Marsha Jane
Active member
Also include how to set it up. I’ve never used it.
Pre-Capture
- Thread starter Tom Reynolds
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macwalter
Well-known member
I think 24mp would work if you have the exotic glass, otherwise I think in most cases you’d be lucky to get close enough in many settings. I will wait for pre-capture in Nikon in Raw. I also don’t want to have to go through 120fps images. There is a limit to my patience. Getting a shot like those African kingfisher would for me be a lot of patience and luck as I would be on a wildlife tour where I wouldn’t have the time or place to get such photos. Way things are going in the world these days it’s doubtful I’ll ever get back to Africa.
Roy
Well-known member
Pre-capture would be better RAW ...
BarryM
New member
A few weeks ago I tried pre-capture with my Z8, but it was frustrating. So I also would like to see suggestions for processing jpgs -- I have been using raw exclusively. In particular, it seems that noise reduction using PS or LR is not possible because the algorithms seem to work only before the demosaicing happens. Is this correct? Are there alternatives?
Does anybody want to speculate about whether we will ever see pre-capture of raw images via a firmware update, or is the hardware in the Z8 and Z9 not up to the task?
Does anybody want to speculate about whether we will ever see pre-capture of raw images via a firmware update, or is the hardware in the Z8 and Z9 not up to the task?
arbitrage
Well-known member
Nikon needs a reason to sell you a Z9II/Z8II....therefore just like Sony not adding precapture to the A1, Nikon (IMO) won't add it to the Z9/Z8 via FW.
HotGates
Member
Yes fine by me but why did Nikon add pre capture jpeg to the Z6III then?
Looks like they're not going in that direction.
TurtleCat
Well-known member
I haven’t tried precapture on my Z8 yet but if I do it will be limited situations. I’d make sure my JPEG settings are for fine detail, neutral picture control (what I normally start with anyway) and for minimal sharpening and noise. That will at least give me a couple of options for any fixes. And also making sure I only do it when the light is favorable.
Woody Meristem
Well-known member
I normally shoot JPG since most modern cameras seem to produce JPGs that are quite good without all the adjustements that RAW images require. To process my JPGs I usually use FastStone and Topaz DeNoise but will occasionally use Affinity or GIMP depending on what I want to do with the photo.
ricardo00
Well-known member
Pre-capture is great and kudos to OM for pioneering it. Although RAW would be better, have found the Z8/Z9 JPG to be okay, and am becoming more and more "dependent" on it. So if/when Nikon announces a camera with RAW pre-capture, will jump on it. In the meantime, have been using pre-capture at times. Some examples on my Flickr if interested:
Bingo. Reality is Nikon shooters got hooked on constant updates adding features but that seems to have stopped. What no one seems to want to except is that won’t be the norm. They rushed the cameras to the market to stop lost sales and caught up with firmware updates. Folks give Sony crap for not adding features but the a1 at 4 years old in a couple of months still can do some things others can’t and visa versa. To be fair what Sony needs to get better at is stable firmware updates.
Camera buyers and specifically Nikon shooters need to get used to buying a camera with the features it’s always going to have. Look at the F mount cameras. Nikon didn’t introduce new advanced features until they came out with a new model. Now that the Z8/9 are mature you’ll begin seeing this get back to normal.
I doubt we’ve seen the end of Nikon firmware updates. Fuji has been doing this for over a decade adding things to the cameras. The X-H2 is on firmware v7 at this point, many of them hit 5 revisions over the model span. It's an easy way to build customer loyalty and keep a model that's on the market for 4+ years exciting. It also trickles down to the "newer" models which are just the same mainboard attached to a less expensive sensor. It's pretty high bang for the buck for customers and Fuji has a very loyal customer base in part because of that.
Nikon's not in a position to be holding back in the market. Sony and Canon have that luxury but Nikon's well behind them in market share at this point so holding back just makes Sony or Canon look like a more attractive option. IMO they don't have that luxury at this point in time. In the past they did and they intentionally held many features back to prevent hurting higher end camera sales. Now they just need to capture market any way they can.
Here we are and they put bird subject detect in the 900 dollar Z50ii. That basically ensures we'll almost certainly see a firmware update to the Z6iii and probably Zf to include that as well. I'm sure we'll see further for the Z9 to improve AF right up until the Z9ii appears and pixel shift. At that point I do expect they'll move on to that new mainboard software development.
