Upgrade to D500 or 300 mm PF +tc for BIF?

[Lize]

I have been reading and learning from all the great posts on this forum from day one. I registered today to ask a question on a dilemma I have:
I shoot wildlife, using currently a Nikon D7200 and Nikon 200-500. I also have a Z50 with the 50-250 kit lens; with these two combos I get good results for general wildlife close up and far way, most often shooting from a vehicle (on a beanbag for the 200-500), in our national parks in South Africa. On occasion I also visit water bodies where I do handheld BIF shooting, but here I really struggle. As a female (also getting a bit on in years), handholding the 200-500, whether on the D7200 or Z50 with FTZ, becomes difficult very quickly due to fatigue. Either as a result of this, or the lacking AF system on the cameras, my keeper rate is not high enough. At the moment, I can either upgrade the D7200 to a D500, or buy a 300 mm PF lens with teleconverter for BIF ( in this case I will keep the 200-500 for its versatility, and shooting from a vehicle). I am shooting wildlife only the last two years, so obviously my technique can also be quite improved ( I have bought and studied all of Steve’s books!). My question is, what would give me immediate improvement in success with BIF, the better camera or the lighter lens? Financially, I cannot really justify buying both. The 500 mm PF lens is also out of the question for me. Thanks in advance for any suggestions!

 

[gaknott]

Hello Lize, welcome to the forum!! I am certain you will get some very knowledgeable and experienced answers here. I also have the D7200 +200-500 combo for wildlife, along with a D850. The upgrade to a D500 would help your keeper rate due to AF system and overall camera capabilities, however this will not address the fatigue issue you currently have. I would also like to improve my keeper rate with the D7200 but I get good results in the right situations. That combo provides excellent results if you have favorable light, reasonable distance from subject and good technique. I would also like to upgrade mine but I have already spent all that is reasonable this year (D850 + 24-70 2.8). I am interested to see further replies to your inquiry. It may help me, as well!

 

[Steve]

Welcome to the forums

The D500 will very likely net you a higher keeper rate, but it really sounds like what's holding you back is the overall weight of the rig, so I too vote for the D7200 + 300PF.

 

[Lize]

Thank you for all the welcomes, this is a great forum for learning about wildlife photography! I am also starting to think the 300 pf would be the better choice; I already love walking around with the Z50 and the 50-250, the reach is just not good enough for birds, except maybe at our garden feeder. I guess another option would be to wait for the Z 200-600 to pair with Z50, but who knows what the weight savings would be compared to the 200-500?

 

[Steve]

Thank you for all the welcomes, this is a great forum for learning about wildlife photography! I am also starting to think the 300 pf would be the better choice; I already love walking around with the Z50 and the 50-250, the reach is just not good enough for birds, except maybe at our garden feeder. I guess another option would be to wait for the Z 200-600 to pair with Z50, but who knows what the weight savings would be compared to the 200-500?

If it's like the Sony 200-600, it may be heavier than the 200-500!

 

[BillW]

I have shot the 300 mm PF with a 1.4x TCIII on my D500, D850 and my Z7 and Z6 bodies. I have used it for birds while hiking in Iceland, walking around a local wildlife refuge and while shooting from a kayak in Northern Minnesota. With the 1.4x TCIII, it will give you 420 mm of focal length, so not as much reach as your 200-500 mm lens. But more reach than your 50-250 mm lens. The optical quality of the 300 mm PF is quite good and it takes the 1.4x TCIII quite well. It is f5.6 with the TC. so should focus fine with your D7200 (which can focus with a f8 lens, with limited focus point availability) and Z50. And compared to your 200-500 (a nice and versatile lens), it is much easier to carry and maneuver.

Of course with most birds, you can never get enough focal length. I have also used the 200-500 mm and 500 mm PF. Since I got a 500 mm PF, I have used it most of the time unless I want a very light rig. I understand that is not a possibility for you now. You could also use the 1.7x TCII with the 300 mm PF -- more reach (510mm), but slower autofocus and a bit less sharpness.

The D500 would be better for focusing on BIF, but if the 200-500 mm lens is too heavy to maneuver, that will not help much. Maybe over time you can get both the D500 and 300 mm PF or add a 500 mm PF. Good luck. Bird photography is addictive.

 

[Lize]

I have shot the 300 mm PF with a 1.4x TCIII on my D500, D850 and my Z7 and Z6 bodies. I have used it for birds while hiking in Iceland, walking around a local wildlife refuge and while shooting from a kayak in Northern Minnesota. With the 1.4x TCIII, it will give you 420 mm of focal length, so not as much reach as your 200-500 mm lens. But more reach than your 50-250 mm lens. The optical quality of the 300 mm PF is quite good and it takes the 1.4x TCIII quite well. It is f5.6 with the TC. so should focus fine with your D7200 (which can focus with a f8 lens, with limited focus point availability) and Z50. And compared to your 200-500 (a nice and versatile lens), it is much easier to carry and maneuver.

