Shore bird ID's

[Ralph]

Hi Ralph...Larry was asking if he could run Merlin on his PC computer, so that's what I was trying to help with. I have Merlin on both my pc and android phone and I tend to use it on my computer more often as that's generally where my bird photos reside...I use it on my phone out in the field as a bird book with sound files, but don't often find my phone camera that useful for getting good bird photos to run through Merlin.
cheers,
Alex

What I was referring to is that I usually transfer my photos to my phone or iPad from my D500. That way when I need to check an id it’s available. It’s real easy to transfer to my phone using airdrop for id From my iPad. I also use Merlin on the iPad. I thought maybe he could do the same by transferring his unknown species to his phone from his computer and I’d. But since he has it working using his computer it’s a moot point. Glad to hear Larry has it working.

 

[Isaac Grant]

Just wanted to throw a few things out there. Bit of a rant so be warned!

First off bare parts coloration (legs, beaks, skin around eye on some birds) is extremely variable in seabirds and not necessarily a good way to make identifications.

Ibird pro is a great app but I don't think there is any substitute for a good field guide. Call me old school but there is something about thumbing through a book that helps solidify an ID and helps retain the information. My personal belief is that Merlin has had a negative impact on bird photographers. When people rely on it too much they don't properly learn the birds and are selling themselves short.

To that last point, the vast majority of bird photographers that I have met did not start as birders and I think the results show. You have to really know your subjects to be able to photograph them in my opinion. Sure it is easy enough to go to a local wetland or park where there are tame birds and shoot away. Or go to a local breeding colony or whatever. But then you get stuck in the same bucket as everyone else and are shooting the same birds in the same spots. You are also extremely limited in the types of shots that you can produce.

As a lifelong birder I have a distinct advantage over people that don't know the birds. Drop me anywhere in the US and I will know what every bird is, I will know the sounds, I will know about them, best time to shoot them, see them, how tolerant they are to humans, etc. It is that kind of knowledge that I think helps to not only produce photos of a wide variety of species but also allows one to be more creative in their approach.

I have stood next to some famous bird photography tour leaders who did not know the birds at all which just blows me away. Literally did not know the most common and basic stuff. As an aside my brother in law is the director of photography of a major television show. He did not start that way of course. He started as an artist with a great creative eye. Then he started filming weddings, then got into the lighting union and ran wire and eventually did the lighting for countless TV show and movies. The he started doing steady cam work on the same movies and shows and spent time learning from the directors. Basically he worked for years on every part of the scenes and was wonderfully qualified to be the director of photography based on experience and knowledge. The same goes for bird photography for me. You have to truly know the birds to be able to photograph them.

Point is I think it is best to forget that Merlin exists. I'd take field knowledge over AI any day of the week.

 

[Ralph]

Just wanted to throw a few things out there. Bit of a rant so be warned!

First off bare parts coloration (legs, beaks, skin around eye on some birds) is extremely variable in seabirds and not necessarily a good way to make identifications.

Ibird pro is a great app but I don't think there is any substitute for a good field guide. Call me old school but there is something about thumbing through a book that helps solidify an ID and helps retain the information. My personal belief is that Merlin has had a negative impact on bird photographers. When people rely on it too much they don't properly learn the birds and are selling themselves short.

To that last point, the vast majority of bird photographers that I have met did not start as birders and I think the results show. You have to really know your subjects to be able to photograph them in my opinion. Sure it is easy enough to go to a local wetland or park where there are tame birds and shoot away. Or go to a local breeding colony or whatever. But then you get stuck in the same bucket as everyone else and are shooting the same birds in the same spots. You are also extremely limited in the types of shots that you can produce.

As a lifelong birder I have a distinct advantage over people that don't know the birds. Drop me anywhere in the US and I will know what every bird is, I will know the sounds, I will know about them, best time to shoot them, see them, how tolerant they are to humans, etc. It is that kind of knowledge that I think helps to not only produce photos of a wide variety of species but also allows one to be more creative in their approach.

I have stood next to some famous bird photography tour leaders who did not know the birds at all which just blows me away. Literally did not know the most common and basic stuff. As an aside my brother in law is the director of photography of a major television show. He did not start that way of course. He started as an artist with a great creative eye. Then he started filming weddings, then got into the lighting union and ran wire and eventually did the lighting for countless TV show and movies. The he started doing steady cam work on the same movies and shows and spent time learning from the directors. Basically he worked for years on every part of the scenes and was wonderfully qualified to be the director of photography based on experience and knowledge. The same goes for bird photography for me. You have to truly know the birds to be able to photograph them.

Point is I think it is best to forget that Merlin exists. I'd take field knowledge over AI any day of the week.

Isaac,
I totally agree. But the Merlin app is a good starting point for those that want to learn how to id. They should then go to one of the field manuals like Peterson to see the important identifying markings on the bird that distinguish it from others. That being said, I would guess that some photographers just need a quick way to identify the their subject.
What I have found with Merlin which has become very helpful is the ability to record and identify their sounds. It has taught me to ID my subject by sound and then pursue them with the camera. Snapped a photo of my first indigo bunting last month doing that.

