Do you agree with the judges?

If you would like to post, you'll need to register. Note that if you have a BCG store account, you'll need a new, separate account here (we keep the two sites separate for security purposes).

I sent 50 photo's out to friends and asked them to pick their top 5 photos . One photo out of 50 was picked twice all the rest were single or no pick. This was a very eye opening experience for me . I liked all 50 photos and was hoping to narrow it down so I knew which ones were my best shot. I didn't learn what I was hope to I learned something bigger . Everyone likes something different.
 
I sent 50 photo's out to friends and asked them to pick their top 5 photos . One photo out of 50 was picked twice all the rest were single or no pick. This was a very eye opening experience for me . I liked all 50 photos and was hoping to narrow it down so I knew which ones were my best shot. I didn't learn what I was hope to I learned something bigger . Everyone likes something different.
Or..........????
 
I sent 50 photo's out to friends and asked them to pick their top 5 photos . One photo out of 50 was picked twice all the rest were single or no pick. This was a very eye opening experience for me . I liked all 50 photos and was hoping to narrow it down so I knew which ones were my best shot. I didn't learn what I was hope to I learned something bigger . Everyone likes something different.
My photgraphic mentor is a judge that I trust and has been a PSA-affiliated club judge for over forty years that I know of. His short advice is that to compete well, a photo must have 1) Impact, 2) Technical Merit, and 3) More Impact.

What you write about here is a photo popularity contest. Instead, find a local PSA club and show your work to their judges and ask for feedback. Better yet, compete your photos in their local contests, and ask for review/critique after the judging is completed. Be ready to take the critiques they offer (which could be very harsh) seriously, but not as a personal attack. If you pay attention to the process, your photos should improve in the future. If they don't offer critiques after the competition, ask for such. A good judge will work with you to help you improve your photos.
 
For much of the time the sea lions lay on the beach and do very little. There is a short period of time during the spring when they are very active and there is a lot of sparing between the males.
Those are young elephant seals just practicing sparring. They are too young to do any actual mating.
 
Here is how the judges scored the images, with a maximum score being 27.
1 23 points
2 19 points
3 21 points
4 25 points
I didn't total all the responses but it seems that "the wisdom of the crowd" agrees with the judges on which is the best image of the group and that there is some divergence after that.
If you want another great source of images from a wide variety photographers you can visit the S4C web site to see entries for past competitions. Thank you for the comments and for participating in this informal experiment.
What were the categories for awarding points? Sometimes I see competitions with several categories of points while in other cases I see a simple total of the score by several judges. I saw a judge once that scored landscape images 1.7 points lower than wildlife images on average for hundreds of images - and it kept a Peter Lik landscape from winning the competition. I've also seen single factors that violate rules be major deductions by one judge but creative decisions by another judge.

Common issues are the wildlife photos are from the perspective of a person standing - 1 could benefit from being lower and 4 could benefit from being higher to eliminate overlaps (a major deduction). The birds are slightly facing away in #4 which is a major deduction. Both are relatively static. I find #2 interesting but would need to look closer - photographically patterns and abstracts are tough to judge and are either at the high end or low end. #3 is a pretty sunset cloud photo, but lacks a strong foreground element and the foreground is muted, so it's really about the cloud. All of the images except #3 are relatively common subjects.

I'm looking for images that have technical expertise and high impact.
 
Last edited:
What were the categories for awarding points? Sometimes I see competitions with several categories of points while in other cases I see a simple total of the score by several judges. I saw a judge once that scored landscape images 1.7 points lower than wildlife images on average for hundreds of images - and it kept a Peter Lik landscape from winning the competition. I've also seen single factors that violate rules be major deductions by one judge but creative decisions by another judge.

Common issues are the wildlife photos are from the perspective of a person standing - 1 could benefit from being lower and 4 could benefit from being higher to eliminate overlaps (a major deduction). The birds are slightly facing away in #4 which is a major deduction. Both are relatively static. I find #2 interesting but would need to look closer - photographically patterns and abstracts are tough to judge and are either at the high end or low end. #3 is a pretty sunset cloud photo, but lacks a strong foreground element and the foreground is muted, so it's really about the cloud. All of the images except #3 are relatively common subjects.

