O
Well-known member
People leave Nikon go to Sony then leave Sony and go to Canon what if Nikon comes out with a killer Z9 or Z10 whatever and they leave an go back to Nikon......????
Why do they do that...........and how ????
Oz Down Under
Nikon Shooters - Would you switch to another brand (or have you?)
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People leave Nikon go to Sony then leave Sony and go to Canon what if Nikon comes out with a killer Z9 or Z10 whatever and they leave an go back to Nikon......????
Why do they do that...........and how ????
Oz Down Under
O
Well-known member
Cant understand why Nikon cant catch up with the focusing tracking, they know how Sony and Canon do it.........is there some sort of I wont touch your area you don't touch mine kind of thing going on here.
Or is there a serious technical challenge, or is it Nikon is working on a completely new innovation for tracking given they are inferior on videoing.
Will we see this in the Z9 is mean the D6 is still not king.
I remember the old saying, For low light and stills the D5 rules, for video and stills 1DXmkIII rules, both these cameras are slowly being pushed aside........
Interesting ??? we spend 90% of our time looking at 20% of the cause and effect (the gear) and 5% if at all talking about the 80% the cause and effect the person behind the camera.....
Only an opinion Oz Down Under
O
Well-known member
4 Questions
1) If Nikon matched Sony and Canon identically with focus and tracking FPS what would you do.
2) Given question 1) ...................what would be the difference between all three brands then that really mattered.
3) Why does no one really talk about composition, technique, skill set, lighting technique artificial and natural, Yes photography.
4) How much dose the camera do versus the lens, 20/40 80/20 ????
Only an opinion
Oz down under
O
Well-known member
I gather you like the A1
Love the movement in the wings, it adds strength to the image, do you think the two white spots are a distraction ? at least maybe clone out or crop out the one white distraction on the right so it doesn't take my eye away from the subject ?
Only an opinion
Oz down under
it isn’t the movement, it’s the rolling shutter distortion of the wings. That is what sets apart the A1 (and a9), the readout speed is fast enough you don’t get that. Birds, fast panning and sports are the major areas were it shows up.
yup, agree 100%. I also shot some sports on the side (pre-pandemic) so it would show up there if I ever tried to use silent shutter. It will be great to shoot silent for tennis when I get back out there
ChrisM
Well-known member
Canon could not do it with the original Eos-R and RP either, that were built on sensors and processors borrowed from their dslr lines, like the 5DIV. They had to design and bulid a new camera from the ground up, sensor, processor, software etc. That became the R5/R6 tandem.
If you would want an answer to the question as to why Nikon cannot catch up with Sony and Canon with old tech moved over from their dslr glory days, I guess you need to get initmate with the Nikon R&D team. I think they can tell you all about what a top-end mirrorless camera needs, and what they exactly had/have to design, manufacture and program to get there.
But I also think that if you just wait for the Z9, all your questions will be answered too.
Nikon is now in a corner where people want them to compete without the neccessary hardware, and that won't be a nice place to be caught in. I think that explains why they are throwing their dslr's aside and move ahead full steam with the Z9. They must be utterly fed up with the pressure to match Sony and Canon at their turf of automated tracking, and probably have decided that they should prioritize to give people what they apparently want. So get ready for the Z9...
D
Deleted member 115
Guest
Your thinking about this too much, it almost feels personal. If Nikon doesn’t produce I will be looking at Sony. I want to experience the kind of keeper rate that bird eye AF will afford. I have no loyalty to any brand. When they start paying my bills we’ll talk
This entire forum and especially Steve are all about teaching skills so #3 is irrelevant.
If Z9 plays well with 500pf and has comparable tracking, huge win!
abc123brian
Well-known member
As a person who has switched systems a few times, I know switching systems is an expensive hobby. I mentioned in an earlier post, I am not a buyer for the 600mm F/4 lenses or A1/R3/R1/A1 class body (for me, this is a hobby). I am curious though, for those of you who do own that level of equipment and switched or added, what was it that pushed you to switch and how did you justify the expense? I just did a quick price check on B&H, the 600mm F/4 lenses from Canon, Sony, Nikon are all $13K USD and the A1 is $6500. So a single lens and body Is over $20K USD. I would assume as a wildlife photographer, you would probably also have a few other lenses like a 70-200mm F/2.8, 300mm F/2.8, 400mm F/2.8, and a second pro level body meaning you would probably have around $40K+ in equipment that you are replacing. I understand you get some money by selling your previous gear, but having done that, I know it still sells at a big loss. It also seems like a risky move considering that none of these brands have a full super telephoto lens lineup yet. So really, just curious to the motivator.
smkunder
Active member
I have to agree, this technology leap frog only puts money in the camera manufacturers pockets. I am an older guy, and have seen this technology race a few times. I would not consider , any camera manufacturers dead and gone yet. In fact there is technology that Nikon has in their mirroless systems that Sony doesn’t have. It’s all going to come out as a benefit for us the consumer in the end.