Of course with most birds, you can never get enough focal length. I have also used the 200-500 mm and 500 mm PF. Since I got a 500 mm PF, I have used it most of the time unless I want a very light rig. I understand that is not a possibility for you now. You could also use the 1.7x TCII with the 300 mm PF -- more reach (510mm), but slower autofocus and a bit less sharpness.

The D500 would be better for focusing on BIF, but if the 200-500 mm lens is too heavy to maneuver, that will not help much. Maybe over time you can get both the D500 and 300 mm PF or add a 500 mm PF. Good luck. Bird photography is addictive.

Thank you! And I agree with the addictive comment!

 

[Replytoken]

Have you considered using a monopod with the 200-500? It is not really a handheld lens for any great length of time, and a monopod will take the weight off of your arms and shoulders. Now a monopod does not work for all styles of shooting, but it is reasonably affordable if it has some appeal. Otherwise, if the 300 or 300+TC gives you the reach, then that sounds like a good use of funds. I think that you might enjoy the D500, but with a grip, it is certainly bigger and heavier than the D7200.

Good luck,

--Ken

 

[JAS]

Look at Steve's videos on this site. He has some good tips on using a monopod. I use one with my D750/200-500 combo for wildlife including birds. BIF still harder because of need to swing your body a lot. There are tips on how to stand to improve your keeper rate that way too.

 

[Lize]

Good suggestions on using a monopod - thanks! Gives me another option to consider. Would a Sirui ballhead that I already have for my tripod be OK for use on a monopod, or will the Wimberley monopod gimbal be much easier to use?

 

[JAS]

Good suggestions on using a monopod - thanks! Gives me another option to consider. Would a Sirui ballhead that I already have for my tripod be OK for use on a monopod, or will the Wimberley monopod gimbal be much easier to use?

Steve has a post where he suggests using in gimbal head. I do not have a dedicated gimbal yet so I use a Sidekicj style gimbal on my ball head and it wirks fine. Monopod is one leg of my meFoto tripod which works great for me. Typically mount to an Arca Swiss Plate on the telephoto lens. Hope this helps.

 

[Lize]

With a monopod you don’t need in fact a head.
A ‘lot of shooters’ outthere using their rig directly attached to the monopod.
They tilt/shift/rotate the monopod.
One way to do it, not mine..

Another option is a ballhead but a ballhead is 3-way so to much.
You don’t wantmore than the possibility to tilt and pan your rig.

A gimbal is for telework the nicest option (when you need support, for fast BIF and such I allways tend to lift the entire rig and shoot handheld LOL)

The Wimberley monopod head Allthough I like the concept I wouldn’t recommend it to use with a 300PF.
The PF is simply too short and that means you’ll have the monopod obstructing you to handle the lens or grip depending on which side you’re mounting the camera.

I’d recommend to take a look at the conventional monopod heads.
A Sirui is a good option (not the very best, there are others but they are at least double/triple as expensive and absolutely not double let alone triple as good)

/edit
THIS one (load capacity 55 LBS) or
THIS one (load capacity 33 LBS)

Thank you!

 

[Lize]

Steve has a post where he suggests using in gimbal head. I do not have a dedicated gimbal yet so I use a Sidekicj style gimbal on my ball head and it wirks fine. Monopod is one leg of my meFoto tripod which works great for me. Typically mount to an Arca Swiss Plate on the telephoto lens. Hope this helps.

Thanks!

 

[gaknott]

Sometimes, one solution does not address all situations. A quick spotting of something is captured handheld; if you are hiking a trail or through some area a monopod with a gimbal head may be the answer; I find that if I am shooting a location where I am in one spot (or within an area) to shoot something specific for some amount of time, a tripod with a gimbal is the optimum solution, especially if there is a lot of waiting for the critter to appear.

 

[gaknott]

I agree, FTR personally I wouldn’t use a monopod nor a tripod for a 300PF at all.
Imo one takes one of the greatest props of that little powerpackage away when mounting it on a monopod/tripod when shooting in good light aka sufficient fast shutterspeeds.
Like you said there’s no single solution to adress multiple situations and I’d ad situations are assessed differently by different folks.
I often read this or that lens is to heavy to shoot it handheld and I happen to shoot it exclusively handheld.
Well I use the knee and elbow method or I look for branches or rocks when I get tired or need a bit more stable platform because shutterspeeds drop beyond I know when I need more support.

I totally agree, Roger. I rarely use the tripod, especially for birds, unless I am watching something like an eagles nest and waiting for the juvies to exercise their wings or hop up on a branch. It is also good for a starting point for birds in flight if you know where they are perched.

