abc123brian
Well-known member
Nikon Rumors says the 800mm F/6.3 development announcement will be tonight. Looking forward to hearing more about it, but I worry about the price.
the 800 f6.3S VR PF for Z system....
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arbitrage
Well-known member
I don't think we will be getting a price tonight. Hoping they will confirm it is PF but I can't see how it isn't PF given the length on the roadmap.
Considering an 800 f/5.6 costs almost $16K...how much do you think a 1/3 slower aperture is going to drop the price from that lofty starting point??
Considering an 800 f/5.6 costs almost $16K...how much do you think a 1/3 slower aperture is going to drop the price from that lofty starting point??
abc123brian
Well-known member
Hopefully it knocks about $13K off,
. They did surprise many with the Z9 pricing but I suspect this lens will be over $10K. The 200-600mm will be more practical for me anyway, but it would be nice to have 800mm at times.vivid
Member
Anything below $8k would be a pleasant surprise, I think. Hopefully this is a sub 6 lbs lens with reasonable MFD.
I'm not buying that it's going to be a f/6.3. At f/6.3 I don't imagine it would be small enough to warrant losing f/5.6 over. If it's going to be heavy and big enough for a tripod, I'd prefer the traditional f/5.6. Or maybe my hunch is completely wrong because I'm not a lens designer.
Edit: As previously stated, I'm not a lens designer hahaha.
Edit: As previously stated, I'm not a lens designer hahaha.
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padrepaul
Well-known member
I'm real curious about this lens. I own the 800 5.6, but I got it at a discount refurbished and I love it. It's what caused me to jump to Nikon. Optically it's great, so I'm not sure how it could be improved upon save for weight. I couldn't see myself parting with it and losing a half stop but as someone who has the Z9 preordered with NPS and checks Nikon Rumors and forums about 70 times a day for any update on it, I'm planning on using my current lenses for quite some time on the Z9 - so will be real curious about the price and when it is out how it compares to the current 800 5.6.
They made the development announcement and it is PF and it's f6.3. It sounds fantastic, but unfortunately there's no info on weight and price.
fcotterill
Well-known member
I'm utterly delighted they have fast tracked this remarkable PF prime! It had appeared its release was 2023 possibly, and still tentative.. because the roadmap is not set in stone.
And it's remarkable they have leveraged their engineering expertise to design such wide PhaseFresnel element. If it follows existing designs, this element has to be 127mm diameter.
nikonrumors.com
And it's remarkable they have leveraged their engineering expertise to design such wide PhaseFresnel element. If it follows existing designs, this element has to be 127mm diameter.
Nikon Nikkor Z 800mm f/6.3 VR S lens development announcement - Nikon Rumors
As previously reported, Nikon made a development announcement for the Nikkor Z 800mm f/6.3 mirrorless lens (the lens is already listed at B&H Photo but there is no pricing): Nikon is developing the NIKKOR Z 800mm f/6.3 VR S, a super-telephoto prime lens for the Nikon Z mount system December 14...
nikonrumors.com
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Just received an email from Nikon.
I have to say that’s interesting but I suspect it will be pretty expensive. Likely it will still make more sense to buy a 600F4.
I am exactly where you are, but with the 600 FL. Unless the new Z600 has some kind of magical properties, I'm running my FL into the ground. I am however socking away money for the Z800.
Egg on my face. Nikon is coming out of the woodwork with all this stuff huh.
fcotterill
Well-known member
The 400 PF is the other intriguing S Line prime, with silhouette of similar dimensions to the 70-200 f2.8S
a f4.5 if not f4.3
Too many choices!
a f4.5 if not f4.3
Too many choices!
John Navitsky
Well-known member
what i don’t quite get is why get the 400pf over the 100-400?
padrepaul
Well-known member
Admittedly not sure what the Z800 is. But the 600 is wonderful too from what I've seen. I own the 500 PF 5.6 which is great, and that 800 5.6 is just incredible for birds. It's hard to see a reason to move to Z glass now; the body will provide the AF tracking and unless there is something magical like you I think I'll sit tight for a few years with my current lens lineup as it does all I could want. Lighter sure would be nice but not for the cost and it's fine on a tripod mounted properly.
