Nikkor 28-400mm Announced
- Thread starter fcotterill
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)Chris K
Well-known member
At some point “professional” became a synonym for “good”. A “pro lens” or a “pro job”. I think that’s the crux of this problem.
You can work for hire but not produce good results. I certainly didn’t do half the job I can do now on my first paid shoot.
You can also produce good results without profit motive. (Reference: the majority of this forum!)
The 28-400 will probably produce results for landscapes that look good up to moderate print sizes, like the 24-200. And for the vast majority of applications, that will be good enough.
eaj101
Well-known member
I don't climb big rocks anymore, but the experiences help me to understand @fcotterill 's Galen Rowell comment. When I started my only camera that I took on climbs was a Rollei 35 (I still miss that camera). A little bigger than a pack of cigarettes. Later it was an Olympus XA (Smaller than a pack of cigarettes. I still have it). Galen's early climbing/running rig was either a Nikon FE or FM2, a 20mm UD lens and a 75-150 Series E 'consumer lens' ("just use f8. the images are great!" he said). So I definitely see the appeal of the 28-400, and the tradeoffs inherent in the design are manageable. If you factor in cost increases from inflation in your thinking this lens is seriously inexpensive, as well.
Galen carried an 80-200f2.8 and an F4 as well if he could, but he didn't let the lack of 'pro' lenses stop his shooting. If you look at his Mountain Light book you'll see (in addition to some stunning images) that many of the shots were taken with the lightest and smallest (and often inexpensive) gear he could find. Look at his dawn shot from the top of Fitzroy if you wonder if it's doable.
As much as I appreciate Nikon's new lenses, especially the long glass, I really wish Nikon would issue a series of wide angle primes like the old AIS and D series lenses - the 20mm f2.8. 24mm f2.8, and 35mm f2 in particular. They were tiny, sharp, and you could hammer nails with them
Drop one in your pocket as you put on your rope...
Galen carried an 80-200f2.8 and an F4 as well if he could, but he didn't let the lack of 'pro' lenses stop his shooting. If you look at his Mountain Light book you'll see (in addition to some stunning images) that many of the shots were taken with the lightest and smallest (and often inexpensive) gear he could find. Look at his dawn shot from the top of Fitzroy if you wonder if it's doable.
As much as I appreciate Nikon's new lenses, especially the long glass, I really wish Nikon would issue a series of wide angle primes like the old AIS and D series lenses - the 20mm f2.8. 24mm f2.8, and 35mm f2 in particular. They were tiny, sharp, and you could hammer nails with them
Drop one in your pocket as you put on your rope...
fcotterill
Well-known member
In its design, uses, and also trade offs, the f mount 28-300 f3.5/5.6G is probably the most similar high ratio zoom to this Z 28-400, but it was heavier and the F mount architecture likely increased the trade offs in its design.
The design of every lens is a compromise, the compact, high Ratio Zooms especially. In a recent interview, a Nikon Executive described how their engineers invest much effort in the optimal design of the company's kit lenses, because:
“Kit lenses are the lenses that customers purchase along with a camera body, and they need to make a strong first impression and provide versatility for various uses while being affordable, lightweight, and compact........The development of kit lenses involves the challenge of finding the delicate balance between performance, price, size, and production efficiency.”
petapixel.com
However, Nikon has a distinguished history of high quality kit zooms through the DSLR era. Satisfactory performance at the price, and back in the day the 18-55 and 18-200 surprised me..... Sharp images with good rendering on the D7200 and D500.
The design of every lens is a compromise, the compact, high Ratio Zooms especially. In a recent interview, a Nikon Executive described how their engineers invest much effort in the optimal design of the company's kit lenses, because:
“Kit lenses are the lenses that customers purchase along with a camera body, and they need to make a strong first impression and provide versatility for various uses while being affordable, lightweight, and compact........The development of kit lenses involves the challenge of finding the delicate balance between performance, price, size, and production efficiency.”
