Official Nikon Z9 Launch, Info, and Discussion Thread
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I agree as I shoot a Hemmerli SP20 with a red dot and since cateract eye surgery iron sights.
fcotterill
Well-known member
This is 2hrs long....
O
Well-known member
Thank you so much for pointing out this video, i just watched the whole two hours, amazing, the little gems that came out, and for me most of all validation of the things i truly feel and believe in, really great.
fcotterill
Well-known member
I found the guy in NY distinctly too talkative and too domineering etc (not missed much missing his utubes. Yet another influencer who's impossible to watch undiluted).
Of much more interest, Ricci noted camera companies have been spending millions refining the reliability and longevity of mechanical shutters, (including MILC shutters that avoid the challenges of minimizing mirror slap, obviously). These challenges go up with R&D pushing the fps boundaries (eg pro ILCs).
He also stated @1:14 that the Z9 took Nikon "years, multiple years..." to develop...
@1:26 he emphasizes why he appreciates the significance of the 800 f6.3S PF and thereafter there's some interesting focus on Z lenses
Of much more interest, Ricci noted camera companies have been spending millions refining the reliability and longevity of mechanical shutters, (including MILC shutters that avoid the challenges of minimizing mirror slap, obviously). These challenges go up with R&D pushing the fps boundaries (eg pro ILCs).
He also stated @1:14 that the Z9 took Nikon "years, multiple years..." to develop...
@1:26 he emphasizes why he appreciates the significance of the 800 f6.3S PF and thereafter there's some interesting focus on Z lenses
arbitrage
Well-known member
Agreed.That's cool, but the trick is that at that range the DoF is massive. When birds are too far away like that, most of the image will be sharp since any minor AF discrepancies are covered by the DoF. Still, it's cool that the camera didn't try to jump to something else and was clearly staying on target. The Z6/7 series would jump to the background for sure! So, looks promising
This video by the same guy gives me a lot of concern over 3D and even over the other AF Wide mode tested. Lots of jumping off subject, often for no reason.
FB101
Well-known member
A lot of it depends on what you call stickiness and what mode you use.
‘On the A1 if I use eye AF and non tracking, the AF will be glued on that eye once it finds it, even if there is a distracting background or shimmering water in front. In my book that’s very sticky. But weird enough sometimes that mode doesn’t see an eye that‘s otherwise obvious. Since it defaults to face and seems to nail the eye anyway, it’s no big deal, but you don’t get the confirmation in viewfinder that it found an eye.
‘’With eye AF plus tracking, the AF finds more eyes, but at times it can get distracted by shimmery objects and randomly jump off the eye and face while tracking. It’s far better than a D850 or z7ii but when that happens I need to jump back to non tracking and AF sticks like glue. I’d call that quite good some flaws. I am guessing this might be the situation where a D6 would outperform the A1.
The weirdest thing with the A1, with the AF stickiness all the way on the most sticky setting, AF still gets very easily distracted by a tree or branch coming in the way when panning, and then it jumps back. I find the D850 (on its most sticky setting) actually better than the A1. I hope Sony gives us a software update on that one, when on 1 the AF should really not get easily distracted by a passing tree. What I have seen of the R3 is way better so far. Canon AF is more complex with all its possible custom settings but I think they better nailed the range of options different shooting situations need.
FB101
Well-known member
And it gets worse if backlit… I know, why shoot backlit at all? I just like the light glowing through feathers. Just can’t help it
FB101
Well-known member
I don’t know that it’s far worse than the A1 - looks more jumpy for sure but it also seems to recover better, and it is a tricky test environment with a bird that’s quite small and looks possibly overexposed (so less contrast detail to help). I know the jumping “box” would be tiring to me, I like the “poise” of the A1 (for lack of a better term) but I don’t know if it would make a practical difference on the keepers in focus.
Supposedly the latest a1 firmware helps with the backlit AF thing. I haven't has an adequate chance to try it by I'v been going back and forth with Jack Dykinga about it has and he seems to think it's better. His results look good.And it gets worse if backlit… I know, why shoot backlit at all? I just like the light glowing through feathers. Just can’t help it
I think I'm going to go out and see if I can find some of my local gulls this week for some tests. I promise, I won't shoot them from 500 years away LOL!
FB101
Well-known member
Don’t get me wrong, it’s much better than anything else I have shot when backlit, but I don’t think it’s as reliable as when well lit (kinda duh
comment, I am not sure why I’d expect anything different, light does matter). I have the new firmware but I haven’t done any test to see if it is better than the old one.
re CFExpress cards. I tried ProGrade but on my Z6 they woefully underperformed my Sony XQD. I was looking at the time for a 2nd card as I needed a replacement and backup. It was performing so poorly I reached out to ProGrade support. As it happened, that was disappointing at best. I'm a big fan of companies that have a great support team. As such, I'd never recommend a ProGrade card. I know many of you have great cards from them, but each to his own. For me, no support = no business.
just my rant, over.
just my rant, over.
FWIW, the Z9 did a great job shooting in the snow. My wife was using the R5 (it's a notch below the Sony for AF in our experience, but still pretty good) and while she struggled, the Z9 seemed to just ignore the snow.
