jhorsch
Active member
Have been taught (and read) not to delete files in camera. Is that still true with modern cards and cameras (D500 and Z7)?
Deleting files in camera
- Thread starter jhorsch
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Palouse
Well-known member
It's what I do, having had the same educating and reading that you did!
abc123brian
Well-known member
I didn’t because I always heard the same thing, then I recently began doing it without issue. Then I received an email from ProGrade Digital discussing a different reason not to do it so I’ll be going back to not doing it. There reasoning makes me concerned for doing it on SSDs too, so not sure what to do, lol.
progradedigital.com
Improve Your Memory Card Speed with Refresh Pro | ProGrade Digital, Inc
Learn how Refresh Pro keeps your memory card running like new by maintaining your card’s capacity and speed with our Health and Sanitize functions. Read now!
progradedigital.com
I am guilty of doing this more than I know I should. Sometimes when I am reviewing images (I guess "chimping" is the old term for this) I just reflexively delete ones that are terrible. I guess I should stop doing that.
Say an unnamed person has been guilty of deleting files in camera but doesn't have Prograde cards. What can such a person do to get rid of the fragmentation? Full format in a card reader? I assume that Refresh Pro won't work on my Sony Tough cards. Oops, I mean this unnamed person's Sony Tough cards.
abc123brian
Well-known member
Hahaha, I was wondering the same thing
aolander
Well-known member
I don't think it's a problem deleting images in the camera, but you should format in the camera after you've uploaded images to your computer and backed up.
I read the information in the link. They say that reformatting the card doesn't help. AND they are marketing their Refresh Pro s/w. I 'm sure a call to them would answer whether or not their s/w works with cards from other brands. FWIW.....the s/w is only $10.....I didn’t because I always heard the same thing, then I recently began doing it without issue. Then I received an email from ProGrade Digital discussing a different reason not to do it so I’ll be going back to not doing it. There reasoning makes me concerned for doing it on SSDs too, so not sure what to do, lol.
Improve Your Memory Card Speed with Refresh Pro | ProGrade Digital, Inc
Learn how Refresh Pro keeps your memory card running like new by maintaining your card’s capacity and speed with our Health and Sanitize functions. Read now!
Woody Meristem
Well-known member
The only time I don't delete in the camera is when the photos are so important that I don't want to take a chance on losing them. Once they're on the computer and copied to an external drive I delete them from the card in the camera and then format the card in-camera. Have never had an issue doing it that way and have done that since I got my first digital camera.
abc123brian
Well-known member
I think it only mentioned reformatting in camera doesn’t help since it only erases the data. I would think reformatting on a computer where you’re rebuilding the table would make a difference. I’m not clear on what the software is actual doing in its refresh stage. The health check part sounds like a worthwhile investment though as it could let you know when you’re reaching the end of the lifecycle of the card.
I’ve never seen an issue either way to date. Maybe it’s unique to the newer, faster, high capacity cards. Next they will be telling us not to delete at all.......
lablover27
Well-known member
Guilty as wellHahaha, I was wondering the same thing
As I understand it the only thing that happens when a file is deleted is that the file is marked deleted in the FAT and the space used by that file is no longer reserved. When a card is formatted the FAT is just deleted or recreated. This is one of the reasons you can recover deleted files, if the space utilized by the deleted file was not used by a newer file, then the image data is still complete.
I know modern SSDs have the ability to utilized the disk storage consistently so that some portions of disk don't get used more than other. I don't know if cards have the same feature or not.
I don’t delete in camera unless I really need addition storage capacity, not that I have any sound reasoning for this, I just don’t usually do it. I think the fewer changes to the FAT in camera the better.
I was curious about the write cycles of memory cards, and you find everything from 1000 cycles to 10,000 cycles. If I fill and delete the card contents everyday, then the card should last from about 3 years to 30 years. Storage cards are one of those things that seem to get replaced because of the need for larger or faster cards long before I can wear them out.
I know modern SSDs have the ability to utilized the disk storage consistently so that some portions of disk don't get used more than other. I don't know if cards have the same feature or not.
I don’t delete in camera unless I really need addition storage capacity, not that I have any sound reasoning for this, I just don’t usually do it. I think the fewer changes to the FAT in camera the better.
I was curious about the write cycles of memory cards, and you find everything from 1000 cycles to 10,000 cycles. If I fill and delete the card contents everyday, then the card should last from about 3 years to 30 years. Storage cards are one of those things that seem to get replaced because of the need for larger or faster cards long before I can wear them out.
It kind of sounds like you need their card reader as well as their special software to do this. It really sounds like a low level format, but maybe they have some kind of magic algorithm that works "better".