Nikon Talks Nikkor Z, the Challenge of Kit Zooms, and Dream Lenses
Nikon on its lenses, Z mount, and advancing technology.
petapixel.com
However, Nikon has a distinguished history of high quality kit zooms through the DSLR era. Satisfactory performance at the price, and back in the day the 18-55 and 18-200 surprised me..... Sharp images with good rendering on the D7200 and D500.
AF-S NIKKOR 28-300mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR-主な仕様 | NIKKORレンズ | ニコンイメージング
ニコンのフルサイズフォーマットNIKKORレンズ「AF-S NIKKOR 28-300mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR」の製品ページ。カメラ、レンズ、アクセサリーなどの製品特長、主な仕様、撮影サンプル、関連製品に関する情報も。
www.nikon-image.com
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While none of us can be sure of quality in advance of the lens being released on about 18th of April, the original 18-200 DX that I owned could well be a forerunner.
The first batch in 2006 sometimes said to have been 30,000 sold out in Japan in two weeks. Nikon set up a new overseas factory to cope with demand, it went onto sell over 2 million copies, and it was on backorder for a full two years.
Stopped down to f8 It was perfectly capable of delivering good quality images from 100 ISO slide film, it was compact and light and delivered what a mass market wanted.
The 28-400 will take good pictures over a very wide zoom range at a price many are relatively able to pay.
With the coming of the Z mount and optical improvements over 17 years since the 18-200 I expect relatively good 24×36 performance.
I will probably wait until either Black Friday or the January sales as I think the launch price in the UK at £1399 is a little on the high side
fcotterill
Well-known member
Nikon followed up the first model with the 18-200 VR II DX in 2009, and the 28-300 FX the year after. Their optical designs are very close.
Neither zoom was likely to be used on film cameras, particularly any DX lens, but Nikon certainly sold many tens of thousands of copies, when DSLR sales were climbing.
Nikon's MTF shows the new Z 28-400 outperforming the F mount FX 28-300, so it will be interesting to see how it compares to the 100-400 S series
Neither zoom was likely to be used on film cameras, particularly any DX lens, but Nikon certainly sold many tens of thousands of copies, when DSLR sales were climbing.
Nikon's MTF shows the new Z 28-400 outperforming the F mount FX 28-300, so it will be interesting to see how it compares to the 100-400 S series
NIKKOR Z 28-400mm f/4-8 VR | Z mount Lenses | Nikon Consumer
imaging.nikon.com
AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR II-主な仕様 | NIKKORレンズ | ニコンイメージング
ニコンのAPS-CサイズフォーマットNIKKORレンズ「AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR II」の製品ページ。カメラ、レンズ、アクセサリーなどの製品特長、主な仕様、撮影サンプル、関連製品に関する情報も。
www.nikon-image.com
AF-S NIKKOR 28-300mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR-主な仕様 | NIKKORレンズ | ニコンイメージング
ニコンのフルサイズフォーマットNIKKORレンズ「AF-S NIKKOR 28-300mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR」の製品ページ。カメラ、レンズ、アクセサリーなどの製品特長、主な仕様、撮影サンプル、関連製品に関する情報も。
www.nikon-image.com
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I agree. Good on Nikon for developing a product which will address a range of styles and needs. This lens will produce good photos and I expect it to be quite popular.
I agree…this is clearly designed as a light travel mostly lens but with enough reach to get decent good enough shots of wildlife for screen or prints say up to 16x20…and is designed to be a single lens user thing, although I agree that 28 really isn’t wide enough for travel and pairing with a 14-30 makes a nice 2 lens kit for those users.
fcotterill
Well-known member
Nikon Z 28-400mm Preview: The Best Lens for Travel Photography
The new Nikon Z 28-400mm f4-8 is an incredible lens that travel photographers will really love. See why in our preview.
www.thephoblographer.com
Nikon Eye is a useful site for the latest news
Just announced: New Nikkor 28-400mm lens! – NikonEye.com
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Calson
Well-known member
When I traveled around central Europe I took the 28-300mm lens and it was great. It was only 1.6 ounces heavier than the new 28-400mm lens and it also used 77mm size filters which is very convenient. I had taken the 70-200mm f/2.8 to Italy and it was too large and too conspicuous and I could see people tense up whenever it was pointed in their direction.
