Nikon Z8 Banks - Really poor implementation of user settings or am I missing something?

[Robert.Panick]

For quite a while I shot Nikon, the last being the D7000. Then I switched to Olympus where I shot the E-M1 through the OM-1. I don't think OMS has the resources to remain competitive, so I decided to move to Nikon. Specifically, a Z8. I'm going through the learning curve on it, and I expect it to take another month or two to get fully transitioned. The Z8 is quite a bit more complex than my OM-1, but I can deal with that.

What's driving me nuts though is Banks. It took me a while to realize that the last settings you used are what the bank remembers, there is no save option. For all practical purposes you only have three usable banks, the fourth one you have to keep open for when you shoot something out of the ordinary. Heaven help you if you change something on accident and screw up your bank settings. Shortcomings of Banks and Settings:
- No quick way to switch from one set of settings to another. On a camera with a dial, you would just turn to C1 or U1 (camera dependent), you can even set a button to that setting group.
- To switch settings the best I've seen so far is to set up the Info button to have Banks and Custom Settings show up. But then you have to move to the Banks cell, change it, move to the Custom Settings cell and change it. Perhaps there is a quicker way to do this, but I haven't found it yet.
- There are some really annoying things that aren't covered under Banks or Custom Settings, one in particular is the continuous frame rate. It's really annoying to have to remember that you have to adjust the burst rate when going from landscape to wildlife.

With all that being said, are the Nikon software people idiots that have never used a camera, or is there some advantage of this setup that I just haven't figured out yet?

BTW, it's great that you can name the banks and custom settings, but why did they limit it to just four? I've been saying for years now that a dozen or more would be greatly appreciated.

 

[marler1957]

The Z8/Z9 guide by @Steve is definitely a great resource.

I made my first pass via watching Hudson Henry multiple Z8 setup YouTube videos. He creates bank A and modifies copies. See:

I read Steve’s z8 guide plus his awesome AF guide and made many tweaks to my first setup.

I just use two choices on my “i” button menu to switch shooting and custom menu banks. Can do it looking through the viewfinder.

I have “key logo” (protect) button set for “My Menu” which has a choice for save/load settings. I can always load/reload four banks…do it anytime I haven’t picked up my camera for a few days/hours.

Many others want more banks/flexibility as well…

If you use shooting banks, how do you use them?

I am hoping to set up shooting banks on my Z9 but wonder what is the best way? I was thinking A as general purpose B as action (high iso, high shutter speed) C as animal "portrait" (low to moderate iso, low to moder shutter speed) D as slow speed pan blur (low iso, low shutter speed) As I...

bcgforums.com

 

[fcotterill]

Nikon's Pro shooting Banks are a Marmite category feature. Nikon could definitely improve on the concept as well as the details of how they work.

They work best to switch entire sets of settings: from landscape to flying birds/sports, or flash macro, for example.

The iMenu to switch Banks works fairly well, particularly as banks can be switched when looking through the EVF. Positioning the Photo and Custom icons as the right end pair is optimal IME

Z9 Argument for and against banks wth RSF

As I wait for my seventh month for my z9 I am looking at the merits of both of the above. I gather there are many with their Z9's who use a particular way of shootig. Yes, I have Steves book and its very good but each comment shows a different flavor for the camera use in, for me, BIF, Landscape...

bcgforums.com

Nikon Z9 RSF (Hold), Shooting Menu Banks, Extended Menu Banks and Custom Settings Banks

I would like to save a list of settings (eg 1/2000s, f/8.0, auto ISO, 20fps etc.). When I activate those settings via a button, I want be able to then adjust the settings without affecting the saved settings. From reading the posts here and the Z9 manual my understanding of the options is...

bcgforums.com

Advice on shooting wildlife and landscapes while using menu banks.....

