power bank for the z9?

ssheipel · Dec 15, 2023

I don't even know the question to ask, really.

Looking at powerbanks that perform in the cold looking ahead to my arctic trip in April. Have found one that heats itself (using very little power) and will retain 70% charge at -20C over 24 hours.

Wondering what parameter I need to consider re whether it will be adequate to charge a Z9 battery. The only technical information I see that might be relevant is this:

Capacity

20,000mAh 3.85V

Assuming that answers the question, one way or the other? In product description is says only it will charge a cell phone several times.

Thanks.

jcollins · Dec 15, 2023

What one are you considering? This thread may guide you in the right direction.

As far as brands go, I've found Anker to be solid. I have 2 of their batteries and one from 7yrs ago is still going strong. 20,000 mAh is a huge amount of capacity FWIW, the Z9 battery itself is only 3300mAh which is less than many iPhones these days.

ssheipel · Dec 15, 2023

jcollins said:
What one are you considering? This thread may guide you in the right direction.

As far as brands go, I've found Anker to be solid. I have 2 of their batteries and one from 7yrs ago is still going strong. 20,000 mAh is a huge amount of capacity FWIW, the Z9 battery itself is only 3300mAh which is less than many iPhones these days.

Thanks! That latter bit is what I'm wanting to get right -- e.g. the capacity is up to charging the camera or powering it. And huge capacity I'm good with as I'll be in deep cold for 10 days with limited recharging time (itself from an inverter).
Looking at this: https://www.nitecorestore.com/Summit-20000-Power-Bank-p/bat-nite-summit20000.htm

jcollins · Dec 15, 2023

Nitecore I've also heard good things about.

Output: USB-C

5V-3A / 9V-2.22 A / 12V-1.68A

That's what you care about. And if you take a look at the Nikon charger that came with your Z9, it's 5V-3A.

As you mention limited recharging time for the power bank, you should consider how long it will take to charge the 20,000 mAh capacity... It's been a while since I charged mine from 0%, but it takes HOURS. If you'll be able to do it in the evenings or overnight, that would be ideal.

gmart7717 · Dec 15, 2023

According to Thom Hogan's website:

Anker PowerCore+ 26800mAh PD 45W — this battery pack is the only USB Power Delivery device Nikon has tested and claims works with the Zfc, Z30, Z5, Z6 II, Z7 II, and Z9 USB Power Delivery capabilities. It's the battery pack/charging system that is called out in the Nikon manuals. Other batteries that support USB Power Delivery should work fine, but if you do have issues, Nikon may simply disclaim them because you're not using a tested device.

ssheipel · Dec 15, 2023

gmart7717 said:
According to Thom Hogan's website:

Anker PowerCore+ 26800mAh PD 45W — this battery pack is the only USB Power Delivery device Nikon has tested and claims works with the Zfc, Z30, Z5, Z6 II, Z7 II, and Z9 USB Power Delivery capabilities. It's the battery pack/charging system that is called out in the Nikon manuals. Other batteries that support USB Power Delivery should work fine, but if you do have issues, Nikon may simply disclaim them because you're not using a tested device.

Thanks. I am leaning however to a bank designed for use in cold (I'll be in heated space only for a few short hours at evening meal time; overnight no heat).

jcollins · Dec 15, 2023

Maybe a real engineer will show up, but in terms of # of times over you can charge your Z9 battery (or simply power the Z9 via cable) I believe it would be the watt hours. So roughly,

Nitecore = 20,000mAh * 3.85V = 77Wh
Z9 battery = 10.8 V * 3300mAh = 36Wh

77/36 = 2.1x, not accounting for the potential improvement in battery performance by being heated in an insulated pouch v.s. freezing in the camera body.

ssheipel · Dec 15, 2023

jcollins said:
Nitecore I've also heard good things about.

Output: USB-C 5V-3A / 9V-2.22 A / 12V-1.68A

That's what you care about. And if you take a look at the Nikon charger that came with your Z9, it's 5V-3A.

As you mention limited recharging time for the power bank, you should consider how long it will take to charge the 20,000 mAh capacity... It's been a while since I charged mine from 0%, but it takes HOURS. If you'll be able to do it in the evenings or overnight, that would be ideal.

