Nikon Z9 and 500mm PF struggles with finding birds in bright blue sky and I have to refocus on moving birds

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frodoboy said:
Just wondering if anyone has had this problem and/or found a remedy for it. My friend has the Sony A1 and he also has trouble focusing on birds in flight against a bright blue sky. My problem is I can see the blurry bird in the sky. Then I push bbf to focus and the bird goes totally out of focus. Then I have to keep pushing BBF trying to find the bird. I eventually do, but it is by then a butt shot. My Sony friend is also struggling with the same issue. Another problem I have is if I do lock on to, lets say, a flock of birds, they are in focus, but as they move towards me -with BBF still engaged- I notice they are out of focus, so I have to let up and push the BBF button again to refocus. I have tried all the focus settings suggested by others including steady and erratic, 1-5, etc. nothing seems to change this problem. I am usually shooting at f/5.6-f/8. Shutter speed between 1/2500-1/4000. Exposure comp usually -1 to +1 depending on bird color and light. This is very frustrating for me and I wonder if this is a common problem or some setting I just don't have right. Thanks for all replies.
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shooting with the 500pf and Z9- images are sharper than d850 and d500 ( despite AF fine tune on dslr) and the focus lock is precise and fast for BIF including swallows on Z9. The weight distribution becomes slightly unwieldy with ftz II for hand holding, but very doable. I dont remember the last time I have taken any camera support system after picking up the 500 PF. Other than that, no issues. If the pf was working great on dslr, you have a good copy and it may be the AF settings like others have mentioned. I have assigned 3D tracking to AF ON (BBF) and the shutter release is on AF wide area with animal tracking enabled shooting HIE * at 20 FPS.
 
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I don't have a 500mm pf but I am having weird issues with the 300pf on the Z9. All my other lenses seem OK but the 300 pf just goes whacko sometimes and will not focus. I even can get it to think its in focus but clearly in the viewfinder it blurry as can be. I might just try the firmware rollback just to see if it helps. Tried all the contact cleaning ideas already.
Loving the Z9 in almost everything else.
 
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JerryF said:
I don't have a 500mm pf but I am having weird issues with the 300pf on the Z9. All my other lenses seem OK but the 300 pf just goes whacko sometimes and will not focus. I even can get it to think its in focus but clearly in the viewfinder it blurry as can be. I might just try the firmware rollback just to see if it helps. Tried all the contact cleaning ideas already.
Loving the Z9 in almost everything else.
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That is exactly what my 500mm pf was doing. I am going to take some test shots when it warms up and then re-update to the latest firmware to see if the problem comes back. If so, I will report it to Nikon.
 
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abc123brian said:
I have not experienced that at all with the Z9 and 500mm PF. Against a bright sky, it’s essentially immediate lock on and stays with the bird. Which af settings are you using? As you say it is two of you with completely different systems so that makes it interesting. One suggestion I’d try to rule it out is put focus back on the shutter button to ensure the issue isn’t with the AF-On button.

I’m primarily using Wide Area L with subject detection set to Auto, stickiness setting of 3, and set to erratic. I am using the shutter button to focus and have AF-On set to 3D. This setup has been working fantastic for me and I have a lot of opportunities to shoot the situation you describe. I’ve been using the same with the 500mm PF and 1.4x TCiii now and it is not quite as instant but still very quick.

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I’m using the same settings and I’m really happy with my Z9 BIF a keeper ratio, especially with blue sky background.
 
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Ajodo said:
I’m using the same settings and I’m really happy with my Z9 BIF a keeper ratio, especially with blue sky background.
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Well then, I am going to reset my shutter button to AF wide and the BBF button to 3D. I have it a bit different, but even Steve mentioned he uses the shutter button now for AF as well (I think he said that!). I had the front buttons set to 3D, small area AF and spot, and the BBF button set to wide area AF. I also have it set to 3 and erratic but that didn't help. Also, when I used 3d tracking, it would never lock onto the bird like the D850 does. So I will give these new settings a try, and hope I get used to using the shutter button again for AF. Thanks for everyone's feedback!
 
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Well, I tried the new settings and put the 1.1.1 firmware back on the Z9. Shutter release is now also wide area af. BBF button is 3D tracking. Changed exposure mode to spot and also highlight weighted spot (to sort of automatically adjust exposure from darker birds to white birds). AFC with 3 and erratic. The 500mm pf STILL will not refocus when lens is moved from one subject to the next. I have to release and push the shutter button again or push the BBF or any other programmed button to refocus. I didn't have this problem with the D850 and my 70-300mm works fine in AFC mode. Any more suggestions? I don't know why the 500mm pf will not autofocus on new subjects while the shutter or BBF button held down.
 