I'm looking for images that have technical expertise and high impact.

Legend has it that Peter Lik puts his lens cap on the same way I do.
 
Legend has it that Peter Lik puts his lens cap on the same way I do.
But he is better at marketing and that makes a difference if all else is equal...marketing is a skill in itself. Plus he put the money out to open galleries. There was a Peter Lik photo in my dentist's office, it was huge, and very nicely framed. It was very vivid in color and very sharp, a landscape. My dentist told me that Peter Lik told him no processing applied, he just got there at the "right time" 😉. My dentist was happy with it, he bought a second one after that. I applaud someone who is energetic enough to want to take their work to a different level but I won't be buying one of his pieces anytime soon. Sometimes I wish I had his energy and commitment to put his work "out there."
 
But he is better at marketing and that makes a difference if all else is equal...marketing is a skill in itself. Plus he put the money out to open galleries. There was a Peter Lik photo in my dentist's office, it was huge, and very nicely framed. It was very vivid in color and very sharp, a landscape. My dentist told me that Peter Lik told him no processing applied, he just got there at the "right time" 😉. My dentist was happy with it, he bought a second one after that. I applaud someone who is energetic enough to want to take their work to a different level but I won't be buying one of his pieces anytime soon. Sometimes I wish I had his energy and commitment to put his work "out there."
That may be true, but Lik's work consistently does well in contests without any marketing or knowledge of the photographer. His images are consistently selected in the top 10 of the NANPA Showcase competition and in the top 2-3 for Landscapes. The judges change every year and there are lots of participating professionals. Top images require supporting RAW files. He's won just about every photography award available. That said, he has a unique marketing and business model.

We all know that processing is required of all images, and Lik and his team are expert in various editing tools, compositing, etc. They also know what sells and large prints in bright colors do look good, but that is a matter of personal preference.
 
Here is how the judges scored the images, with a maximum score being 27.
1 23 points
2 19 points
3 21 points
4 25 points
I didn't total all the responses but it seems that "the wisdom of the crowd" agrees with the judges on which is the best image of the group and that there is some divergence after that.
If you want another great source of images from a wide variety photographers you can visit the S4C web site to see entries for past competitions. Thank you for the comments and for participating in this informal experiment.
That may be true, but Lik's work consistently does well in contests without any marketing or knowledge of the photographer. His images are consistently selected in the top 10 of the NANPA Showcase competition and in the top 2-3 for Landscapes. The judges change every year and there are lots of participating professionals. Top images require supporting RAW files. He's won just about every photography award available. That said, he has a unique marketing and business model.

We all know that processing is required of all images, and Lik and his team are expert in various editing tools, compositing, etc. They also know what sells and large prints in bright colors do look good, but that is a matter of personal preference.

Eric, note that I said "all else being equal," thus if someone was as good as him and did not market themselves well, they would not have the same chance at success. I meant no insult to his work, just saying what he said to my dentist and perhaps it was true but I was skeptical of the statement. I admire his success and I'm sure he deserves it. I don't think he needs anyone to "stick up for him" as his success does that in itself.
 
What were the categories for awarding points? Sometimes I see competitions with several categories of points while in other cases I see a simple total of the score by several judges. I saw a judge once that scored landscape images 1.7 points lower than wildlife images on average for hundreds of images - and it kept a Peter Lik landscape from winning the competition. I've also seen single factors that violate rules be major deductions by one judge but creative decisions by another judge.

Common issues are the wildlife photos are from the perspective of a person standing - 1 could benefit from being lower and 4 could benefit from being higher to eliminate overlaps (a major deduction). The birds are slightly facing away in #4 which is a major deduction. Both are relatively static. I find #2 interesting but would need to look closer - photographically patterns and abstracts are tough to judge and are either at the high end or low end. #3 is a pretty sunset cloud photo, but lacks a strong foreground element and the foreground is muted, so it's really about the cloud. All of the images except #3 are relatively common subjects.

