Yeah this isn't ready for prime time for sure. Perhaps it will have lots more options and features when it's released.
Topaz labs issue
- Thread starter sh1209
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Just a bit curious. Are you using the CPU or the GPU to process? The new update is slow but the Radeon Pro 580 in my late 2017 makes better progress.
It is set to auto. They've also given me the download for denoise AI beta which works great
I suspect Topaz Sharpen keeps moving up the processing power needed from time to time. It gets slower as the power of new algorithms are added. At the moment switching from the auto setting in preferences on the Topaz sharpening plug in seems to have worked for me.
Not A Speck Of Cereal
Well-known member
I feel that Topaz has become less of a professional tool, more of a dumbed down consumer grade application. Putting all functions together into a single app is going further down that road (especially if they discontinue the individual apps), one that I won't follow. I stopped paying for updates as the versions I have do the job when I need them, but I strive to try and not need them as much.
I also wonder if they feel the need to change things to justify their subscription model. I don't have problem that way with the Adobe suite, as they're complicated and full featured. But the Topaz lab apps keep getting simpler? I would rather that their feature sets and under-the-hood tweakability grew over time, not the other way around.
Chris
I also wonder if they feel the need to change things to justify their subscription model. I don't have problem that way with the Adobe suite, as they're complicated and full featured. But the Topaz lab apps keep getting simpler? I would rather that their feature sets and under-the-hood tweakability grew over time, not the other way around.
Chris
I agree and would rather they stay separate for sure.
I would like to agree, BUT having just gone through a search through older NEF images taken years ago for a project, I find myself appreciating the newer features of Topaz DeNoise and Topaz Sharpen. I had used the older Topaz apps on some of the images before, but in this case I went back to the original NEF files and first fine tuned the amount of noise (they call it blur now) on the screen, and then the same with sharpening. I was able to get sharper images and cleaner images with the new versions without over doing it.
My older lenses clearly had some issues with sharpness and my focussing technique 10 or 12 years ago was not as good as it is now. I really appreciated the way older files could be brought up to speed. Sometimes it was motion blur, sometimes it was low light plus focus/lens blur.
More recent images often need no sharpening and the noise levels from the D500 is quite low compared to the old D90 with a kit lens.
All in all I have found Topaz Labs AI has done an excellent job for me and, for the current iteration of stand alone apps, changing the processing presences to use the GPU with 8gb of video ram has speeded up the processing very well.
Yes I like to complain about the updates from Topaz, but I also have to say, they have become indispensable apps and plug ins for me.
The quality of the results is unfortunately now much clearer to me.
(Pun intended
)
My older lenses clearly had some issues with sharpness and my focussing technique 10 or 12 years ago was not as good as it is now. I really appreciated the way older files could be brought up to speed. Sometimes it was motion blur, sometimes it was low light plus focus/lens blur.
More recent images often need no sharpening and the noise levels from the D500 is quite low compared to the old D90 with a kit lens.
All in all I have found Topaz Labs AI has done an excellent job for me and, for the current iteration of stand alone apps, changing the processing presences to use the GPU with 8gb of video ram has speeded up the processing very well.
Yes I like to complain about the updates from Topaz, but I also have to say, they have become indispensable apps and plug ins for me.
The quality of the results is unfortunately now much clearer to me.
(Pun intended
)
I still think the programs need to stay separate. I agree at this point that I can’t imagine not having such a software as well. Adobes noise reduction in photoshop and Lightroom has a lot to be desired. From what I’ve seen so far, photo AI picks one of the three on import that it sees best. I also have denoise AI beta as stand alone and it works really well. Sharpen is the only one I’ve ever had issues with. I have had demos of other programs and find topaz superior.I would like to agree, BUT having just gone through a search through older NEF images taken years ago for a project, I find myself appreciating the newer features of Topaz DeNoise and Topaz Sharpen. I had used the older Topaz apps on some of the images before, but in this case I went back to the original NEF files and first fine tuned the amount of noise (they call it blur now) on the screen, and then the same with sharpening. I was able to get sharper images and cleaner images with the new versions without over doing it.
My older lenses clearly had some issues with sharpness and my focussing technique 10 or 12 years ago was not as good as it is now. I really appreciated the way older files could be brought up to speed. Sometimes it was motion blur, sometimes it was low light plus focus/lens blur.
More recent images often need no sharpening and the noise levels from the D500 is quite low compared to the old D90 with a kit lens.
All in all I have found Topaz Labs AI has done an excellent job for me and, for the current iteration of stand alone apps, changing the processing presences to use the GPU with 8gb of video ram has speeded up the processing very well.
Yes I like to complain about the updates from Topaz, but I also have to say, they have become indispensable apps and plug ins for me.
The quality of the results is unfortunately now much clearer to me.