As still shooters the value of a lens for videos is overlooked. A wide range zoom is always going to be the first choice where the field of view can be changed during a clip. Ultimate IQ is far less important when people are viewing most videos, even at 4K.
The f/8 at 400mm would be a concern with older cameras as the amount of light reaching the autofocus sensors was a concern. Shooting with the D3 at dimly lit wedding receptions I needed to use a f/1.4 prime lens for the autofocus to function. The Z9 has a far better autofocus system in every respect.
With such a small lens and inexpensive at $1,300 it was an easy decision to add one to my kit for video shooting. It will probably replace my 6 lb Sigma 60-600mm lf/6.3 zoom lens which is not terribly sharp but adequate for video.
As still shooters the value of a lens for videos is overlooked. A wide range zoom is always going to be the first choice where the field of view can be changed during a clip. Ultimate IQ is far less important when people are viewing most videos, even at 4K.
The f/8 at 400mm would be a concern with older cameras as the amount of light reaching the autofocus sensors was a concern. Shooting with the D3 at dimly lit wedding receptions I needed to use a f/1.4 prime lens for the autofocus to function. The Z9 has a far better autofocus system in every respect.
With such a small lens and inexpensive at $1,300 it was an easy decision to add one to my kit for video shooting. It will probably replace my 6 lb Sigma 60-600mm lf/6.3 zoom lens which is not terribly sharp but adequate for video.
I also used the 28-300 alot for years with the D850 and it produced sharp images. I will be anxious to see your results when you get it.
BlackRockArt
Well-known member
Nimi, I don't know about India, here are a few pictures of amature photographers in China. The No.1 selling camera brand is still Canon, it has a very strong grip over there.
Oliver
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So these photos could also say that too many men in China are still stuck with their Canon gear. The women need to get out with our Nikons and get some quality telephoto time.
peachfront
New member
I am a beginner who has been working with the 400mm prime lens + 1.4 TC as needed to pull the birds closer. I just tested this kit on a couple of tours, and it seems right for me because it's light & easy to carry, and I am smaller, older, and shorter than the average outdoor photographer. But, sure, there were times when I would have liked to have the zoom. Adorama sent me an ad for this upcoming release, and once I saw the price + zoom, I was asking myself, What is the catch, & Should I sell my prime lens & switch to this? Reading this thread suggests strongly I should stick with what I've got if my ultimate interest is birds & occasional other critters... Anyone disagree or have something to point out? My primary goal is to have gear I can manage at my size and strength while getting decent/good bird photos. Saving money is not an important purpose, I could save money with a Coolpix.
If you can comfortably manage the kit you have, stay with it. The new 28-400 will capture fine images but your lens will provide superior image quality and give you greater flexibility in lower light situations.
Doomrider74
Well-known member
Whilst it won't be great for wildlife photography, I could see it being a good travel lens, and even a budget version of the 100-400. An aperture of f8 is fine for landscapes and cityscapes, which are often the primary styles when traveling.
The caveat to this is that f8 limits its low light performance and you might be limited to shooting in good light or take a tripod to shoot at the focal lengths where that is the max aperture; the latter of which negates any weight saving advantages of a lens like this.
The caveat to this is that f8 limits its low light performance and you might be limited to shooting in good light or take a tripod to shoot at the focal lengths where that is the max aperture; the latter of which negates any weight saving advantages of a lens like this.
peachfront
New member
Thanks, the low light limitation really stands out for me. It can also be impractical for me to carry a tripod into some locations.
fcotterill
Well-known member
I didn't watch all of this video, but judging from the nighttime images, the VR of this synchronized with IBIS goes a long way to make up for the f8 impediment. (I continue to be surprised handholding the 800 PF on the Z9 at uncomfortably slow shutter speeds, even 1/30 in low light.)
