Launch Complex 40 with Nikon Z-8, 600mm PF 6.3 & TC 1.4 Distance roughly 2.8 miles

 

[macwalter]

I am new to the 600pf having just got it yesterday. However I can say that the bare lens is very sharp and also pretty good at 840mm. I have read articles claiming the 600pf with the 1.4tcz is as good if not better than the 800pf. I tend to doubt that, but the comments about size and weight and the ability to quickly get onto BIF are for me more important than the difference between the IQ of the 600pf with the 1.4tc and the 800pf. F9 is more of a concern but even there I don’t see myself trying long shots at 840mm in low light that often. I mainly handhold and don’t want to lug heavy gear around when the capabilities of the z mirrorless system is just so much better. I will also say anyone still using dslr gear for action photography are missing out in a big way. I resisted until last year until the z8 and I will never look back. The z lenses of the 400-600mm range are great and I have no dought the 800pf is as well but it along with the 180-600 are bigger than I want to use.

 

[jhallettbc]

I think I must have a bad copy of the Z 1.4TC. I have tested it on my 600 PF and there was a very noticeable loss of sharpness as well as contrast. The 600 PF was much better just using DX and getting 900. I would never use it with the 600 PF. I have also tried the TC with my Z70-200 and again and I can notice a definite loss of sharpness. Because almost everyone's experience is not the same, I think I need to test the TC against a new one at a camera store.

 

[Jadiehl]

This is a great and timely discussion! I am in the throws of trying to make the decision between the 600pf and the 800pf. Weight is a definite factor for my old frame and I do a lot of hand holding when I shoot. I know I would like the longer reach of the 800pf I am leaning to the 600pf and using the TC as necessary. Big $ decision for me on retiree budget!

 

[Larry S.]

I’ve had success (for my purposes) with the 600PF + Z8/9 in DX mode. I keep the f/6.3 and prefer this to shooting at f/9 with the 1.4TC. The 800PF is certainly the top performance option here but “needs vs. wants” might be worth considering. This nuthatch is fine for my use… 900mm in DX mode + large crop. It’s easy to get hung up on the 45MPs available in the Z8/9s. Look at the incredible images in this forum from D500s, D5&6s and other mid 20MP cameras.

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[Larry S.]

I am new to the 600pf having just got it yesterday. However I can say that the bare lens is very sharp and also pretty good at 840mm. I have read articles claiming the 600pf with the 1.4tcz is as good if not better than the 800pf. I tend to doubt that, but the comments about size and weight and the ability to quickly get onto BIF are for me more important than the difference between the IQ of the 600pf with the 1.4tc and the 800pf. F9 is more of a concern but even there I don’t see myself trying long shots at 840mm in low light that often. I mainly handhold and don’t want to lug heavy gear around when the capabilities of the z mirrorless system is just so much better. I will also say anyone still using dslr gear for action photography are missing out in a big way. I resisted until last year until the z8 and I will never look back. The z lenses of the 400-600mm range are great and I have no dought the 800pf is as well but it along with the 180-600 are bigger than I want to use.

Your comments are spot on. I also do not like the thought of lugging a longer heavier lens.

 

[TomSavage]

One point about the use of either the 600PF or the 800PF - I don't have the 600 but I have the 800PF. To tell you the truth, for shooting small BOP (birds on perch) I almost always have the 1.4 TC attached to the 800PF. It is rarely too much focal length. BIF is another story - locating the target at 1120mm is tough to do and the autofocus seems a little slower. Sometimes you can get surprised. The attached picture of the Elegant Trogon is a vertical crop of a horizontal frame. I had to back up a few steps to get it all in but the Trogon is not a small bird. (I was too excited to remember to rotate the camera on the monopod.) Actually, I mostly stick with perched birds. If I'm going after BIF I take off the TC or use the 500PF with or without the 1.4TCIII. The Yellow-eyed Junco is a 3267x2178 crop out of 8256x5504 original before reducing for posting. The Trogon is a 3369x5504 crop before reducing. Both at 1120mm focal length and wide open (F9).

 

[ajrmd]

One point about the use of either the 600PF or the 800PF - I don't have the 600 but I have the 800PF. To tell you the truth, for shooting small BOP (birds on perch) I almost always have the 1.4 TC attached to the 800PF. It is rarely too much focal length. BIF is another story - locating the target at 1120mm is tough to do and the autofocus seems a little slower. Sometimes you can get surprised. The attached picture of the Elegant Trogon is a vertical crop of a horizontal frame. I had to back up a few steps to get it all in but the Trogon is not a small bird. (I was too excited to remember to rotate the camera on the monopod.) Actually, I mostly stick with perched birds. If I'm going after BIF I take off the TC or use the 500PF with or without the 1.4TCIII. The Yellow-eyed Junco is a 3267x2178 crop out of 8256x5504 original before reducing for posting. The Trogon is a 3369x5504 crop before reducing. Both at 1120mm focal length and wide open (F9).

I think you hinted at a couple of important points, namely choose the lens where you'll be shooting most of the time. Quite candidly, I don't want to be fumbling with TC's anymore, increasing the likelihood of dust, potentially taking a penalty on AF speed, loss of contrast, etc. To me, the 600 f/4 TC is a brilliant lens and it has the optical fortitude and aperture to effectively use the TC. I don't have that same opinion of the 600 PF and while it is an amazing lens, in terms of size, weight, IQ, etc. if I had to be shooting at a base of f/9 it wouldn't work in my location. Today, I was shooting osprey in mixed light and to achieve a Tv 1/3200, I was shooting wide open at ISO's beginning at 6400 and ranging between 2000-6400. Then I was shooting warblers and other passerines in the shade which is another ballgame. I would have much preferred the 400 f/2.8 if I were planning on a TC as it would have been useable (not that I could afford it.) For some, pushing another stop + is not always an option.

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[macwalter]

This is a great and timely discussion! I am in the throws of trying to make the decision between the 600pf and the 800pf. Weight is a definite factor for my old frame and I do a lot of hand holding when I shoot. I know I would like the longer reach of the 800pf I am leaning to the 600pf and using the TC as necessary. Big $ decision for me on retiree budget!

I had the same issues. I went with the 600pf. So far I love it. It does fine with the 1.4tc just remember you start at f9 so no doubt you can get a sharper image at 800mm with the 800pf but it is much bigger and heavier and you won’t be handholding it much. I mainly handhold and I am 76.