(Pun intended
Not A Speck Of Cereal
Well-known member
(emphasis mine)
They do what now? If DeNoise AI now refers to noise as Blur, what does Sharpen AI now call "Motion Blur"?
I'm glad it's working for you, but this is the kind of change to their apps I'm not in favor of. There are other noise reduction and sharpening apps out there; some of them have more functionality, some don't, but they all still use known terminology. I have found that other apps work as well as Topaz too, though since they offer more flexibility, one can misuse them (usually over-doing it).
Chris
Ah language and linguistics are interesting topics.
Blur is a lovely euphemism isn’t it? It is,I guess, the opposite of sharp, so maybe it is OK. The program is called sharpen!
The difference between motion blur and lens blur is not entirely clear. If the subject is moving and your speed is a bit slow OR you are moving a bit, I think that is motion blur. If the subject is still and the lens is not especially sharp at that focal length, that is,I guess, “lens blur” (My early variable aperture Nikkor 70-300 zoom was not really sharp at anything beyond 200 for example)
I now prefer to use prime lenses anyway.
The trick with sharpen is to use as little as you can. In my older pictures sometimes I needed quite a lot to remove the ….. blur and get it …….sharp. I find having different modes a bit unsettling but i have also found that for some images a different mode works better. Most of the time you may find they are not needed, but my older images I thought were OK at the time have now been nicely updated.
The risk is over-sharpening, which is not at all desirable. Not everything needs to be sharper.
Blur is a lovely euphemism isn’t it? It is,I guess, the opposite of sharp, so maybe it is OK. The program is called sharpen!
The difference between motion blur and lens blur is not entirely clear. If the subject is moving and your speed is a bit slow OR you are moving a bit, I think that is motion blur. If the subject is still and the lens is not especially sharp at that focal length, that is,I guess, “lens blur” (My early variable aperture Nikkor 70-300 zoom was not really sharp at anything beyond 200 for example)
I now prefer to use prime lenses anyway.
The trick with sharpen is to use as little as you can. In my older pictures sometimes I needed quite a lot to remove the ….. blur and get it …….sharp. I find having different modes a bit unsettling but i have also found that for some images a different mode works better. Most of the time you may find they are not needed, but my older images I thought were OK at the time have now been nicely updated.
The risk is over-sharpening, which is not at all desirable. Not everything needs to be sharper.
Not A Speck Of Cereal
Well-known member
Well, after mentioning both apps, I guess when you said "fine tuned the amount of noise (they call it blur now)", I assumed by the use of the term 'noise' was referring to DeNoise AI. Adding to the confusing, I remember now that Denoise AI has a sharpen slider, and Sharpen AI has a denoise slider.
Perhaps the confusion in these few responses points out how Topaz obfuscates by combining concepts and terminology. I've never had this problem with other apps. Perhaps when it's all in one app, those points will be simplified (along with everything else in their toolset).
Chris
I think in the majority of images that denoise alone is more than enough and sometimes even that needs reduced at times. In my case, the implementation of models is what has caused problems for whatever reason.
wassa1957
Active member
I did have a similar problem and I had remove all traces before reinstalling. I skimmed the responses so I'm sure you are doing reinstall after cleaning out the old? It worked for me.
Warwick
Warwick
Yes I cleared the p list in library and everything. It works fine with the older version. Hopefully they’ll have an update soon.
Darrellhar
Well-known member
I just watched a recent video about the photo AI product. You may want to update your version as it seems to be getting a lot better. I’m going to long into my Topaz account to see if I can download it as I own all three products.
wassa1957
Active member
I can only say I have used both Topaz products for many years. The product is definitely getting better. The mask is a good addition. The speed of processing increases with more RAM and graphics card. They term changes are explained and you get used to them.
I guess it's just personal taste.
The JPEG issue I haven't tried. I also use Gigapixel but that's extra cost. I'll try it and see if I get a reduction.
Interesting points of view.
I guess it's just personal taste.
The JPEG issue I haven't tried. I also use Gigapixel but that's extra cost. I'll try it and see if I get a reduction.
Interesting points of view.
For initial noise I have moved to DXO Pure Raw 2 which seems to do the job quite simply but not quickly. I use topaz as the last step after Pure Raw->Camera Raw->Photoshop->Topaz
John 2
Well-known member
I went through a period of most of my Topaz plugins doing what you describe. It seemed to come and go with each update of the operating system depending on the plugin in question. An IT Pro at work suggested that the problem might be the operating system which as incremental updates are added, can get out of sync and become a bit messy (not a good description but you get the idea). He recommended a clean install of what in my case was Windows 10 on a PC. Rebuilding the PC software load is not for everybody and is no small task but it solved the problem for me.