On my Nikon Z8 I have set the 4 shooting menu banks per a photographers workshop advice where A= Street & Travel, B= Action AF Hybrid, C=Landscape and D=Point and Shoot. I always shot manual before and when out in a national park I like to walk and shoot landscapes but also be ready for a moose...

bcgforums.com

 

[Robert.Panick]

The Z8/Z9 guide by @Steve is definitely a great resource.

I made my first pass via watching Hudson Henry multiple Z8 setup YouTube videos. He creates bank A and modifies copies. See:

I read Steve’s z8 guide plus his awesome AF guide and made many tweaks to my first setup.

I just use two choices on my “i” button menu to switch shooting and custom menu banks. Can do it looking through the viewfinder.

I have “key logo” (protect) button set for “My Menu” which has a choice for save/load settings. I can always load/reload four banks…do it anytime I haven’t picked up my camera for a few days/hours.

Many others want more banks/flexibility as well…

If you use shooting banks, how do you use them?

I am hoping to set up shooting banks on my Z9 but wonder what is the best way? I was thinking A as general purpose B as action (high iso, high shutter speed) C as animal "portrait" (low to moderate iso, low to moder shutter speed) D as slow speed pan blur (low iso, low shutter speed) As I...

bcgforums.com

Yeah, I figured all that out. It's just really clumsy. What's sad is that the older U dial worked a lot better, at least IMHO

 

[Robert.Panick]

Nikon's Pro shooting Banks are a Marmite category feature. Nikon could definitely improve on the concept as well as the details of how they work.

They work best to switch entire sets of settings: from landscape to flying birds/sports, or flash macro, for example.

The iMenu to switch Banks works fairly well, particularly as banks can be switched when looking through the EVF. Positioning the Photo and Custom icons as the right end pair is optimal IME

Z9 Argument for and against banks wth RSF

As I wait for my seventh month for my z9 I am looking at the merits of both of the above. I gather there are many with their Z9's who use a particular way of shootig. Yes, I have Steves book and its very good but each comment shows a different flavor for the camera use in, for me, BIF, Landscape...

bcgforums.com

Nikon Z9 RSF (Hold), Shooting Menu Banks, Extended Menu Banks and Custom Settings Banks

I would like to save a list of settings (eg 1/2000s, f/8.0, auto ISO, 20fps etc.). When I activate those settings via a button, I want be able to then adjust the settings without affecting the saved settings. From reading the posts here and the Z9 manual my understanding of the options is...

bcgforums.com

Advice on shooting wildlife and landscapes while using menu banks.....

On my Nikon Z8 I have set the 4 shooting menu banks per a photographers workshop advice where A= Street & Travel, B= Action AF Hybrid, C=Landscape and D=Point and Shoot. I always shot manual before and when out in a national park I like to walk and shoot landscapes but also be ready for a moose...

bcgforums.com

If Marmite means what I think it does, sounds like you agree with me.

 

[ajrmd]

Also, the banks don't allow for the implementation of all camera settings, so say for example one is shooting Bank A, with the camera set to AF-C at 20 FPS and wants to switch to Bank B where they might want AF-S, single shot. The user has to manually change those settings as well.

 

[dabhand16]

Having used banks on my Nikon dSLRs that had them and the U modes on my Z6ii, both have their advantages. I do have to say the the banks could be so much more than they are at present though.

When I used banks I wanted to have base settings remembered, but with my Z6ii I found that if I switched the camera off as I'm in the habit of doing if I'm not shooting, I have then got to reset the settings when I start shooting again if I'd moved from the base settings which I think we all do when shooting.

My Fuji XH-2s has 7 custom banks/U modes and an option in the menu weather to remember base settings or overwrite base settings when changed from base. I find that the overwrite option is better for me and I just reset the base settings when I'm done or when I start out so I'm starting with custom base settings for that situation that I know I'll be changing as time passes.