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I FOUND THE PROBLEM!!!! HALLELUJAH!!! This is crazy. In the i menu a9, Focus mode restrictions, I had set it to no restrictions thinking it would work for continuous or single AF, whichever the lens or I decided on. I switched it to Continuous AF only, and now it focuses on everything I point it at! I don't know why, with that same "no restrictions" setting, it worked on my 70-300 and also the 24-120, but not on the 500mm pf. But the 500mm pf does work now with that a9 set to Continuous AF only. Maybe Jerry F can see if he has the same a9 setting as I did and change it to Continuous af and see if that works.
 
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NorthernFocus said:
When you switch to new target is the first one still in the frame?
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No. Well, sometimes if I'm following a bird, it will stay on focus for just a bit, then goes out of focus as the bird gets nearer or farther away. Like ducks for example. They are coming at me at a distance. I lock focus on them. As they get nearer, with the lens still right on them, they go blurry and I have to release, then push the BBF or shutter button down again to refocus.
 
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frodoboy said:
I FOUND THE PROBLEM!!!! HALLELUJAH!!! This is crazy. In the i menu a9, Focus mode restrictions, I had set it to no restrictions thinking it would work for continuous or single AF, whichever the lens or I decided on. I switched it to Continuous AF only, and now it focuses on everything I point it at! I don't know why, with that same "no restrictions" setting, it worked on my 70-300 and also the 24-120, but not on the 500mm pf. But the 500mm pf does work now with that a9 set to Continuous AF only. Maybe Jerry F can see if he has the same a9 setting as I did and change it to Continuous af and see if that works.
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Strange indeed. Did you read page 606 in the manual? It doesn't make sense that a camera setting would affect one lens differently than other lenses.
 
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Butlerkid said:
Strange indeed. Did you read page 606 in the manual? It doesn't make sense that a camera setting would affect one lens differently than other lenses.
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Yes I did, but I just reread it and, like you said, it shouldn't affect one lens differently than other lenses. But switching this to only Continuous AF (which I always shoot in anyway for wildlife, seemed to do the trick, but just for the 500mm pf. The other lenses work just fine with No restrictions set. Strange!
 
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frodoboy said:
Well then, I am going to reset my shutter button to AF wide and the BBF button to 3D. I have it a bit different, but even Steve mentioned he uses the shutter button now for AF as well (I think he said that!). I had the front buttons set to 3D, small area AF and spot, and the BBF button set to wide area AF. I also have it set to 3 and erratic but that didn't help. Also, when I used 3d tracking, it would never lock onto the bird like the D850 does. So I will give these new settings a try, and hope I get used to using the shutter button again for AF. Thanks for everyone's feedback!
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I actually use back button focus set up and have it set as AF on and its on 3D tracking( which I could change to single point or whatever but I havent as I have been concentrating on BIF and really like the 3D for that). I have my F1 button set to wide are L which is what I catch the bird with first, then switch over to 3D. I couldnt get used to an autofocus on the shutter. But I think the key is to catch the bird in the wide L and then initiate 3D.
Lots of people are using a focus on the shutter release but I found it to frustrating myself.
Seems like you’ve worked out the problem though and I have my 500 set to only continuous as well ( something Northern focus recommended) I’ve accidentally changed it before And I’m happier knowing I cant do that again.
 
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Ajodo said:
I actually use back button focus set up and have it set as AF on and its on 3D tracking( which I could change to single point or whatever but I havent as I have been concentrating on BIF and really like the 3D for that). I have my F1 button set to wide are L which is what I catch the bird with first, then switch over to 3D. I couldnt get used to an autofocus on the shutter. But I think the key is to catch the bird in the wide L and then initiate 3D.
Lots of people are using a focus on the shutter release but I found it to frustrating myself.
Seems like you’ve worked out the problem though and I have my 500 set to only continuous as well ( something Northern focus recommended) I’ve accidentally changed it before And I’m happier knowing I cant do that again.
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lol. I tried getting used to the shutter button again as a wide area focus button, but my fingers insist on using BBF first after all these years. I think I will set it back to wide area for F1 and 3d tracking for bbf. It does still struggle a bit with afc if I keep the focus button pressed and move the camera from one subject to the next. It is better but not like the D850 or the 70-300mm which lock on new subjects immediately. I still haven't tested it out in the birding areas yet. Mostly in my back yard as I have been down for a while.
 
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Well, I went back to the latest firmware update and all appears to be well again. Not sure what was going on, but possibly new user error. I did find that 3D tracking seemed to work better than wide area AF, but had to get the bird in focus first before 3D tracking really locked on. Thanks everyone for all the advice and tips!
 
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Obeach said:
This happens with all camera, the solution is to turn the focus, via the barrel 1/4 turn to the right..to infinity. Then focus on the bird. Cameras/lens focus faster going from infinity to close rather than the other way. Works every time.
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I usually have the lens pointed to the sky, so it is alreaady pretty much on infinity. It is still strange that it first focuses on the bird and then loses it and hunts. I will try to just turn the focus to infinity next time and see if it locks on the first time. Good tip!
 
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