If the 600mm F4 (if such a lens materializes) w a TC built-in comes to market, it will over 600 and 840 focal lengths. That will overlap with the 800 PF though the PF will most likely be measurably lighter.
thelordofthelight
Well-known member
Wow..never thought the 800 PF would be an f6.3...I don't see an FL in the description so i feel it may not be as astronomically over priced like the 800mm 5.6 FL lens. I think Nikon may surprise us by pricing this competitively under the 400 2.8/ 600 f4.
If it is priced right and has significant weight advantages (say under 2.5KGs/ 5.5 Pounds), this will be a dream lens for birders.
I now have my doubts if the 600 f4 would have an in-built TC.
If it is priced right and has significant weight advantages (say under 2.5KGs/ 5.5 Pounds), this will be a dream lens for birders.
I now have my doubts if the 600 f4 would have an in-built TC.
thelordofthelight
Well-known member
I now doubt the 600 F4 will have an inbuilt TC. If it does then one thing for sure is it will push the already overpriced Sony 600 GM to the second spot (in terms of pricing LoL)
fcotterill
Well-known member
I've also been asking the same question. The obvious answer is superior image quality, and bokeh. I'm hearing intitial feedback the bokeh of the 100-400 S is one of the few gripes... but it's not even shipping yet.
The final specifications of the Z roadmap are not yet set in stone for any lens, until announced as an "in development" press release. So we can expect surprises. On the premise of today's 800 f6.3S PF, it's clear Nikon is now confident they can mass produce phase-fresnel elements of ø127mm diameter [edit see Pg 4 if PF may be smaller in different optical formula]; so theoretically Nikon can produce a 400 f4.3 of 130 X 220mm (similar proportions to the Fat Man aka 200 f2G). This is based on length of the existing 400 f5.6 patent - links above
Significantly lighter... We can consider 2.5kg versus 4.57 for 800 f5.6E FL, and 600 f4E FL weighs 3.8kg
The final specifications of the Z roadmap are not yet set in stone for any lens, until announced as an "in development" press release. So we can expect surprises. On the premise of today's 800 f6.3S PF, it's clear Nikon is now confident they can mass produce phase-fresnel elements of ø127mm diameter [edit see Pg 4 if PF may be smaller in different optical formula]; so theoretically Nikon can produce a 400 f4.3 of 130 X 220mm (similar proportions to the Fat Man aka 200 f2G). This is based on length of the existing 400 f5.6 patent - links above
Significantly lighter... We can consider 2.5kg versus 4.57 for 800 f5.6E FL, and 600 f4E FL weighs 3.8kg
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400 w/ built in TC, makes the 500 F4 less appealing. 600 w/ built in TC makes the 800 F5.6 interesting. Nikon might be greedy on pricing, rather go for volume, replace the existing stock of super teles.
fcotterill
Well-known member
If the prime on launch corresponds to the existing silhouette in the roadmap, then back-of-the-envelope ratios (calculated off the 100-400 S) puts this 800 f6.3 at approx 140 x 315 mm 143 x 377 mm [EDIT] overall dimensions.
Without a reliable Phase-Fresnel scaling factor for telephoto mass, the weight is harder to guesstimate, but 58% of 4.59kg = 2.66 for a hypothetical 800 f5.6, so a 800 f6.3S PF can be expected to weigh < 2.5kg, perhaps even 2.3kg.
Consider the 300 PF @ 89 x 148 mm, 0.755kg [58% of the 1.295kg 300 f4AFD, without its tripod collar] and 500 PF @ 106-237 mm, 1.46kg. Compared to the 4.59kg 800 f5.6E FL of 160 x 461 mm, the 143 x 377 mm [EDIT]140 x 315 mm 800 f6.3S PF has undergone a major slimming! One often reads forum posts stating a 3kg telephoto is about their maximum comfortable handholding weight, but I manage short durations with 5.3kg of 400 f2.8E & D5 with TC2, so I another who finds that handholding the 500 PF is a doddle.