And that is what I was meaning by I don't know what questions to ask re the 5v-3a spec thingy

The Z9 battery itself takes hours to charge so I expected to live with long charge times. Will have a 'few' hours in the evening (not overnight, when the batteries, hopefully charged, will be at the bottom of my sleeping bag to keep them warm

).

ajrmd · Dec 15, 2023

Are you trying to charge the batteries in-camera or run it off the camera off of the pack? Some other things to consider... the PD should be adequate to power the camera and you should also consider whether you want to simultaneously charge other gear (phone, gps, etc.) According to Nikon a 45 W PD is necessary though I can find substantiation as to minimums, only the reference to the one tested device. How rapidly one can recharge the battery is another factor in the calculus and try to find one which will charge in a couple of hours. FWIW, I used the Anker 737 successfully because it offers two USB C ports and frequently, I am charging other devices as well.

jcollins · Dec 15, 2023

Another thread.

BillW · Dec 15, 2023

jcollins said:
Maybe a real engineer will show up, but in terms of # of times over you can charge your Z9 battery (or simply power the Z9 via cable) I believe it would be the watt hours. So roughly,

Nitecore = 20,000mAh * 3.85V = 77Wh
Z9 battery = 10.8 V * 3300mAh = 36Wh

77/36 = 2.1x, not accounting for the potential improvement in battery performance by being heated in an insulated pouch v.s. freezing in the camera body.

There is some inefficiency in charging, so 77 WH in the source will not provide 77 WH to other batteries it is used to charge.

I tested this before a trip to the Grand Canyon and the Colorado River earlier this year where we had no access to power, other than what we brought with us and, depending on the camp site and conditions, solar chargers. If memory serves, I found a fully charged Anker PowerCore+ 26800 mAh 45W, mentioned above, which has 96.48 WH capacity would recharge 2 EN EL 18d batteries (36 WH capacity each) that had been discharged to 15% to 20%. And this was done at typical room temperature, not cold temperatures.

One other point that might be relevant. I'm not sure what the rule is in Canada or other countries, but in the US, the FAA restricts the size of lithium ion batteries taken on airplanes to 100 WH or less. You also generally have to carry the batteries in the cabin with you rather than put them in checked luggage. Some airlines have more restrictive rules.

I have the Anker PowerCore+ 26800 mAh 45W mentioned above. 96.48 WH. I've had good luck with this and other Anker products. But I have not used it in cold weather.

I did a trip to Seal River on Hudson Bay last November. Temps were often below zero Fahrenheit and we had a couple of days where the ambient air temp was -15F (with windchills of -35F). When outside, I kept my extra batteries inside my parka to keep them warm. My Z9 worked great in these conditions. As did my Z7II. (Would take a Z9 and Z8 if I go again.) We left the cameras in an unheated room overnight -- so they never warmed up -- and took only our batteries and memory cards into the lodge.

I understand you will not have a nice heated lodge on Baffin, so considtions for a battery will be tougher.

ssheipel · Dec 16, 2023

BillW said:
There is some inefficiency in charging, so 77 WH in the source will not provide 77 WH to other batteries it is used to charge.

I tested this before a trip to the Grand Canyon and the Colorado River earlier this year where we had no access to power, other than what we brought with us and, depending on the camp site and conditions, solar chargers. If memory serves, I found a fully charged Anker PowerCore+ 26800 mAh 45W, mentioned above, which has 96.48 WH capacity would recharge 2 EN EL 18d batteries (36 WH capacity each) that had been discharged to 15% to 20%. And this was done at typical room temperature, not cold temperatures.

One other point that might be relevant. I'm not sure what the rule is in Canada or other countries, but in the US, the FAA restricts the size of lithium ion batteries taken on airplanes to 100 WH or less. You also generally have to carry the batteries in the cabin with you rather than put them in checked luggage. Some airlines have more restrictive rules.

I have the Anker PowerCore+ 26800 mAh 45W mentioned above. 96.48 WH. I've had good luck with this and other Anker products. But I have not used it in cold weather.

I did a trip to Seal River on Hudson Bay last November. Temps were often below zero Fahrenheit and we had a couple of days where the ambient air temp was -15F (with windchills of -35F). When outside, I kept my extra batteries inside my parka to keep them warm. My Z9 worked great in these conditions. As did my Z7II. (Would take a Z9 and Z8 if I go again.) We left the cameras in an unheated room overnight -- so they never warmed up -- and took only our batteries and memory cards into the lodge.