Garfield
Well-known member
Even the a1 can't "track" at the speeds small passerines can fly, but regular C-AF works just fine. All I'm saying is that it would be nice to have even more than 30 FPS from time to time. But that doesn't mean I'm unhappy with the a1: it's the best camera I've ever owned, by far.
Garfield
Well-known member
But keep in mind the costs are there even when staying with the same brand and moving from DSLR's to mirrorless (for Nikon & Canon at least). Admittedly there's no immediate need to jettison everything at once if staying within one brand, but in my case I was eventually going to sell my 600E anyways and trade up a better performing mirrorless version, so changing systems at the same time (to Sony in my case) was no big deal from a financial perspective. The cost is what it is and we all make our own personal decisions in that regard.
Sheyene47
New member
I currently have the Nikon D750, and have owned it since it came out (7 years ago?). I've been ready for an upgrade for a little while now and WAS going to get the D850. However, I think I may get into the mirrorless systems now but have been agonizing on whether or not to wait for the Nikon Z replacement for the D850 (I'm assuming it's going to be called the Z8) or jump ship now and get into the equivalent Canon (R5) or sony. I'm giving Nikon until the end of the year and if they haven't at least announced the Z8 then I'm probably going to look into another brand.
O
Well-known member
Demodave
Active member
For me it was simple math. Had 4 Nikon bodies, 6 lenses including a 600g which was 11+ lbs. Even trade for sony a1 and 600 g master
Already had the a9II and 200-600. I'll add a 24-105.
Now I have a 6.7 lb lens that plays better with tc's, faster focusing and 20 and 30 fps. For those that say you dont need that I already have pics that show images that I couldnt have gotten with Nikon. Especially the Z's.
If I kept Nikon. I was looking at a Z9. 7K plus a newer 600E or 600S 13K whenever they come out. Dont get me wrong I loved what my Nikons would do for mammals. But my Sony's are nailing bifs and quick action
For me it was the right time and the right deal. I'm happy and getting pics I couldnt have before.
Already had the a9II and 200-600. I'll add a 24-105.
Now I have a 6.7 lb lens that plays better with tc's, faster focusing and 20 and 30 fps. For those that say you dont need that I already have pics that show images that I couldnt have gotten with Nikon. Especially the Z's.
If I kept Nikon. I was looking at a Z9. 7K plus a newer 600E or 600S 13K whenever they come out. Dont get me wrong I loved what my Nikons would do for mammals. But my Sony's are nailing bifs and quick action
For me it was the right time and the right deal. I'm happy and getting pics I couldnt have before.
O
Well-known member
The smart phones are really driving photography and video capture on the back of 5g and the internet in general, they are crushing Canon Nikon and and Sony against the wall..so many camera clubs are now opening a division for competition entries taken by phones and its a rapidly growing area..........even in open and international competitions.
Personally I have entered more club competition entries this year compared to last year taken on my phone, why, the top of the line Samsung's and iPhones are just stunning......
A recent walk around the Blue Mountains on a sunny day saw me taking wonderful landscape, bush scape, flowers bees all from the phone, I was blown away as to ease of it all, I didn't even take out the D850 and 70-200 Fl from the boot of the car.
Its amazing how as you say technology is developing, Phones are defiantly getting the three big brands of their buts to up change or be eaten like the relentless muncher in Pack Man.
Phones have that integral vertical integration of connectivity, dedicated strong platforms, light small, massive appeal, do raw and Jpeg, photo stack, have three or four lenses built in and lots and lots of features.
They even have Light Room and Photoshop with a host of presets and all can be edited in the phone and just press send.. Amazing, I must say my phone is the mostly used camera to date.
Ok that said there are some limitations but slowly being worked on.
as always only and opinion
Oz down under.
D
Deleted member 115
Guest
and they are always in our pockets wherever we go...
O
Well-known member
Thankyou........ I am trying to understand and welcome you explanation.
