I think that's CA.
tc 1.4 III Soft
- Thread starter Cas1234
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The more the merry is the way I see it, not as hijacking the thread. I picked up a lot of information since the start of the thread. Thanks, to all that commented, collectively I bet there are hundreds of years of experience here.
Turberticus
Well-known member
I've only been shooting birds for 2-3 years so you can take my comments with a dunning-kruger sized grain of salt
Using the TC14III with this lens I was able to photo Saturn and see it's rings. But it is way slow focusing for birds (even setting birds) for me to bother with it on the 200-500. I use TC14III with the 500PF and D6 camera, snaps right on focus and hangs tight. Surprising that many here seem a-ok with it.
Calson
Well-known member
The old rule of thumb on shutter speed seem to be too low with digital cameras overall. With a 500mm lens I kept shutter speeds at 1/250s or better with birds. The other aspect is the higher resolution of current cameras. With the D800e I needed to be more careful and deliberate in releasing the shutter as camera motion blur was much more evident with the camera having more than double the resolution of my D3. Subject motion blur can occur at shutter speeds of 1/80s and the lack of sharpness is often blamed on the lens. Even when photographing people standing and talking at an event a 1/60s shutter speed would result in images with subject motion blur.
I have not used teleconverters with my zoom lenses, however I plan to use the 2x S teleconverter with the 100-400mm lens on the Z9 as this camera has internal image stabilization which can make a great deal of difference in reducing camera motion blur.
I have not used teleconverters with my zoom lenses, however I plan to use the 2x S teleconverter with the 100-400mm lens on the Z9 as this camera has internal image stabilization which can make a great deal of difference in reducing camera motion blur.
A good rule for shutter speed is if what you're using results in OOF shots, go to a faster shutter speed to see if it improves your results. If so, continue.
Roy
Well-known member
All TCs soften the image a little.
The TC is losing a stop of light which could be limiting your Autofocus.
Some cameras dont like to focus at f8 or slower and some cameras are more affected than others.
Thats another reason that they work better on fast primes.
Any teleconverter use will degrade an image to a degree. Using teleconverters on f5.6 lenses is not really a good set up for 2 reasons. Teleconverters we're made for f4 lenses and larger apertures. I have a 300-800mm f5.6 Sigma and a tele for it by Sigma. It still degrades image quality. My Nikon converter is only used on my f4 lenses and larger. Still a small amount of image degrading. If you go to Nikon's website I believe it will have a list of compatible lenses for the teleconverter. I'm pretty sure your lense is not on it.
When using a TC, especially in the 200-500, you will always sacrifice some IQ. You'll also have slower AF, which may affect your ability to acquire and keep a subject sharp. Low light situations also affect the performance of the TC in a lens like the 200-500. I use the 1.4 TC III on my 200-500, but only for static or slow moving subjects. A TC works best in prime lenses, or fast zooms, such as the 70-200 f2.8.
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MadMikeOne
Member
I actually see them on both.
I had major issues with my Nikon 200-500 and with the Nikon 1.4 TCII new out of the box. The 200-500 got fixed after 2 trips to Nikon from me and then a recall from Nikon very shortly after I got it back from the second trip and it worked just fine after that but I moved on to lenses that worked better for me. The 1.4TCIII got sent back twice the first time there were instructions to use AF adjust in camera at the top of the range. I sent it back to Nikon saying that it was still not acceptable even at that range and it did not matter what camera lens combo D500, D850 or D4S or 300pf or 200-500. They sent it back the second time with no notes at all and it worked perfectly. I have used it on 600 f/4 E on D6 and D850 with no issues. I have now used it on the Z6II and 500pf and it works great.
simonsi
Active member
In my experience you definitely need to fine tune with the TC mounted, I have the TC14eII, TC17e, TC20eIII - all need a different AFFT setting to each other and my 300/2.8 bare.
also DO increase the shutter speed, I used my TC17e with my 200-500 but AFFT needed and plenty of shutter speed to accomodate the 850mm. Dont forget with living things you can get subject movement that VR doesnt help with.
also DO increase the shutter speed, I used my TC17e with my 200-500 but AFFT needed and plenty of shutter speed to accomodate the 850mm. Dont forget with living things you can get subject movement that VR doesnt help with.