I understand you will not have a nice heated lodge on Baffin, so considtions for a battery will be tougher.

Great info; thanks!

ssheipel · Dec 16, 2023

ajrmd said:
Are you trying to charge the batteries in-camera or run it off the camera off of the pack? Some other things to consider... the PD should be adequate to power the camera and you should also consider whether you want to simultaneously charge other gear (phone, gps, etc.) According to Nikon a 45 W PD is necessary though I can find substantiation as to minimums, only the reference to the one tested device. How rapidly one can recharge the battery is another factor in the calculus and try to find one which will charge in a couple of hours. FWIW, I used the Anker 737 successfully because it offers two USB C ports and frequently, I am charging other devices as well.

Thanks for the input! A mixture of both -- to charge the batteries (like to have a power source since the inverter will only be available for a certain period of time to charge) but also to have plugged into the camera while shooting since it'll be cold (tho hopefully not brutally cold -- I have shot with the Z9 in -35C for several hours; but again that day ended with bringing the battery home to a warm home to get charged

Not sure if that latter bit is necessary, tho. Would like to bring only the battery into the warmth for charging as well but assuming the USB charge can be done in the Z9 charger block (vs leaving in camera). Plugged into the wall the Z9 battery takes hours to charge so assuming I'm not going to do better than 'that' with the PD?

BillW · Dec 16, 2023

ssheipel said:
Thanks for the input! A mixture of both -- to charge the batteries (like to have a power source since the inverter will only be available for a certain period of time to charge) but also to have plugged into the camera while shooting since it'll be cold (tho hopefully not brutally cold -- I have shot with the Z9 in -35C for several hours; but again that day ended with bringing the battery home to a warm home to get charged Not sure if that latter bit is necessary, tho. Would like to bring only the battery into the warmth for charging as well but assuming the USB charge can be done in the Z9 charger block (vs leaving in camera). Plugged into the wall the Z9 battery takes hours to charge so assuming I'm not going to do better than 'that' with the PD?

If you had a long cable, could you run the Z9 from a power block, while keeping the power block under your parka so that it would stay warmer? Or put the block in a pocket with a chemical handwarmer?

You can charge the EN EL 18d batteries using the Z9 charger block attached to a PD power brick. I’ve used the Anker block I mentioned above. That would allow you to not bring the Z9 itself into the warmth.

Andrew Lamberson · Dec 16, 2023

I have the Anker PowerCore+ 26800mAh PD 45W and use in my camera trap with the Z6II to keep the battery in the camera charged. It's been used for up to 4 nights and it is still 80 % and the camera battery is 100%. It's been down in the teens a few nights I had it out.

I also use it up at the Sax-Zim Bog to recharge my Sony A7r V and I keep the battery in my jacket to keep it warm.

DougC · Dec 16, 2023

While we are on the subject, does the power bank actually power the camera or does it charge the battery which then powers the camera?

John Navitsky · Dec 16, 2023

DougC said:
While we are on the subject, does the power bank actually power the camera or does it charge the battery which then powers the camera?

it can do one or the other, charge or power, not both at the same time

DougC · Dec 16, 2023

John Navitsky said:
it can do one or the other, charge or power, not both at the same time

So, you can run the camera without a battery in it?

John Navitsky · Dec 16, 2023

DougC said:
So, you can run the camera without a battery in it?

actually i don’t think you can but i’m not positive

ajrmd · Dec 16, 2023

DougC said:
So, you can run the camera without a battery in it?

Not exactly. A functioning battery or purportedly a "dummy" could be employed. Though I haven't used the setup for any interval work, since I own the Z8's I regularly utilize the PD battery block for all day shoots with the gear mounted on a tripod. I leave a fully charged battery in the camera and supposedly the system draws from the PD block. Have I measured the current flow? No, but supposedly, that's how it works.

marlowtravelsoften · Dec 16, 2023

If it's any consolation, I was in Northern Minnesota last winter and the temps hit -35F throughout the week. The Z9 battery lasted all day long without doing anything. I have a spare battery anyway, but I just simply charged the battery I used each night and rotated them throughout the week I was there. No issues. Not sure what temps you're expecting, but the larger battery performs very well in cold temps. I also didn't take a lot of video either though, or use live view much.

John Navitsky · Dec 16, 2023

fwiw, optimal battery will be one that can provide 20v @ 3a via pd