I also learnt years ago how a heavy DSLR is a key to balance a long heavy lens. Poor weight distribution can be a killer IME if a telephoto is 'front-end heavy', this makes a 300 f2.8G VRII harder to handhold than the much better balanced 400 f2.8E FL
Besides this 800 f6.3 PF trimming major weight for handholding, hiking and flying, we also know the Z MILC AF works reliably at lens speeds slower than f8. So the superior image quality of the TZTC14 and ZTC2 underscore even more bonuses.
This is the Z system and Nikon's newfound era of bending/breaking ye olde rules for lenses and cameras; we are seeing examples in sensors, high-end video specs in MILCs, Autofocus besides optics. Within the past decade, consider Nikon Df, 58 f1.4G, 300 f4 PF; 500 f5.6 PF, 70-200 f2.8S, then 180-400 f4TC14 and 120-300 f2.8E matching if not overtaking quality of their best primes etc. And soon there will be the 400 f2.8S TC14 and 800 f6.3S PF.... [edit]
We can expect to be surprised, pleasantly surprised
Without a reliable Phase-Fresnel scaling factor for telephoto mass, the weight is harder to guesstimate, but 58% of 4.59kg = 2.66 for a hypothetical 800 f5.6, so a 800 f6.3S PF can be expected to weigh < 2.5kg, perhaps even 2.3kg.
Consider the 300 PF @ 89 x 148 mm, 0.755kg [58% of the 1.295kg 300 f4AFD, without its tripod collar] and 500 PF @ 106-237 mm, 1.46kg. Compared to the 4.59kg 800 f5.6E FL of 160 x 461 mm, the 143 x 377 mm [EDIT]
I also learnt years ago how a heavy DSLR is a key to balance a long heavy lens. Poor weight distribution can be a killer IME if a telephoto is 'front-end heavy', this makes a 300 f2.8G VRII harder to handhold than the much better balanced 400 f2.8E FL
Besides this 800 f6.3 PF trimming major weight for handholding, hiking and flying, we also know the Z MILC AF works reliably at lens speeds slower than f8. So the superior image quality of the TZTC14 and ZTC2 underscore even more bonuses.
This is the Z system and Nikon's newfound era of bending/breaking ye olde rules for lenses and cameras; we are seeing examples in sensors, high-end video specs in MILCs, Autofocus besides optics. Within the past decade, consider Nikon Df, 58 f1.4G, 300 f4 PF; 500 f5.6 PF, 70-200 f2.8S, then 180-400 f4TC14 and 120-300 f2.8E matching if not overtaking quality of their best primes etc. And soon there will be the 400 f2.8S TC14 and 800 f6.3S PF.... [edit]
We can expect to be surprised, pleasantly surprised
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vulpess
Active member
That’s shorter than the Tamron 150-600 G2 zoomed to 600mm
Probably way out of my price range but exciting nevertheless!
pwaring
Well-known member
I'd love to know the cost but we'll be waiting a few months for that. I think expectations will vary wildly. I don't see them making a non-PF 800mm once this is out. I think this would sell far better if it is priced appropriately and it would leave only the most tiny market for an 800mm 5.6. On a really happy day I'd say this will be £5.5-6k. £6999 wouldn't shock me. £8-10k+ could happen but would definitely make me think about just getting the 600mm f4.
lwan
Well-known member
Pleasantly surprised that the first two big ones are the 400/2.8TC and this 800/6.3PF, I must say. Let's hope the 800 price won't be more toward the old 800's!
thelordofthelight
Well-known member
If Nikon can keep the weight of this lens under 2.5Kg, price it right like they did with the Z9 that's going to be one heck of a tele lens. All of a sudden the telephoto lens choices in Nikon look incredible. The never ending debate on 400 vs 500 vs 600 got even more complicated with so many variables like standard lenses vs ones with in-built TCs vs PF tech lenses plus the external TCs that can perform much better on mirrorless cameras. This is so much fun but my wallet isn't happy at all these days ;-)