I agree with DR on the shutter speed. I'm a competitive target shooter and very well trained at holding sights on targets at great distances. Even so, with slower shutter speeds, not only my own camera shake, mirror slap, atmospheric conditions between the subject and I as well as movement in the subject. Birds are rarely stationary subjects even when sitting on a perch. They breathe rapidly, their heads are constantly turning and any breeze is moving their feathers. The smaller the bird the greater the challenge and Eastern Bluebirds are not a tiny bird but they are not a large one either.
I can see the softness in your first photo but it's not really that bad.
I shoot a D500 and a D7200 with the 200-500. When I add a 1.4TC to it my images are frequently softer and that seems to be more visible the farther the subject was from my position. It may well be atmospherics creeping in too.
Hope you get it all worked out and neither of your images was what I would call "bad."
clippy
Well-known member
I’m not sure if this has been mentioned but I wouldn’t shoot wide open unless I had to. I would use F/10 or F/11 for an experiment and see if it’s a little sharper. My gut feeling is that your combination is not going to be sharp. My best advice is to get closer. Just my two cents.
Use of TC's on the Z cameras on adapted f/mount lenses is blowing me away. I had issues with AF on 500 pf and 1.4 TC III on D850, D500 and D6 (less on this) but on the Z6II it is amazing ! At this time I can only dream of what it will be like if my Z9 ever arrives.
The two photo were taken at the approximately the same distance. I am going to try the different suggestions posted and see what combination works best.
I shoot most birds sitting or flying with shutter speed equivalent to or faster than focal length ... the light available determines the ISO. 1/250 with 200-500 at 500 with the 1.4 TC would be extremely slow.
f/5.6 to f/8 is one stop
Your gut feeling and mine are one in the same. I am thinking adding the TC the photos are not going to be as sharp. Using the posted suggestion should minimize the softness. I posted a thread, Just head shots and they were all taken without a TC, very shape images. I think I will set up the same shooting station, using a tripod, add the TC and see how they turn out.
One of the biggest differences I forgot about and goofed on with the 1.4 on 500pf is the shallower depth of field at 700m m so got to close on a subject. So keep that in mind if you shoot subjects at the same distance with and without TC. Since 200-500 is f/8 with 1.4 TC that makes it a bit better but f/11 as someone noted would put more of the head of a bird in focus if your close ... although as your F/stop gets smaller diffraction will eventually set in.
lol. yeah, what was I thinking, good catch.
I caught it for me more than once to used to many of my variable focal lenght long lenses being f/6.3 ... so my mind kept thinking 5.6 to 6.3 or 6.3 to 8 as a stop instead of a half stop
Would love to know all the parameters of the photos you posted. I had to read through the entire thread to even realise you were shooting a D7500. We do not know the shutter speeds used, the aperture, the ISO or any other circumstances of the photos shown. All this information would hep to hopefully get to the bottom of the issue you are having.
I have used the 1.4x TCIII extensively on both DSLR's and now ML Z7, Z7II and also now the Z9. The 1.4x TCIII should be great on most faster prime and zoom lenses like f2.8 and f4 glass and a little less so on f5.6 prime and zoom lenses. On a DSLR you really need to do an AF fione tune check and possible adjustment, but you may get it good for 500mm f5.6 and 5mts, but it may not be so good at 15mts and f5.6. It may also be out at 200mm but good at 500mm. It may be excellent at f5.6 500mm at 5mts but be off slightly at f8 and 10mts. This can be the nature od the DSLR focus system as the AF is separate from the sensor. On ML, there are virtually no issus in this regard.