I think what we'll find as time goes on is that in some instances one camera is better than another and none are perfect at every scenario. We've certainly found that shooting the a1 and R5 side by side. Bottom line though is that I'll bet the Z9, R3 (just guessing here, still don't have it), and a1 are all pretty close
lwan
Well-known member
Well unless i'm wrong a yellow af box leans the af is disengaged, then when it's green en engaged, it looks pretty darn good to me.
O
Well-known member
FWIW, the Z9 did a great job shooting in the snow. My wife was using the R5 (it's a notch below the Sony for AF in our experience, but still pretty good) and while she struggled, the Z9 seemed to just ignore the snow.
I think what we'll find as time goes on is that in some instances one camera is better than another and none are perfect at every scenario. We've certainly found that shooting the a1 and R5 side by side. Bottom line though is that I'll bet the Z9, R3 (just guessing here, still don't have it), and a1 are all pretty close
As i understand it...............please correct me if i am wrong.........
The Z9 uses Colour to detect, the others use Contrast, hence no issue in snow ?
In extreme cases where the bird is similar in colour to its background i find the tracking can be challenged, its the same for the other cameras using contrast, if its a very low contrast subject some what camouflaged then the same thing happens.
Hence i like to be in control and what i point at sticks 98% of the time.
This first image was taken on the D4s with the YES DON'T LAUGH, brilliantly handy 28-300 hand held taken as a JPEG fine at 10,000 iso
From memory it was 21 points some of the points picked up the body with contrast detect ? and it became the focal plain Bazinga.............
The second shot was the D850............1050mm LOL, 25 points focus in DX mode with the 1.4TC III on the 200-500 at 500mm shot in TIFF providing a 60 mb DX file and is massively cropped.
The full size image in a competition got a top award for composition, intent, angle, position, moment, facial expression etc etc LOL.
Not a stunning image but very usable despite the mist and spray, contrast detect as i understand on the D850 looks for the face in this situation anyway, i don't know how the z9 will go, i imagine it will pick up the face by colour detect and then focus on the eye, but will the result really be different, time will tell.
If the Z9 locks on to the face i can then use a slower shutter speed and create movement of the water..........a easier panning technique if you don't already have the skill set.
I have yet to explore or learn how to use the Z9 focus tracking, to date tracking is not a tool i use or really rely on, i prefer to be in control.
I have NO issues or problems with the Z9 and i am not looking for any, i am simply focusing on the benefits it has to offer and how it will compliment my style..
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O
Well-known member
FWIW, the Z9 did a great job shooting in the snow. My wife was using the R5 (it's a notch below the Sony for AF in our experience, but still pretty good) and while she struggled, the Z9 seemed to just ignore the snow.
I think what we'll find as time goes on is that in some instances one camera is better than another and none are perfect at every scenario. We've certainly found that shooting the a1 and R5 side by side. Bottom line though is that I'll bet the Z9, R3 (just guessing here, still don't have it), and a1 are all pretty close
The R1 will smoke them all.........LOL
O
Well-known member
O
Well-known member
I think 3 d tracking from any camera brand generally while it has its place and purpose its somewhat overrated anyway, but this guys videos are just wrong an silly.
O
Well-known member
I think towards the end they went to the subject that is sadly lacking at the moment and that's actual talking about photography, and saying its not about the gear its about what you do with it, i haven't heard that for years LOL, its my mantra and i feel validated watching, how refreshing.
arbitrage
Well-known member
Yes, that is correct.
Look at all the instances where the green box is tracking the flying egret well for a second or two and then just loses it and back tracks along the water or some egrets in the background. Then we have the egret sitting perfectly still and the AF box just seems to jump off the head it was tracking just fine a second previously.
From what I can see in that video, the Z9 is focusing more like an R5 that loves jumping off to backgrounds every chance it gets than it is to an A9 or A1 which can stick like glue if they start tracking the correct subject.
But I won't really know for sure until my Z9 is in my hands and I can shoot it side by side with the A1. I will also be getting an R3 for a few days to test against them. I owned the R5 for 8 months so won't be revisiting that one again.
O
Well-known member
yes i have experienced the issue with snow before with someone else and it was colour detect i felt was the reason which is a positive..
Later i heard it mentioned on a Zoom interview.......they had also said that Sony and canon use contrast detect, but hey i could get shot down here now LOL
But i didn't know that the DSLRS used colour thanks for that.
Its going to be interesting to see how the Z9 focusing system works, In the for mentioned 2 hour zoom Ricci says the Z9 focusing has been turned up a little in the production model.
Later i heard it mentioned on a Zoom interview.......they had also said that Sony and canon use contrast detect, but hey i could get shot down here now LOL
But i didn't know that the DSLRS used colour thanks for that.
Its going to be interesting to see how the Z9 focusing system works, In the for mentioned 2 hour zoom Ricci says the Z9 focusing has been turned up a little in the production model.
O
Well-known member
I mean i haven't played with the Z9 video focusing system much at all as its not on my priority list, but gee i am getting much better results without even trying than this guy !!!
O
Well-known member
Interesting especially where the future is going, Panasonic is going Video only and taking stills from that, Nikon has laid the foundation as well