Times have changed. Compared to the state of VR a decade, or more, ago.
It's clear Nikon is leveraging the advantages in their modern technology to design lighter products for travel solutions.
Times have changed. Compared to the state of VR a decade, or more, ago.
It's clear Nikon is leveraging the advantages in their modern technology to design lighter products for travel solutions.
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Calson
Well-known member
There is an exaggerated emphasis on image quality that conflicts with the real world where most images are viewed at 72ppi on a screen or made into prints that are 11x14 or smaller and done at 240 dpi.
When I used a 24-120mm lens along with the 24-70mm f/2.8 lens on my 12MP D3 camera the difference in image sharpness were readily apparent and I quickly sold the f-mount 24-120mm lens. With the Z camera the S-mount 24-120mm is a very good lens and it is what I chose over the 24-70mm lens.
Many people are using their digital cameras to shoot video and this has accelerated with mirrorless cameras with their internal image stabilization. Different criteria apply to shooting video over shooting stills. The product managers at Nikon understand this, thankfully.
People compare Nikon to Sony and Canon without realizing that these two companies are magnitudes larger. Canon's profits are largely generated by its commercial copier and printer division and the sales of cameras and lenses is used primarily to provide free advertising when they are photographed at sports events. Nikon's purchase of RED was to grow its video business in competition with Sony and Canon and a very smart move.
When I used a 24-120mm lens along with the 24-70mm f/2.8 lens on my 12MP D3 camera the difference in image sharpness were readily apparent and I quickly sold the f-mount 24-120mm lens. With the Z camera the S-mount 24-120mm is a very good lens and it is what I chose over the 24-70mm lens.
Many people are using their digital cameras to shoot video and this has accelerated with mirrorless cameras with their internal image stabilization. Different criteria apply to shooting video over shooting stills. The product managers at Nikon understand this, thankfully.
People compare Nikon to Sony and Canon without realizing that these two companies are magnitudes larger. Canon's profits are largely generated by its commercial copier and printer division and the sales of cameras and lenses is used primarily to provide free advertising when they are photographed at sports events. Nikon's purchase of RED was to grow its video business in competition with Sony and Canon and a very smart move.
John Navitsky
Well-known member
as well as lens length
fcotterill
Well-known member
According to Marc Cruz, Nikon USA, the 28-400 does have Synchro-VR
[link above #84 @2:00 ]
This is a first for a Consumer Z Nikkor, previously, only an elite set of S Line Telephotos had this feature
[link above #84 @2:00 ]
This is a first for a Consumer Z Nikkor, previously, only an elite set of S Line Telephotos had this feature
O
Well-known member
Is this 28-400 a perfect match for the Zf ?
The Zf with its 10 stops of low light focusing and 8 stops of IS VR ?
It would be nice to see the Z 28-400 mirror less versus FX 28-300 versus Z 24-200 how fare are they apart optically.
The Matt Granger review (video clip) or presentation was more enjoyable and informative than Peta Pixels high speed verbal burst, Matt's use of the birds up close was surprisingly interesting then the limitations of low light all in the real world use on his model street shots rather than just easy sunny bright still documentary subjects in good light from Peta Pixel.
The two main features in the ZF which will no doubt be soon in forth coming new model cameras, these features alone really allows many redesigned lenses to be made cheaper with higher margins.
As to the 28-400, for myself i think its an interesting tool that suits a purpose, the FX 28-300 was and sis till a great all round lens especially at F3.5 to F5.6, i can appreciate the new mirror less version extended to 400 is great however possibly a little overkill with to much compromise from 195 or 200mm to full on F8 all the time.
A direct comparison of image files to the FX 28-300 would be interesting to gauge a real optical difference and tolerance from the different F stops.
I think time will settle a position of where and how good this lens fits, i am keeping an open mind.
Is it Tamron made ? who knows and does it matter ?