 

[BradleyD]

The bank implementation drove me nutty at first and the Hudson Henry vid posted above really helped me to understand how to use them. At first I struggled with lack of persistence in the banks as any change I made while shooting in the field overrode the bank setting, but with use I started to appreciate how they worked. The biggest tip I got out of the Henry video was customizing my menu so that I have the Save/Load function followed by the Format function. At the end of the day after I’ve off loaded my images and I want to restore my bank defaults I remember to “Look For Snakes”(Load, Format, Save) and I am back to my default banks with space on the card. I don’t always do this. Sometimes I want the changes I made in the field to carry over to the next days of shooting. Stick with it, you’ll figure out what works for you. It’s definitely an area that could use improvement by Nikon.

 

[TurtleCat]

The banks are a good idea not fully implemented, IMO. They allow a lot of combinations quickly changed for different scenarios. But the lack of persistence of some of the settings and that you have to use the i menu or menu diving to change the custom settings limits its usefulness. Even so, I have shooting banks set for wildlife, still subjects, portraits, and landscape and custom settings for wildlife, landscape, portrait natural light, and portrait flash. It gets me pretty close to the right place when I'm doing a certain kind of event.

 

[JAJohnson]

Also, the banks don't allow for the implementation of all camera settings, so say for example one is shooting Bank A, with the camera set to AF-C at 20 FPS and wants to switch to Bank B where they might want AF-S, single shot. The user has to manually change those settings as well.

Shooting Banks will maintain Focus Mode, AF Area Mode, and AF Subject Detection Options because they are set in the Photo Shooting Menu. I have Extended Menu Banks enabled, and since I shoot in Manual, shutter speed and aperture are also stored in my Shooting Banks.

Custom Settings Banks will maintain, among the other custom settings, d1 Continuous Shooting Speed. On my Z8 & Z9 it seems to default to the Continuous High setting.

In your example, a user could switch from Bank A (AF-C at Continuous Shooting Speed of 20 fps) to Bank B (AF-S, single point) but changing to single shot instead of continuous shooting requires changing the Release Mode manually.

The nuances of the two types of Banks, and how to use them to get what you want, is VERY confusing. Steve's Z8 & Z9 Guide is the best I've found in explaining the concept. For those who shoot stills and video it's even more confounding. I hope Nikon product managers will revise the Banks concept to, 1) make them "sticky" so that settings stored in a Bank can be recalled without reloading saved settings, 2) ensure that ALL camera settings are stored in Banks, and 3) separate Photo shooting and Video shooting Banks so that hybrid photographers have more efficient control over their camera.

 

[Robert.Panick]

Having used banks on my Nikon dSLRs that had them and the U modes on my Z6ii, both have their advantages. I do have to say the the banks could be so much more than they are at present though.

When I used banks I wanted to have base settings remembered, but with my Z6ii I found that if I switched the camera off as I'm in the habit of doing if I'm not shooting, I have then got to reset the settings when I start shooting again if I'd moved from the base settings which I think we all do when shooting.

My Fuji XH-2s has 7 custom banks/U modes and an option in the menu weather to remember base settings or overwrite base settings when changed from base. I find that the overwrite option is better for me and I just reset the base settings when I'm done or when I start out so I'm starting with custom base settings for that situation that I know I'll be changing as time passes.

Sounds like Fuji has the right idea, give you the option. Having seven sets is definitely better than 4.

 

[Robert.Panick]

The bank implementation drove me nutty at first and the Hudson Henry vid posted above really helped me to understand how to use them. At first I struggled with lack of persistence in the banks as any change I made while shooting in the field overrode the bank setting, but with use I started to appreciate how they worked. The biggest tip I got out of the Henry video was customizing my menu so that I have the Save/Load function followed by the Format function. At the end of the day after I’ve off loaded my images and I want to restore my bank defaults I remember to “Look For Snakes”(Load, Format, Save) and I am back to my default banks with space on the card. I don’t always do this. Sometimes I want the changes I made in the field to carry over to the next days of shooting. Stick with it, you’ll figure out what works for you. It’s definitely an area that could use improvement by Nikon.