I'm looking for images that have technical expertise and high impact.
In this competition they don't publish anything on categories for awarding points.
Your comments on perspective are valid and with the Joshua Tree shot I was so happy to have some interesting clouds rather than a plan blue sky that I neglected the fore ground interest. Thanks for the feedback, it helps.
 
From reading this thread, I learned that I am not qualified to be a judge. While I really liked #4, my favorite was #3, but I live in a high dessert ecology and appreciate the beauty of a dessert while many think the boring. The only thing I agreed with on the judging was the last placement of #2.

What I also learned is that I liked all four of the photos and I did not want to be guessing what the judges might pick. I was very close to calling #4 my favorite.

Thank you for sharing this fun experience.
 
For the last few years I have been entering the Southern California Camera Club Council (S4C) photo contest. I though I would post some pictures I entered in the General Nature category and invite you guys to rank them from best to worst and see if you agree with how the judges scored them. If anyone is interested, go ahead and rank the pictures and after a day or two I will post how the judges scored them.
#1
View attachment 43947
#2
View attachment 43950
#3
View attachment 43944
#4
View attachment 43952
1,4,3,2 for me (which probably means the judges went 2,3,4,1)
 
Kind of a rude comment, IMO.
It is an honest comment. I also like the photos but don't think they are spectacular. I wouldn't have entered them either. They are beautiful photos but not what I would enter. I'm not trying to be hateful or stupid. Just my opinion which was requested by the op. I most likely should not have posted because if I don't have something good to say I should say nothing. Lol lol
 
It is an honest comment. I also like the photos but don't think they are spectacular. I wouldn't have entered them either. They are beautiful photos but not what I would enter. I'm not trying to be hateful or stupid. Just my opinion which was requested by the op. I most likely should not have posted because if I don't have something good to say I should say nothing. Lol lol
As a judge, the role is to score the image and be able to articulate or defend the basis for a score. Even better is giving specific feedback about what would make an image with a higher score. There are lots of reasons for participation and different ways of getting feedback.

It's relatively easy to judge technical merits for a specific genre if you are expert in that genre or even if you have great familiarity with a specific subject. But nobody is expert in every genre and all subject matter. For example, among advanced photographers the little details like head position, overlaps, perspective or level of the camera, and backgrounds can make or break an image. At an intermediate level, a judge might weight sharpness, lighting and composition as most important and never get to some of the advanced elements.

I like the PPA judging process for its transparency. There are multiple judges who score each image silently. If all scores are in the same range the average is the score and they move on. If there is an outlier score it is automatically a challenge, and the judge with the outlier presents their case with a brief discussion and everyone re-votes. Any judge can also challenge the group's score and request discussion and re-vote. Judges are evaluated on their participation and their scores are analyzed to provide feedback and coaching for consistent high or low scores or the participation in challenges and discussion. The entire judging process is open to the public - all discussion among judges, challenges, etc. Judging moves at a very brisk pace. They judge tens of thousands of images using this process.
 
For the last few years I have been entering the Southern California Camera Club Council (S4C) photo contest. I though I would post some pictures I entered in the General Nature category and invite you guys to rank them from best to worst and see if you agree with how the judges scored them. If anyone is interested, go ahead and rank the pictures and after a day or two I will post how the judges scored them.
#1
View attachment 43947
#2
View attachment 43950
#3
View attachment 43944
#4
View attachment 43952

I find i can put in an image into a competition one month and get a pass, i can then put the same passed image in next month and get a win Merit top mark.
The most important thing is never take what is judged personally.
In our competitions the judge talks to the image a short critique so the author and others may learn...........that's how its done in our comps.

The judging of an image should be consistent,
A image needs to meet the criteria rules set out and be fitting.
A image should engage the viewer, tell a story, or provide a message a connection, evoking emotions.
A image should be technically proficient, but not totally overrule the power of the story.
A image should have a WOW factor.


My take on the 4 images are in order of priority

Number
4
3
1
2
 
From reading this thread, I learned that I am not qualified to be a judge. While I really liked #4, my favorite was #3, but I live in a high dessert ecology and appreciate the beauty of a dessert while many think the boring. The only thing I agreed with on the judging was the last placement of #2.