I think its a attractive lens that will suit many peoples needs and it will suit ethe ZF especially as well as many mid range cameras, just way over priced, but hey if the conasumer keeps paying well thats the market.
For me the lens is seriously over priced for what it is by at least $600 AUD.
Its interesting that the difference between the 24-200 and the 28-400 optically is not that much so i heard, i cant recall if it was Matt or Peta Pixel that made the comment.
I would rather go for a mirror less 28-300 with better F stop like F3.5 to F5.6 or just add 100mm to the Z 24-200mm f/4-6.3 VR and enjoy a much smaller lighter lens compared to a 28-400.
With 45mp sensors and good glass you can really crop 100mm easily if needed.
I may rent or borrow a 28-400 in the near future, its the only way to find out what its really like.
Only an opinion
The Zf with its 10 stops of low light focusing and 8 stops of IS VR ?
It would be nice to see the Z 28-400 mirror less versus FX 28-300 versus Z 24-200 how fare are they apart optically.
The Matt Granger review (video clip) or presentation was more enjoyable and informative than Peta Pixels high speed verbal burst, Matt's use of the birds up close was surprisingly interesting then the limitations of low light all in the real world use on his model street shots rather than just easy sunny bright still documentary subjects in good light from Peta Pixel.
The two main features in the ZF which will no doubt be soon in forth coming new model cameras, these features alone really allows many redesigned lenses to be made cheaper with higher margins.
As to the 28-400, for myself i think its an interesting tool that suits a purpose, the FX 28-300 was and sis till a great all round lens especially at F3.5 to F5.6, i can appreciate the new mirror less version extended to 400 is great however possibly a little overkill with to much compromise from 195 or 200mm to full on F8 all the time.
A direct comparison of image files to the FX 28-300 would be interesting to gauge a real optical difference and tolerance from the different F stops.
I think time will settle a position of where and how good this lens fits, i am keeping an open mind.
Is it Tamron made ? who knows and does it matter ?
I think its a attractive lens that will suit many peoples needs and it will suit ethe ZF especially as well as many mid range cameras, just way over priced, but hey if the conasumer keeps paying well thats the market.
For me the lens is seriously over priced for what it is by at least $600 AUD.
Its interesting that the difference between the 24-200 and the 28-400 optically is not that much so i heard, i cant recall if it was Matt or Peta Pixel that made the comment.
I would rather go for a mirror less 28-300 with better F stop like F3.5 to F5.6 or just add 100mm to the Z 24-200mm f/4-6.3 VR and enjoy a much smaller lighter lens compared to a 28-400.
With 45mp sensors and good glass you can really crop 100mm easily if needed.
I may rent or borrow a 28-400 in the near future, its the only way to find out what its really like.
Only an opinion
Calson
Well-known member
Matt Irwin has done the best review of the 28-400mm lens to date. He covers both video and still shooting hand held at very slow shutter speeds making use of the Z camera's internal IS in tandem with Synchro VR of the lens.
O
Well-known member
fcotterill said:
"the VR of this synchronized with IBIS goes a long way makes up for the f8 impediment."
O saying
That was my leaning and first thought as the ZF has 8 stops of ibis up from 5 on the Z8 Z9 and 10 stops up from 8 in the Z8 Z9 of low light focus complimenting video hand holding, and slow shutter speed permanence capability, so the 28-400 should also be a real consumer winner.
I feel we will see more advanced IBIS going forward in the Z9 II or Z8 II Z7III Z6III.
I think the Z7III with new or better IBIS and low light features like in the ZF, its small light compact form, 45mp, increased frame rate to at least 14fps minimum like the ZF, along with ex 7 processing and improved focusing system will be the absolute home run and a big IF they boost it with Sonys 60mp sensor, it would be so good. Another D850 moment.
Every Nikon lens I've used allows you to manually focus, even when in auto focus. So, I'm not sure why that's a deal breaker? Also, if I know I'm wanting to take something in manual, I'd switch it on the camera.