I don't have much choice but to figure it out

I discovered that if I leave an SD card in and save settings to it, when I pop out the CFE card I can load and save to the SD it isn't impacted by formatting the CFE. I may end up carrying several SD cards to have different personalities. It would be nice if Nikon let us name them, so we could pull them up by name.

 

[JAJohnson]

I don't have much choice but to figure it out

I discovered that if I leave an SD card in and save settings to it, when I pop out the CFE card I can load and save to the SD it isn't impacted by formatting the CFE. I may end up carrying several SD cards to have different personalities. It would be nice if Nikon let us name them, so we could pull them up by name.

You can give Banks a name. I have shooting and custom banks named Birds, Wildlife, and Landscape. I can change Banks in my i menu or in My Menu. Unfortunately, settings files can only have the default name.

 

[Robert.Panick]

Shooting Banks will maintain Focus Mode, AF Area Mode, and AF Subject Detection Options because they are set in the Photo Shooting Menu. I have Extended Menu Banks enabled, and since I shoot in Manual, shutter speed and aperture are also stored in my Shooting Banks.

Custom Settings Banks will maintain, among the other custom settings, d1 Continuous Shooting Speed. On my Z8 & Z9 it seems to default to the Continuous High setting.

In your example, a user could switch from Bank A (AF-C at Continuous Shooting Speed of 20 fps) to Bank B (AF-S, single point) but changing to single shot instead of continuous shooting requires changing the Release Mode manually.

The nuances of the two types of Banks, and how to use them to get what you want, is VERY confusing. Steve's Z8 & Z9 Guide is the best I've found in explaining the concept. For those who shoot stills and video it's even more confounding. I hope Nikon product managers will revise the Banks concept to, 1) make them "sticky" so that settings stored in a Bank can be recalled without reloading saved settings, 2) ensure that ALL camera settings are stored in Banks, and 3) separate Photo shooting and Video shooting Banks so that hybrid photographers have more efficient control over their camera.

When I first encountered banks I was confused that I couldn't find SAVE. It's going to take me quite a while to get used to remembering to check my bank before starting to shoot. With my D7000 and OM-1, if I forgot to change the user presets at worst it was a few shots missed. With banks there is a good chance I could mess up the bank's settings.

Hopefully @Steve has already picked up on this and gotten Nikon to see the error of their ways. But seeing as the Z9 is at V5 and they still haven't fixed it I suspect we may have a really long wait.

 

[JAJohnson]

When I first encountered banks I was confused that I couldn't find SAVE. It's going to take me quite a while to get used to remembering to check my bank before starting to shoot. With my D7000 and OM-1, if I forgot to change the user presets at worst it was a few shots missed. With banks there is a good chance I could mess up the bank's settings.

Hopefully @Steve has already picked up on this and gotten Nikon to see the error of their ways. But seeing as the Z9 is at V5 and they still haven't fixed it I suspect we may have a really long wait.

A few months ago I spoke with a retired Nikon USA executive. He told me that NPS members have provided a lot of feedback regarding Banks but there hasn't been any changes planned that he's aware of.

 

[Robert.Panick]

A few months ago I spoke with a retired Nikon USA executive. He told me that NPS members have provided a lot of feedback regarding Banks but there hasn't been any changes planned that he's aware of.

Unfortunately, I haven't found any camera brands that seem to pay attention much to feedback.

 

[ajrmd]

You can give Banks a name. I have shooting and custom banks named Birds, Wildlife, and Landscape. I can change Banks in my i menu or in My Menu. Unfortunately, settings files can only have the default name.

Yes you can, but it still doesn't fix the problems.

 

[frdjohns]

I gave up on using banks a long time ago. With no way to save your base settings, what is the point. Now I just check my setup to make sure things are the way I want them before each shoot. No need to reload banks or worry if I changed something and didn't change it back.

The inability to save a bank and have that be "sticky" so you can return to it after making adjustments is a long time complaint that Nikon has chosen to ignore.

 

[ButlerKid]

We wildlife photographers have complained about this for years.

