Regarding Dynamic-Area AF

[EricKlees]

I'm quite aware of what the small green boxes mean and when they're jumping around on a great egret's body and wings in a shot that's nearly frame filling, which wasn't uncommon prior to the dedicated Bird AF, turning off subject detection allowed me to use a smaller AF Area mode like Wide-Small and keep it on the bird's head.

Prior to the dedicated bird subject detection mode, which the Z8 still doesn't have, subject detection sometimes struggled with long necked waders. @Steve discusses this in his Z8/Z9 books and is something many of us experienced.

Perhaps this wasn't a situation you encountered but please be respectful in your replies and avoid derision (the laughter symbol) when discussing differing points of view with other members.

Never had that issue the way you describe. There are ways to manipulate the AF system and I'm not talking about switching AF modes, to get the AF system to grab and focus/lock on what you want. I was doing this even back on FW 1.10. I've been teaching Z9 setups and techniques for almost 2 years now.

 

[DRwyoming]

Never had that issue the way you describe. There are ways to manipulate the AF system and I'm not talking about switching AF modes, to get the AF system to grab and focus/lock on what you want. I was doing this even back on FW 1.10. I've been teaching Z9 setups and techniques for almost 2 years now.

There are definitely different approaches but one approach that some folks used when the Z9 was first released and prior to evolved subject detection was to disable the subject detection mode when it struggled. Yes, there are other approaches but as subject detection would allow the active AF point to stray wider than the selected area it could cause problems like the example I gave above. That you use and teach other approaches is great, but it doesn't have to be a one size fits all solution.

For instance in Steve's original Z9 setup guide one approach he described was using the Recall Shooting Function to disable subject detection when subject detection struggled. Yes, it's not the only approach but was at that time a valid and sometimes useful approach. I no longer have my Z9 setup that way as the addition of the dedicated bird subject detection mode has made it unnecessary when shooting wildlife but I did find it useful at the time

Also as pointed out in my previous post not every photography scene or subject even has eyes, a body or is recognizable as a discrete subject so subject detection is not required for all photo applications.

The point of my post is that the camera is a tool that can be configured in many ways for many different photography applications. It's not right or wrong to use different approaches even if it might not apply to your preferred subject matter. If someone uses a different approach and cannot get satisfying results then sure maybe they should try something different but the camera designers gave us a lot of options and features that we as photographers can choose to use or not to use and there's nothing wrong with that if it delivers the results we're after.

 

[John Woodworth]

Just out of curiously, has anyone photographed a male peacock with the most recent Z9 firmware?

If so, what settings were used?

Asking for a friend.

 

[EricBowles]

Do you use this mode on your mirrorless camera (Z9, Z8, etc.)? I read that some photographers have deactivated D-A AF.

I still use Dynamic regularly. There are two use cases:

1) To temporarily and quickly turn off Subject Detection. Take the photo below. If I was using animal subject detection, the owl is in the foreground and I would immediately focus there, but if I was in another mode or had all subject detection modes selected, I could end up focusing on the eye of the handler instead of the owl. I wanted the handler out of focus in this shot with focus completely on the owl. Switching to Dynamic would be an easy way to stop using subject detection temporarily. Another version of this outside of wildlife is photographing a bride. One of the shots is of the rings - either engagement ring or wedding rings. A situation similar to the photo below involves a bride holding out their had to phtograph the hand and ring with the bride out of focus in the background.

You can only see EXIF info for this image if you are logged in.

2) The subject is partially obstructed and with the Wide modes, the camera is focusing on branches in front of the subject. This applies to any obstruction - sticks, grasses, or other animals. The Wide modes use Nearest Subject Priority so the miss is a nearer target. Switching to Dynamic, I still have a mode that handles sudden subject movement, but I no longer have the occasional handicap of the nearest subject. Note - this is more a problem with earlier cameras than with the Z8 and Z9 - but it still happens occasionally. In this example I was pre-focusing on the bird even when the hawk was looking in the opposite direction.

You can only see EXIF info for this image if you are logged in.

 

[Ken Miracle]

I tried the dynamic areas early on after getting my first Z9 in April of 2022, but found my old reliable single point better for me if I wanted subject detection off. Before the firmware improvements I used it fairly often in my specialized bird photography. I photograph birds for ID in fast action run and gun situations in rapid changing light and habitat one second a raptor flying over in clears sky and suddenly a small bird shows up deep in the shade in a bush.

I still have my video button set to recall shooting functions hold and the only item is to turn off subject detection. Even after bird subject detect came out that works amazingly well, even on the little birds in the bushes if they are deep enough in or backlighted on a branch etc. and increasing exposure with my EV, going to DX mode (both controls at my finger tips on my lenses), I even use old fashioned center weighted metering when the sun is out and expect a lot of this. I rarely use manual focus anymore to give the AF a hand but still do especially when the eye is not readily apparent.