 

[PointTakenWI]

Good suggestions on using a monopod - thanks! Gives me another option to consider. Would a Sirui ballhead that I already have for my tripod be OK for use on a monopod, or will the Wimberley monopod gimbal be much easier to use?

I concur on the monopod for a heavier rig with BIF or wildlife in general. I use it to take the weight off while waiting for action, then just pick the whole thing up while shooting. It isn't ideal but it does help lengthen the shoot.

 

[BorderBirder]

If weight is an issue the 300PF is a total delight and works very well with the 1.4 teleconverter and f5.6. I have written elsewhere on the forum that I tried a 500mm PF on two occasions for a week but could not convinced that it actually took better images. And I was trying hard because I loved the idea of it ! With the 300Pf and the 1.4 I walk out every day by the local river and am always ready. This helped me catch a kingfisher in flight, heron catching fish and dipper feeding her young for example. Because of the lightness of the lens you can also carry the combo in a holster type case which is so easy and you don’t need to be protecting the camera lens mount to the same extent when carrying it. All of this is on a D500, but I had excellent results in a D5500 which is similar to but not as good as the D7200. You won’t get as many BIF shots in focus as on a D500 but I think it would be a great combo, and a little lighter than D500, and with the dual control dials the D5500 frustratingly lacks! All the best

 

[Lize]

If weight is an issue the 300PF is a total delight and works very well with the 1.4 teleconverter and f5.6. I have written elsewhere on the forum that I tried a 500mm PF on two occasions for a week but could not convinced that it actually took better images. And I was trying hard because I loved the idea of it ! With the 300Pf and the 1.4 I walk out every day by the local river and am always ready. This helped me catch a kingfisher in flight, heron catching fish and dipper feeding her young for example. Because of the lightness of the lens you can also carry the combo in a holster type case which is so easy and you don’t need to be protecting the camera lens mount to the same extent when carrying it. All of this is on a D500, but I had excellent results in a D5500 which is similar to but not as good as the D7200. You won’t get as many BIF shots in focus as on a D500 but I think it would be a great combo, and a little lighter than D500, and with the dual control dials the D5500 frustratingly lacks! All the best

Thank you! The 300pf is really starting to look like a good fit for me - a lens I will be able to use for a long time into older age.

 

[Ken Miracle]

I have been reading and learning from all the great posts on this forum from day one. I registered today to ask a question on a dilemma I have:
I shoot wildlife, using currently a Nikon D7200 and Nikon 200-500. I also have a Z50 with the 50-250 kit lens; with these two combos I get good results for general wildlife close up and far way, most often shooting from a vehicle (on a beanbag for the 200-500), in our national parks in South Africa. On occasion I also visit water bodies where I do handheld BIF shooting, but here I really struggle. As a female (also getting a bit on in years), handholding the 200-500, whether on the D7200 or Z50 with FTZ, becomes difficult very quickly due to fatigue. Either as a result of this, or the lacking AF system on the cameras, my keeper rate is not high enough. At the moment, I can either upgrade the D7200 to a D500, or buy a 300 mm PF lens with teleconverter for BIF ( in this case I will keep the 200-500 for its versatility, and shooting from a vehicle). I am shooting wildlife only the last two years, so obviously my technique can also be quite improved ( I have bought and studied all of Steve’s books!). My question is, what would give me immediate improvement in success with BIF, the better camera or the lighter lens? Financially, I cannot really justify buying both. The 500 mm PF lens is also out of the question for me. Thanks in advance for any suggestions!

Late to the party. I am 72 but blessed to be able to workout regularly and so weight of my gear that I handhold is not a major issue for me. My favorite subject is birds in flight. I had a D7200 and a Nikon 200-500 I have since sold both. I used a D500 with the nikon 200-500 on a trip to South Africa. The leopard shot attached was taken in strong backlight conditions with the D500 and 200-500 combo in Inyati. I also used the 300pf and a 1.4tc on my D500 and my D850 with good results the American Wigeon attached was taken with a D500 and the 300PF with the 1.4TC. When the 500 PF came out then final review that @Steve published on the 500 PF pushed me over the edge and I sold the 300PF and bought a 500PF ... it is a great lens. Currently I use a D500 with a Tamron 150-600 G2 the most for birding including BIF and have been published, sold images (by accident), I am retired not a pro, and won a couple of local contests with that combo used on BIF. However I would give the edge on focus speed to the D850 with the 500PF combination. Another caveat is my 850 has the MB-D18 multi battery pack and BL-5 battery cover and I use the EN-EL 18c battery in it to get a faster frame rate in continuous high speed shooting (CH) but it is a heavy camera with the grip and big battery. The 500PF and a D500 would be a very good light weight combo. Since your budget is not ready for the 500 pf at this point one thing to consider is the D500 as it is a good value right now (I have 2 one without a battery grip and a Tamron 18-400 is my grab and go and long steep terrain hiking rig). My wife can not handhold like I do and does not shoot a lot of birds in flight but she is quite happy with her Z50 and a Tamron 18-400 that is the only combo she uses. You could get a D500 and add a 500 PF as your budget allows.