My question is: What photographic genre (wedding, sports, night skies of ????) benefits from the way the Banks work today? Certainly there must be a fairly large group of photographers that Nikon is supporting with the current Bank implementation. Otherwise, one would expect Nikon to offer the ability to "lock" bank set ups.

Or - If the large majority of Nikon users do not use the Banks.......again what is the reason that Nikon does not update the implementation?

 

[Dave Stargazer]

The inability to save a bank and have that be "sticky" so you can return to it after making adjustments is a long time complaint that Nikon has chosen to ignore.

Z9: Setup Menu --> Save/Load menu settings
^^^ is what you are looking for. Put it near the top of MyMenu for quick access when you wish to go back to your "sticky" settings.

The Nikon menu system needs a major redesign imo, but when you set it up well, it's super quick to switch between completely different shooting conditions/requirements.

I personally abhor the U1 etc. because I am constantly making tweaks to my 'base' settings depending on changing conditions (oh - the sun went behind some clouds), and if I switch to a different User Setting, it forgets the tweaks I made, and I have to redo them all if I want them back (unless I took the time to save them to a U-slot, which is not at all convenient - several steps).

My most frequently used banks are: "relatively static subject - highest quality capture"; "some action - keep as good quality as you can"; "BiF - need high shutter speed to freeze action"; "tripod/variable, but probably high IQ." If there were 32 banks, I'd probably use them all, but I'd rather have named sets of banks of 8 on the card (sony does that).

Cheers!

...Dave...

 

[Dave Stargazer]

My question is: What photographic genre (wedding, sports, night skies of ????) benefits from the way the Banks work today? Certainly there must be a fairly large group of photographers that Nikon is supporting with the current Bank implementation. Otherwise, one would expect Nikon to offer the ability to "lock" bank set ups.

Or - If the large majority of Nikon users do not use the Banks.......again what is the reason that Nikon does not update the implementation?

The issue is that the initial setup to make banks wonderfully usable is not simple - not the default. You have to arrange things so that one or two steps is all you need to 1) switch banks on the fly (which can radically change multiple settings) and 2) recall your 'default' banks (like the U1 settings).

 

[JAJohnson]

We wildlife photographers have complained about this for years.

My question is: What photographic genre (wedding, sports, night skies of ????) benefits from the way the Banks work today? Certainly there must be a fairly large group of photographers that Nikon is supporting with the current Bank implementation. Otherwise, one would expect Nikon to offer the ability to "lock" bank set ups.

Or - If the large majority of Nikon users do not use the Banks.......again what is the reason that Nikon does not update the implementation?

Karen, I wonder if the Banks conception is a remnant the menus in Nikon's early DSLR cameras? As you suggest, it must have met a need at some time, but it needs revision for today's photographers. Recently, Thom Hogan had this to say about Banks (and some other related functions), "The current... options are badly conceived, poorly executed, and absolute nightmares for users." I couldn't agree more.

 

[Cameron T]

Banks have been the 'pro' option for quite a while, u modes the consumer option. I have to think people broadly have to find them useful or else they'd have been changed over the various iterations.

 

[ajrmd]

We wildlife photographers have complained about this for years.

My question is: What photographic genre (wedding, sports, night skies of ????) benefits from the way the Banks work today? Certainly there must be a fairly large group of photographers that Nikon is supporting with the current Bank implementation. Otherwise, one would expect Nikon to offer the ability to "lock" bank set ups.

Or - If the large majority of Nikon users do not use the Banks.......again what is the reason that Nikon does not update the implementation?

Karen, I've asked this question too and my best guess is that it may be more applicable to astro, landscape, fashion, etc. I still use them for the astro work, but I could just as easily make the changes to go back and forth. Since the settings aren't sticky, I find that they are more annoying than useful.

 

[Robert.Panick]

Banks have been the 'pro' option for quite a while, u modes the consumer option. I have to think people broadly have to find them useful or else they'd have been changed over the various iterations.

That's why I was asking, was I missing something. From the feedback, doesn't sound like it.