The A1 and Z9 were not that far apart at launch, less than a year. Nikon has just supported the Z9 development in a steady fashion since. A1 started with solid specs and still has them, but Nikon got pixel shift, auto capture and a bunch of AF updates (which Nikon needed to catch up, but auto capture and pixel shift? Those were just added in to make for happy customers). They could have held those features for Z9ii but didn't.
What would be a good move is releasing RAW precapture in some form right after the A1ii is launched to take a bit of the appeal out of that camera for people on the fence moving into higher end. The Z9/8 are significantly less money so that would greatly appeal vs the A1ii. It would also extend the Z9/8 sales onward strongly until the Z9ii launches and it'll be years before the following less expensive models arrive. That's lost sales if you don't address those features now. If I were Nikon I wouldn't want to be the only high end camera on the market without RAW precapture for a year or more until my next camera launch. I'd release it now and then a better version in the next camera to reduce lost sales.
I just don't think Nikon's in Sony or especially Canon's market position to be making demands to wait like that. They need to keep as close to the competition as possible while readying hardware to jump ahead as much as they can if they want to claw back market share. Every indication so far is that's exactly what they've been doing. I don't expect that to stop until they at least double the market position they're in right now.
They also could have just designed the camera in a way that only allows for JPEG precapture which is going to suck for them being without RAW precapture as the R5ii has it now and the A1ii will as well. Not a good position to be in for a year or more until the Z9ii arrives. It seems like the cameras can easily support it with the buffer they have now, but not if they built the hardware in a way that pulls stills off of a separate JPEG video stream to the EVF or something to that effect. It could be a hardware limitation.
Otherwise it would be very smart to firmware a 10-20 FPS RAW precapture and then a further 30+ FPS in the Z9ii to surpass it enough to have appeal. Then you don't have a camera on market without a key feature for a long period of time.
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FWIW I believe that as soon as sufficient experts learn to use RAW pre-capture @ 30 f/s with the A1-2 and R5-2 it will become abundantly clear that this is a requirement, not a "nice-to-have" and Z8/Z9 owners who shoot primarily birds will either switch brands or wait for the Z8/Z9 version that has it.
What that means in my view is that holding RAW pre-capture for a subsequent version is a gamble. They will lose market share to Sony and Canon but will have another round of sales to current Z8/Z9 owners.
In other words, Nikon guys, when Steve reports on his A1-2 be prepared!
What that means in my view is that holding RAW pre-capture for a subsequent version is a gamble. They will lose market share to Sony and Canon but will have another round of sales to current Z8/Z9 owners.
In other words, Nikon guys, when Steve reports on his A1-2 be prepared!
fcotterill
Well-known member
I agree 100% RAW PreCapture has become is a primary feature of the modern Prosumer and Pro MILC.
It's absence is especially bad if it's a sports/ wildlife camera.
Remember that Nikon added PreCapture to the Z9 in FW 2.0 (April 2022) and there were mixed reactions because it was jpg only. Nikon USA's Paul van Allen tried to spin the feature gap by advocating we should all be shooting jpg
this was in an online promotion talk with Paul's Camera in California.
I think I'm not alone in finds this to be insulting advice, particularly for those of us, who've paid thousands for high end products. This is an interesting thread to revisit
bcgforums.com
It's absence is especially bad if it's a sports/ wildlife camera.
Remember that Nikon added PreCapture to the Z9 in FW 2.0 (April 2022) and there were mixed reactions because it was jpg only. Nikon USA's Paul van Allen tried to spin the feature gap by advocating we should all be shooting jpg
this was in an online promotion talk with Paul's Camera in California.I think I'm not alone in finds this to be insulting advice, particularly for those of us, who've paid thousands for high end products. This is an interesting thread to revisit
.
Thanks Eric. When Paul was discussing Precapture, he referred to it as producing jpegs and then added something like “at least for now.” I thought he might be implying we could see Precapture with raw in a future firmware update. Hope so. I’d be happy even if Precapture used HE* raw and...
bcgforums.com
I would not be surprised at all if they add some form of it after the A1ii launch. Going a year or more with your competition having a feature that everyone wants is not a good move when you’re in the market share position Nikons in if that’s at all preventable. Holding a feature to force future sales may just backfire and cause people to just think, why not go with the brand that has the advanced features first to begin with.