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[Lize]

Late to the party. I am 72 but blessed to be able to workout regularly and so weight of my gear that I handhold is not a major issue for me. My favorite subject is birds in flight. I had a D7200 and a Nikon 200-500 I have since sold both. I used a D500 with the nikon 200-500 on a trip to South Africa. The leopard shot attached was taken in strong backlight conditions with the D500 and 200-500 combo in Inyati. I also used the 300pf and a 1.4tc on my D500 and my D850 with good results the American Wigeon attached was taken with a D500 and the 300PF with the 1.4TC. When the 500 PF came out then final review that @Steve published on the 500 PF pushed me over the edge and I sold the 300PF and bought a 500PF ... it is a great lens. Currently I use a D500 with a Tamron 150-600 G2 the most for birding including BIF and have been published, sold images (by accident), I am retired not a pro, and won a couple of local contests with that combo used on BIF. However I would give the edge on focus speed to the D850 with the 500PF combination. Another caveat is my 850 has the MB-D18 multi battery pack and BL-5 battery cover and I use the EN-EL 18c battery in it to get a faster frame rate in continuous high speed shooting (CH) but it is a heavy camera with the grip and big battery. The 500PF and a D500 would be a very good light weight combo. Since your budget is not ready for the 500 pf at this point one thing to consider is the D500 as it is a good value right now (I have 2 one without a battery grip and a Tamron 18-400 is my grab and go and long steep terrain hiking rig). My wife can not handhold like I do and does not shoot a lot of birds in flight but she is quite happy with her Z50 and a Tamron 18-400 that is the only combo she uses. You could get a D500 and add a 500 PF as your budget allows. View attachment 7760View attachment 7761

Absolutely fantastic images! I will be visiting both our Kgalagadi and Kruger National Parks in the next two months, and if I can get a leopard photo just half as good as yours, I will be super happy! I have just purchased an amazing deal on a barely used D500, and super excited to try it out with the 200-500.

 

[Ken Miracle]

Absolutely fantastic images! I will be visiting both our Kgalagadi and Kruger National Parks in the next two months, and if I can get a leopard photo just half as good as yours, I will be super happy! I have just purchased an amazing deal on a barely used D500, and super excited to try it out with the 200-500.

Have fun and good luck with the Leopard. We were really blessed to photograph Black and White Rhino, Elephant including calves less than a week old, Hippo, Malachite Kingfishers, Lion, African Wild Dogs and so much more. At one point I had over 2,000 Leopard images from that trip and still have hundreds on my external hard drives and printed.

 

[Waldo3]

Good suggestions on using a monopod - thanks! Gives me another option to consider. Would a Sirui ballhead that I already have for my tripod be OK for use on a monopod, or will the Wimberley monopod gimbal be much easier to use?

I have the Wimberley monogimbal and it works very well. Watch his video on this.

Jim

 

[DripDryMcFleye]

You're going to like your D500. I really like mine. Any time spent learning to use the features and capabilities of it will increase your enjoyment even more. It's a really good choice for your purposes. Here's another suggestion: Get some hand weights and use them about every second or third day to build strength in your arms. You don't want to do this every day because, as an older person, your muscles need more rest time to recover. My wife (age 73) has been doing this for quite a while and it has definitely helped her strength. She has both 3lb and 8lb weights. She says that she now uses the 8lb weights exclusively.

 

[arbitrage]

I'd think a D500 will make a bigger difference than going to the 300PF over 200-500.

 

[Calson]

I owned the D7200 and it was an excellent camera and with remarkable noise control at high ISO settings. It relies on the autofocus system first introduced by Nikon in 2007 and that is its shortcoming. The D500 has the new generation of autofocus which includes mor cross sensors and a dedicated autofocus processor. Same system as is used in the D5 and D850 cameras. I also shot with the D750 which introduced a sometimes usable Group AF capability but its proformance left a great deal to be desired. Group AF on the D500 was completely different and far more effective and photographing hummers darting about it locked focus accurately nearly 100% of the time and I was very impressed.

Two things help me with a heavy camera and lens setup. One is the use of a neoprene camera strap that acts a little like a shock absorber and saves my neck. The second is a Kirk Security Strap that I use with my 8 lb lens with a 3 lb camera attached. I sling the Kirk strap over my head and shoulder and then carry the lens supported by the strap at waist level. I only need one hand to keep it from swinging around at all. $20 Op/Tech camera strap and $80 Kirk SS-1 Security Strap work for me and the Kirk strap can be used with an lens foot that will fit in an Arca Swiss clamp.