Sorry, what I meant in using the word movement was........... to the viewer (untrained) they would see the wings as movement (similar to a milky waterfall) while the head and body is static, assuming panning with a slow shutter speed.
When we refer to a waterfall image with the milky water, its referred to as showing movement......its a commonly used judging description only.
Oz Down under
O
Well-known member
I understand, and the bird photos with the wing movement does hide it and someone not looking for it could easily mistake it as movement blur.
If you took a similar shot of a golf swing for example it would look like the golf club was actually curved, or if you were panning a BIF and there were trees in the background you’d see these curved lines… round balls in movement look like footballs (American football) instead of round. Having a super fast read-out speed prevents all of that and what makes shooting silent shutter possible on the A9 II and even more son the A1 (which now also allows you to use the flash in electronic shutter as well)
O
Well-known member
The landscape of photography has changed considerably in recent years and will continue to change. It might not be if Nikon can produce a competitive action camera but is it worth it from a business sense? Is there a new generation of photographers coming along interested in the same kind of photography many of us pursue? We can hope the Z9 will be amazing and that there will be a D850 and D500 replacement and/or mirrorless equivalent, but it might not be a profitable enough venture for Nikon to invest in?
fcotterill
Well-known member
To repeat the point already made above by other forum members, including @NikonAIS, Nikon is primarily an optics company: from in-house raw glass to final products. The latter range from industrial instruments, through to "consumer" products, although their consumers range from the public taking photos for fun etc through to the many professionals making their primary livelihoods from producing and selling images...and high profile clients such as NASA and the military who buy into the F and Z systems. Nikon also apparently designs the microlenses in the sensors they design/modify (industrial besides "consumer" cameras].
They are taking the lead on the most compact ultrawides (ie 14-30 f4S and 14-24 f2.8S) and excellent 3 Dragons (Trinity of f2.8S zooms). The consensus is all the Z lenses are excellent. So it will be interesting to see their forthcoming telephotos, considering the pair of PF primes, 800 f5.6E FL etc and recent 180-400 f4E TC, and 120-300 f2.8E SR. On the premise it packs a stacked-sensor and is stated to 'outperform the D6..."
Besides all the glass, As we know Nikon have also produced some mighty fine cameras The Z9 will clinch the system for most of us serious photographers (for those who can afford all this new exotic gear!)
And don't forget Nikon binoculars - their Monarchs are world class: tough and affordable.
They are taking the lead on the most compact ultrawides (ie 14-30 f4S and 14-24 f2.8S) and excellent 3 Dragons (Trinity of f2.8S zooms). The consensus is all the Z lenses are excellent. So it will be interesting to see their forthcoming telephotos, considering the pair of PF primes, 800 f5.6E FL etc and recent 180-400 f4E TC, and 120-300 f2.8E SR. On the premise it packs a stacked-sensor and is stated to 'outperform the D6..."
Besides all the glass, As we know Nikon have also produced some mighty fine cameras
The Z9 will clinch the system for most of us serious photographers (for those who can afford all this new exotic gear!)And don't forget Nikon binoculars - their Monarchs are world class: tough and affordable.
glsmith9823
Member
Nikon~Canon~Sony....AKA Ford~Chevy~Dodge Marketing Hype....Since the mid 1970s I've seen the vendors lag behind each other, then leap ahead...etc...i started with an old Nikon EM, when folks wouldnt go near a Canon due to issues with corrosion on the contact points. Just how much new tricks can marketing try to sell us...I periodically see ads for Canon or Sony will buy your used Nikon gear...Reminds me of a used car salesman...Outside of the target being photographed, there are 3 other components..camera body, lens, photographer...I do not include software i.e. ACDSee, PhotoShop, TopazLabs as I consider them artistic extensions of the photographer mind. I prefer to focus on strengthening my weaknesses...as I'm the one making the decision on when to push the button and the settings I use....not the camera, not the lens
O
Well-known member
Nikon needs to stay in the game and I feel it will, its biggest asset is its Branding, Imagine a reverse buy out of Sony by the underdog Nikon, its not an unusual business practice from a shareholder, tax, growth, or financial perspective. But hey who am I to say what's going to happen.
The market is eat or be eaten, technology is being thrown out like a volcano erupting. Great if you want it.
I hope Nikon eventually comes to the party .............they recently got a pile of money from the banks, so lets see if they can deliver, I certainly hope so.
Only an opinion as always
Oz down under