It won’t be pre-capture at 30fps but I would think many would be quite happy with 10-20 until the z9ii arrives which will have those frame rates or more.
I just wouldn’t want to be sitting on the market as the brand without the feature for a year. I’m not so sure people jump brands that fast due to the expense of it all that much but any person making the step into this type of gear would find the Z8/9 less attractive without it and it’ll cost sales. But having the feature at a lower frame rate and the cameras are significantly less money to begin with means it will meet many’s needs and prevent lost sales.
It seems like the right move to me to add that feature if at all possible. The Z9ii will sell on just being a faster camera when it eventually arrives. They still need to catch the 30fps or more benchmark anyway.
It won’t be pre-capture at 30fps but I would think many would be quite happy with 10-20 until the z9ii arrives which will have those frame rates or more.
I just wouldn’t want to be sitting on the market as the brand without the feature for a year. I’m not so sure people jump brands that fast due to the expense of it all that much but any person making the step into this type of gear would find the Z8/9 less attractive without it and it’ll cost sales. But having the feature at a lower frame rate and the cameras are significantly less money to begin with means it will meet many’s needs and prevent lost sales.
It seems like the right move to me to add that feature if at all possible. The Z9ii will sell on just being a faster camera when it eventually arrives. They still need to catch the 30fps or more benchmark anyway.
jpgrove
Member
I agree 100% RAW PreCapture has become is a primary feature of the modern Prosumer and Pro MILC.
It's absence is especially bad if it's a sports/ wildlife camera.
Remember that Nikon added PreCapture to the Z9 in FW 2.0 (April 2022) and there were mixed reactions because it was jpg only. Nikon USA's Paul van Allen tried to spin the feature gap by advocating we should all be shooting jpg
I think I'm not alone in finds this to be insulting advice, particularly for those of us, who've paid thousands for high end products. This is an interesting thread to revisit
.
Thanks Eric. When Paul was discussing Precapture, he referred to it as producing jpegs and then added something like “at least for now.” I thought he might be implying we could see Precapture with raw in a future firmware update. Hope so. I’d be happy even if Precapture used HE* raw and...
In Nikon defence, the Pre Capture feature (I think) was aimed at sport shooters etc rather than how I would use it, where RAW would be more beneficial.
It's been a long while since V5 firmware, so maybe Nikon have managed to find a way to get the Z9 to do recapture RAW, hopefully we'll find out later this week, we cant be that far off an update.
That would be a savvy move though wouldn't it, releasing a firmware update that added pre-capture RAW right after the A1ii announcement.
That's probably the 1 and only thing on the R5ii or A1ii that I would like to have. Fix that and it's smooth sailing waiting for the Z9ii and trickle down models.
It is a perhaps unfortunate fact that wildlife photography is only a small portion of the overall camera market. That may affect priorities of manufacturers. Precapture in JPEG may work well for sports photographers because they can have better control over the environment where they are shooting. We on the other hand have to deal with unpredictable movements and varying backgrounds so having the flexibility of RAW is soemthing we really need.
fcotterill
Well-known member
Wildlife photography genres are a sizable segment of sales of the modern Prosumer and flagship cameras, and corresponding lenses. This includes bird photographers obviously.This market also includes bridge cameras. There is similar high demand for binoculars and spotting scopes.
Nikon has repeatedly stated its primary market for its recent light telephotos are bird photographers as well as aviation and other sports photographers.
Birdfairs, the Safari and similar specialized travel industry to the tropics and also polar destinations are strong proxies of the market for high end optical and imaging products. Camera companies invest in their market research, which includes mining exif data from social media
Agencies like Getty and AFP demand fast delivery of publication ready images, which are often submitted via networked cameras.
MikeCrapo
New member
Agree on BBAF. I hate holding down the shutter button half way for long periods of time. I would love to see the ability to move it.
Mike
jpgrove
Member
The Z50 II manuals have been made available on the Nikon Download site, following an update to Studio NX.
Previously this staggered release was followed by FW for other cameras, so I am hoping we see something Thursday (roughly 0400hr GMT was that seems to be when the Nikon Download site refreshes)
Fingers crossed
Previously this staggered release was followed by FW for other cameras, so I am hoping we see something Thursday (roughly 0400hr GMT was that seems to be when the Nikon Download site refreshes)
Fingers crossed