Faster!
DaveR
Active member
I use shooting banks in my Z9. I use save settings so I can reload them from the card when I need to reload them. Because of this I don't reformat the card instead I use delete all pictures to clear the card. The article doesn't mention that it just seems to adress deleting individual files. So far I've not had a problem but I think I'll use their refresh software every now and again to be on the safe side. I also use their CF Express card reader which is the fastest reader I have come across. I really rate Prograde products from from my experience so far.
I carry my saved settings on a separate card, well, on 2 cards actually.
CFExpress cards are large and do have wear leveling built into the firmware that operates the card. That technology applies to other modern memory cards as well.
Modern memory cards will handle 100,000 write cycles based on the spec for SD cards.
Here is a more complete article from Delkin on formatting memory cards. It talks about the need to format cards in the camera where they will be used and deep formatting options.
Formatting Explained - Delkin Devices
Image by Photo Mix from Pixabay “Format your memory card” – that’s one, if not the top, tip photographers and videographers are advised to do when it comes to proper memory card use and maintenance. Although, if you were to ask someone why it’s important, they themselves may not fully understand...
www.delkindevices.com
The article talks about wear leveling and card replacement.
Why You Need a New Memory Card - Delkin Devices
Did you know that your memory cards need to eventually be replaced? If not, it’s ok – a good percentage of photographers and videographers don’t know either. A common misconception among camera owners is that once you buy a memory card, especially an expensive one, it will last forever. But...
www.delkindevices.com
I am always skeptical of articles like this when someone is peddling something to sell you. I’m sure there may be some logic in what they are saying but how much of an issue it really is makes me wonder.
Niels.hr.Hansen
Well-known member
Those 100k write cycles is for the full capacity. So imagine you have a 128 GB card, every day you start formatting and then fills it to the brim. Just before the card celebrates its 274 years birthday you'll reach the 100k cycles. Other issues will have occurred before 
If I during chimping finds an image that is not satisfying, I will not hesitate to delete it. Wear on the card is negligible and the risk that the camera writes on the space before next format is very limited, over the latest 12-15 years I can't recall to have had defects on files on my cards (SD or CFExp.)
About having 2 copies, that is reasonable because sometime the chimpanzee managing the files punch wrong keys
If I during chimping finds an image that is not satisfying, I will not hesitate to delete it. Wear on the card is negligible and the risk that the camera writes on the space before next format is very limited, over the latest 12-15 years I can't recall to have had defects on files on my cards (SD or CFExp.)
About having 2 copies, that is reasonable because sometime the chimpanzee managing the files punch wrong keys
Been doing it for 20 years and never had any problems.
While that was all interesting reading it's not a real world problem for 90 percent of us. Maybe 99 percent of us. Though as someone mention now I am somewhat concerned about having SSDs in both of my computers. I have noticed my primary editing machine has slowed down significantly. I've been blaming LR but now wonder if it the SSD aging?
ronpier
Member
For the most part I cull images once downloaded from camera.
Not A Speck Of Cereal
Well-known member
I don't delete images in-camera for a different reason: on Nikon cameras, it only deletes the image from your main card, not the back-up card*.
If, when you go to download, you feel the need to 'diff' the two cards to double-check for integrity (compare them to see if they are exactly the same, which boosts your confidence that all the writes were good**), they will not compare if you have deleted single images in the field.
At that point, you would have to go to manual compare, looking at the images on the backup card to verify that they are images that you *likely* deleted purposefully from the main card.
It's so much easier to just leave them alone so that any subsequent compare will be quick and painless.
Chris
* you could also then delete the image from the backup card at that point as well, but it would require that you switch slots first, then find that image to deleted it and ... if anybody does that, please speak up so we can put together a fund to get you some bigger cards
** if a bad write goes to both cards identically, then it's a camera issue rather than a card issue and you have larger problems.
If, when you go to download, you feel the need to 'diff' the two cards to double-check for integrity (compare them to see if they are exactly the same, which boosts your confidence that all the writes were good**), they will not compare if you have deleted single images in the field.
At that point, you would have to go to manual compare, looking at the images on the backup card to verify that they are images that you *likely* deleted purposefully from the main card.
It's so much easier to just leave them alone so that any subsequent compare will be quick and painless.
Chris
* you could also then delete the image from the backup card at that point as well, but it would require that you switch slots first, then find that image to deleted it and ... if anybody does that, please speak up so we can put together a fund to get you some bigger cards
** if a bad write goes to both cards identically, then it's a camera issue rather than a card issue and you have larger problems.
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