What I also learned is that I liked all four of the photos and I did not want to be guessing what the judges might pick. I was very close to calling #4 my favorite.

Thank you for sharing this fun experience.
Wink, I'm not qualified to be a photo judge, either. The thought of doing so scares the hee-bee-gee-bees out of me, in fact.

With that said, entering photos in contests to be judged according to a standard is a great way to learn how to improve your photos. Moreso than attending a judging/critique session, which is also means to learn to improve your photos.

If you want to take a step further after you experience the former methods for a while, take a(some) course(s) in photo judging. And/or find a judge that is willing to discuss photo judging "rules and rationales" with you. Either one should benefit your photography knowledge if accomplished with an accredited judge.
 
Wink, I'm not qualified to be a photo judge, either. The thought of doing so scares the hee-bee-gee-bees out of me, in fact.

With that said, entering photos in contests to be judged according to a standard is a great way to learn how to improve your photos. Moreso than attending a judging/critique session, which is also means to learn to improve your photos.

If you want to take a step further after you experience the former methods for a while, take a(some) course(s) in photo judging. And/or find a judge that is willing to discuss photo judging "rules and rationales" with you. Either one should benefit your photography knowledge if accomplished with an accredited judge.
Entering competitions and listening to judges can be of great benefit and a great place for learning, i have always found listening and watching has had such great benefits irrespective of if i felt the judges were on point or not.

Joining a local camera club even on line can help enormously.

I have been judging competitions in our own club as well as external clubs, i enjoy the experience and always learning, there are some basic principals to abide by be it judging or making a photo, these are learnt when doing the a credited course by recognized photographic associations.

Joining competitions internationally or on line especially needs to be done with caution, only enter fully accredited competitions, there are competitions you pay a fee to place your entries in and you may receive either acceptance or certificate distinguished result or a silver gold award, a certificate is mailed to you and may very well be from some one using a lap top in a remote foreign location operating in their garage or bed room collecting entry fees globally.

Being a member of the PSA (Photography Society of America) is handy, it filters out the scammers.


The judging of an image or creation of an image should be consistent,
A image needs to meet the criteria rules set out and be fitting.
A image should engage the viewer, tell a story, or provide a message a connection, evoking emotions.
A image should be technically proficient, but not totally overrule the power of the story.
A image should have a WOW factor.
 
Last edited:
One more thought....

The same considerations of selecting an image for a contest can be applied to putting an image on your website or other social media. Select ONLY your best images. Including weaker images dilutes the strength of the gallery of images. Don't include images with obvious problems.

Show only your best work! It is not about quantity, but has everything to do with QUALITY.

Including several images of the same scene indicates you are more of a "shot gun" type photographer as opposed to a photographer who accepts and shows ONLY the best of himself and his work. Viewer attention spans are super short. They won't wade through a bunch of images with slight differences............

JMHO.........
 
One more thought....

The same considerations of selecting an image for a contest can be applied to putting an image on your website or other social media. Select ONLY your best images. Including weaker images dilutes the strength of the gallery of images. Don't include images with obvious problems.

Show only your best work! It is not about quantity, but has everything to do with QUALITY.

Including several images of the same scene indicates you are more of a "shot gun" type photographer as opposed to a photographer who accepts and shows ONLY the best of himself and his work.

JMHO.........
You have a really lovely portfolio, love the frogs
 
One more thought....

The same considerations of selecting an image for a contest can be applied to putting an image on your website or other social media. Select ONLY your best images. Including weaker images dilutes the strength of the gallery of images. Don't include images with obvious problems.

Show only your best work! It is not about quantity, but has everything to do with QUALITY.

Including several images of the same scene indicates you are more of a "shot gun" type photographer as opposed to a photographer who accepts and shows ONLY the best of himself and his work.

JMHO.........

I violate your rules often on Facebook. I post many photos of my wife there that I would not dream of posting here.

Why?

Because I am losing her, millions of brain cells at a time. This is for me and her friends to celebrate the lady I have loved for more than fifty years.

They love the pictures and I know they are not worthy of a professional. In this, I am happy to be an amateur.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top