As good as Topaz products are, I find them a little flaky. In my Windows world, DeNoise AI sometimes starts as a plug in with PS, sometimes not. I also don't like that they include incessant plugs for renewals and upgrades, and that occasionally I have to change video card priorities after an upgrade. Nonetheless, I still enjoy using the products when they work.
agrumpyoldsod
Well-known member
In case you folk missed it there is a NEW Topaz Photo AI product - Anthony does another great job describing what it does. If you own the Image Quality bundle you can download and activate a pre-release version for free to play with. - Topaz Photo AI - Anthony's video -- this product combines Denoise, Sharpen and GigaPixel into ONE even smarter and quicker product.
Saying that - I did "claim" the product from my Topaz account, download and install it and then hit a roadblock when it came to activating it - I was not alone and Topaz support are acting on it.
Saying that - I did "claim" the product from my Topaz account, download and install it and then hit a roadblock when it came to activating it - I was not alone and Topaz support are acting on it.
Bennvdm
Active member
Same with me on Windows 10 pro on 7700h i7 laptop with Nvidia 1050 gpu. Tried loading different intel & nvidia driver versions with dxdiag dumps send to Topaz support, but in the end only full windows re-install solved my issue.
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I have downloaded the version available to me which is Topaz Photo AI 0.5.0.
@sh1209 Note that you have Topaz Photo Beta 1.0.0.9b running?
All testing was going well until I tried to save results, each time I try I get an error "ERROR Could not run model", makes no difference to which type of file nor what settings I choose, so nothing to report on results.
No 64bit PS plugins that are recognised by non Adobe products it would seem, the same with Gigapixel, so I cannot use them as a plugin with the software I use, so only stand alone use for me.
A waiting game until a production version is available, even then I question its use to me.
@sh1209 Note that you have Topaz Photo Beta 1.0.0.9b running?
All testing was going well until I tried to save results, each time I try I get an error "ERROR Could not run model", makes no difference to which type of file nor what settings I choose, so nothing to report on results.
No 64bit PS plugins that are recognised by non Adobe products it would seem, the same with Gigapixel, so I cannot use them as a plugin with the software I use, so only stand alone use for me.
A waiting game until a production version is available, even then I question its use to me.
Yeah the beta version has a lot to be desired and really screws up the color. I’ve stopped using it and still can’t download and use the lastest version of sharpen. They’re telling me a newer version will be released in a couple weeks. I would rather have the programs separate.
I downloaded and tried Photo AI today. It's Photo AI 0.5.0. I have't had any of the issues described earlier. FWIW, I'm running it on a MacBook Pro M1. The colors and exposure aren't changed at all. Saving the file worked just fine and took me back to Lightroom just like Denoise did. It also was very snappy, with the possible exception of the initial "scanning image".
Regarding the sharpening, while I've only looked at a couple images, it seems that the level of sharpening that was done in Denoise is still being done in PhotoAI when you only use Denoise (i.e., don't enable sharpening). The main difference appears to be that you can't control the level of denoise and sharpening independently (again I'm referring to when you only have denoise enabled). You just have a "strength" which appears to primarily affect the level of denoise and then it decides how much sharpening to apply. Enabling sharpening seems to give similar results as using SharpenAI which I find tends to be a bit too much for my tastes, especially without masking. It really did a doozy on my beautiful 800f5.6 backgrounds. The few times I've used SharpenAI I've always masked so that it wouldn't mess with the background. PhotoAI is generating a mask, so hopefully masked sharpening will be available at some point.
I compared a few photos I had done in denoise with what PhotoAI did and, at least for those photos, I tended to like the PhotoAI version better. Interestingly, the auto pilot marked each of the photos as having "severe noise", even though they were taken in bright daylight with ISOs between 64 and 220 on my Z9 and I didn't really see a whole lot of noise in the photos.
Regarding the sharpening, while I've only looked at a couple images, it seems that the level of sharpening that was done in Denoise is still being done in PhotoAI when you only use Denoise (i.e., don't enable sharpening). The main difference appears to be that you can't control the level of denoise and sharpening independently (again I'm referring to when you only have denoise enabled). You just have a "strength" which appears to primarily affect the level of denoise and then it decides how much sharpening to apply. Enabling sharpening seems to give similar results as using SharpenAI which I find tends to be a bit too much for my tastes, especially without masking. It really did a doozy on my beautiful 800f5.6 backgrounds. The few times I've used SharpenAI I've always masked so that it wouldn't mess with the background. PhotoAI is generating a mask, so hopefully masked sharpening will be available at some point.
I compared a few photos I had done in denoise with what PhotoAI did and, at least for those photos, I tended to like the PhotoAI version better. Interestingly, the auto pilot marked each of the photos as having "severe noise", even though they were taken in bright daylight with ISOs between 64 and 220 on my Z9 and I didn't really see a whole lot of noise in the photos.
Mine was the beta version I didn’t know the real deal was available for download