One issue with DSLR's is that they do not like f8 as the widest aperture for focusing. Yes, it can work on a few of the focus points of the D850 and D500 and D4/5/6 etc but the D7500 maybe a different kettle of fish. Even using my 500 f5.6 PF + 1.4x TCIII on my D850 and D500 it was a little hit and miss but this is a pro spec prime lens that has pre spec AF and will work much better than the slow-to-focus 200-500 f5.6. The 500 f5.6 PF has little to no issue focusing on the Z7/Z7II and is a breeze on the Z9.
I also had the 200-500 f5.6 and it was a little slow to focus. and mine was very, very sharp wide open. I thought it a bargain lens considering how sharp it was, but I did wish Nikon did a more pro spec version that had faster focus and a shorter zoom throw. However, I never used the 1.4x TCIII on it that I can remember as I was shooting DSLR's at the time and f8 max aperure was never going to be a good combo even on the pro spec DSLR's.
If the lens is very sharp without the TC, it could just be a bad copy of the TC. However, it could be an AF Fine Tune issue or AF too slow to focus before hitting the shutter button. It doesn't look to be a too slow shutter speed issue and generally the VR is excellent on the 200-500. I have used very low shutter speeds on the 200-500 and they have been as sharp as a tack.
D850 + 200-500 f5.6, 1/200s f/6.3 at 500.0mm iso2000
D850 + 200-500 f5.6, 1/200s f/8.0 at 500.0mm iso2800
To test the AF Fine Tune, the best method I have found is a simple set up using a box with snall printing on the end and a ruler at about a 45 degree angle next to the box and printing. Focus on the printing on the box and then use the ruler as a guide as to whether it is front or back focusing. This set up was to test my 105 f1.4E on my D850:
crop of above.
I have used the 1.4x TCIII extensively on both DSLR's and now ML Z7, Z7II and also now the Z9. The 1.4x TCIII should be great on most faster prime and zoom lenses like f2.8 and f4 glass and a little less so on f5.6 prime and zoom lenses. On a DSLR you really need to do an AF fione tune check and possible adjustment, but you may get it good for 500mm f5.6 and 5mts, but it may not be so good at 15mts and f5.6. It may also be out at 200mm but good at 500mm. It may be excellent at f5.6 500mm at 5mts but be off slightly at f8 and 10mts. This can be the nature od the DSLR focus system as the AF is separate from the sensor. On ML, there are virtually no issus in this regard.
One issue with DSLR's is that they do not like f8 as the widest aperture for focusing. Yes, it can work on a few of the focus points of the D850 and D500 and D4/5/6 etc but the D7500 maybe a different kettle of fish. Even using my 500 f5.6 PF + 1.4x TCIII on my D850 and D500 it was a little hit and miss but this is a pro spec prime lens that has pre spec AF and will work much better than the slow-to-focus 200-500 f5.6. The 500 f5.6 PF has little to no issue focusing on the Z7/Z7II and is a breeze on the Z9.
I also had the 200-500 f5.6 and it was a little slow to focus. and mine was very, very sharp wide open. I thought it a bargain lens considering how sharp it was, but I did wish Nikon did a more pro spec version that had faster focus and a shorter zoom throw. However, I never used the 1.4x TCIII on it that I can remember as I was shooting DSLR's at the time and f8 max aperure was never going to be a good combo even on the pro spec DSLR's.
If the lens is very sharp without the TC, it could just be a bad copy of the TC. However, it could be an AF Fine Tune issue or AF too slow to focus before hitting the shutter button. It doesn't look to be a too slow shutter speed issue and generally the VR is excellent on the 200-500. I have used very low shutter speeds on the 200-500 and they have been as sharp as a tack.
D850 + 200-500 f5.6, 1/200s f/6.3 at 500.0mm iso2000
D850 + 200-500 f5.6, 1/200s f/8.0 at 500.0mm iso2800
To test the AF Fine Tune, the best method I have found is a simple set up using a box with snall printing on the end and a ruler at about a 45 degree angle next to the box and printing. Focus on the printing on the box and then use the ruler as a guide as to whether it is front or back focusing. This set up was to test my 105 f1.4E on my D850:
crop of above.