Bottom line with bird subject detection and all the assists at my finger tips (all accessed while looking through the viewfinder) I almost never have to turn subject detection off.

Yes @EricKlees there are still a couple of situations where I turn subject detection off.

If I have a flock shot suddenly happen and I want to focus deeper into the flock I have a button to go to custom wide area 1x1 with subject detect on and if that is still an issue I quickly turn subject detection off.

The other situation is if I am shooting birds and a mammal, mink, deer etc. suddenly presents itself I find it faster to push my video button to toggle subject detection off than going to my I menu etc. to switch to animal when bird does not work well on that particular mammal.

With the current firmware and bird detection available the Z9 is amazing.

 

[Steve]

I don't understand why people want to turn off SD. I have never come across a reason or situation that SD being turned off would be beneficial, ever

Mostly because there are times it misidentifies the area where you want it to focus. For example, with hippos, it loves to get "stuck" on the ears - not really where I want critical focus. For giraffes, it's the ossicones, for elephants, it just all over the place LOL. In each of those cases, it's actively working against my efforts to get a sharp eye.

The problem is, depending on the subject, there are times it goes after sub-optional areas and, frankly, you end up fighting with it. Heck, I still have it going to the bodies of long-necked birds sometimes, although nowadays I resolve that by using a smaller AF area, like Wide Small, to keep it on the head.

Still, there are lots of subjects (mostly mammals anymore) where it won't stick to the eyes and you have to override (or use an AF area that's not subject-detection enabled).

 

[Cameron T]

I still use Dynamic regularly. There are two use cases:

1) To temporarily and quickly turn off Subject Detection. Take the photo below. If I was using animal subject detection, the owl is in the foreground and I would immediately focus there, but if I was in another mode or had all subject detection modes selected, I could end up focusing on the eye of the handler instead of the owl. I wanted the handler out of focus in this shot with focus completely on the owl. Switching to Dynamic would be an easy way to stop using subject detection temporarily. Another version of this outside of wildlife is photographing a bride. One of the shots is of the rings - either engagement ring or wedding rings. A situation similar to the photo below involves a bride holding out their had to phtograph the hand and ring with the bride out of focus in the background.
View attachment 76680

2) The subject is partially obstructed and with the Wide modes, the camera is focusing on branches in front of the subject. This applies to any obstruction - sticks, grasses, or other animals. The Wide modes use Nearest Subject Priority so the miss is a nearer target. Switching to Dynamic, I still have a mode that handles sudden subject movement, but I no longer have the occasional handicap of the nearest subject. Note - this is more a problem with earlier cameras than with the Z8 and Z9 - but it still happens occasionally. In this example I was pre-focusing on the bird even when the hawk was looking in the opposite direction.
View attachment 76681

for picture 2, I usually switch to single point (not a 1x1 custom wide area) to punch through. Custom areas can work, but sometime it gets stuck on the branches in front, as you mentioned. Dynamic often seems too big and finnicky for heavy brush to me.

 

[Ken Miracle]

for picture 2, I usually switch to single point (not a 1x1 custom wide area) to punch through. Custom areas can work, but sometime it gets stuck on the branches in front, as you mentioned. Dynamic often seems too big and finnicky for heavy brush to me.

If needed I use the wide area custom 1x1 and turn of subject detection if needed ... one button push for my 1x1 with subj detect on and one button to toggle subject detection off and on. Limited in the number of easy to reach and use buttons I have to program even with Z9 and Z800 so since I use the 1x1 with subject detect on far more than single point now I made that change

 

[EricKlees]

Mostly because there are times it misidentifies the area where you want it to focus. For example, with hippos, it loves to get "stuck" on the ears - not really where I want critical focus. For giraffes, it's the ossicones, for elephants, it just all over the place LOL. In each of those cases, it's actively working against my efforts to get a sharp eye.

The problem is, depending on the subject, there are times it goes after sub-optional areas and, frankly, you end up fighting with it. Heck, I still have it going to the bodies of long-necked birds sometimes, although nowadays I resolve that by using a smaller AF area, like Wide Small, to keep it on the head.

Still, there are lots of subjects (mostly mammals anymore) where it won't stick to the eyes and you have to override (or use an AF area that's not subject-detection enabled).

That's what I am saying. I have never had those issues and have been shooting the Z9 2 years this January. I shoot 100% wildlife mammals and BIF.

 

[EricBowles]

for picture 2, I usually switch to single point (not a 1x1 custom wide area) to punch through. Custom areas can work, but sometime it gets stuck on the branches in front, as you mentioned. Dynamic often seems too big and finnicky for heavy brush to me.

That's a good approach as well.

My thought process is that because the subject is a bird and might quickly become a moving subject or in flight, I want a mode like Dynamic to prepare for that possibility. Dynamic is a little more flexible if the subject begins to move. I find Dynamic is extremely precise and works through grasses, brush, or branches.