 

[Isaac Grant]

Isaac,
I totally agree. But the Merlin app is a good starting point for those that want to learn how to id. They should then go to one of the field manuals like Peterson to see the important identifying markings on the bird that distinguish it from others. That being said, I would guess that some photographers just need a quick way to identify the their subject.
What I have found with Merlin which has become very helpful is the ability to record and identify their sounds. It has taught me to ID my subject by sound and then pursue them with the camera. Snapped a photo of my first indigo bunting last month doing that.

Congrats on your bunting and on using Merlin to help you. They are really pretty birds and once you learn that song you will realize how common they are in any appropriate habitat. Yes Merlin is a great tool if used to learn but my experience has been that very very few actually use it to learn. Instead people just use it to get an ID (which often enough is wrong) and then move on. I can not tell you how many times I have seen the absolute most common birds mis identified by birders and photographers that have not taken the time to learn stuff and just lean on Merlin for an ID. Birds like female Red-winged Blackbird, female House Sparrow, female House Finch or goldfinches, cowbirds, etc. For those not well versed in the local birds I would meet up with a local Audubon group or something and spend the time to really learn the most common birds in the area. Once you have a feel for those hen you can start branching out and will better be able to identify the more unusual birds in the area.

I live in New York City. At this time of year we get thousands of shorebirds migrating through. If you go to Jamaica Bay wildlife refuge you can be on the pond at eye level with thousands of birds. But if you want to photograph a particular species you need to be able to find it and pick it out amongst the masses of other birds that are there. No way Merlin will help you with that. That is just one example and trust me I don't mean to sound condescending or rude, but with bird photography knowledge is power. Anyone can go to a lodge in Texas or Costa Rica and shoot tame birds coming to a feeding set up. Same goes with backyard birds, breeding colony stuff and so on. And if that is all that people want to photograph or what they enjoy that is perfectly fine. But there are so many birds out there that the vast majority of people have a no clue what they are or how to photograph them.

And this is not to dump on photographers either. Trust me I know so many birders as well who never take the time to learn the songs. Every year when I see them they ask me the same questions of the same common birds that are singing. And I mean every year! Technology is great but to me nothing can supplement time in the field and time learning. It is an invaluable resource if you wan to be able to find your own birds and then produce beautiful photos of them.

 

[AlexY]

Isaac....
I agree...best to have the knowledge in your head. However, like Ralph and I would imagine, others, I like to have Merlin Bird ID on my phone and available especially for the songs as a further aid to identification, especially in those instances where the bird is singing a variant call. Merlin has - usually - several calls recorded and this is useful. The songs are useful as well when you are observing juvenile birds. On a recent camping trip, I used the Merlin Bird ID sound recordings to distinguish between juvenile Merlins and/or Peregrine falcons. I was observing Merlins as it turned out.
I also like the fact that my phone is smaller and lighter than my 2 Bird field guides!
Cheers,
Alex

 

[Ralph]

Congrats on your bunting and on using Merlin to help you. They are really pretty birds and once you learn that song you will realize how common they are in any appropriate habitat. Yes Merlin is a great tool if used to learn but my experience has been that very very few actually use it to learn. Instead people just use it to get an ID (which often enough is wrong) and then move on. I can not tell you how many times I have seen the absolute most common birds mis identified by birders and photographers that have not taken the time to learn stuff and just lean on Merlin for an ID. Birds like female Red-winged Blackbird, female House Sparrow, female House Finch or goldfinches, cowbirds, etc. For those not well versed in the local birds I would meet up with a local Audubon group or something and spend the time to really learn the most common birds in the area. Once you have a feel for those hen you can start branching out and will better be able to identify the more unusual birds in the area.

I live in New York City. At this time of year we get thousands of shorebirds migrating through. If you go to Jamaica Bay wildlife refuge you can be on the pond at eye level with thousands of birds. But if you want to photograph a particular species you need to be able to find it and pick it out amongst the masses of other birds that are there. No way Merlin will help you with that. That is just one example and trust me I don't mean to sound condescending or rude, but with bird photography knowledge is power. Anyone can go to a lodge in Texas or Costa Rica and shoot tame birds coming to a feeding set up. Same goes with backyard birds, breeding colony stuff and so on. And if that is all that people want to photograph or what they enjoy that is perfectly fine. But there are so many birds out there that the vast majority of people have a no clue what they are or how to photograph them.

And this is not to dump on photographers either. Trust me I know so many birders as well who never take the time to learn the songs. Every year when I see them they ask me the same questions of the same common birds that are singing. And I mean every year! Technology is great but to me nothing can supplement time in the field and time learning. It is an invaluable resource if you wan to be able to find your own birds and then produce beautiful photos of them.

Isaac,
I feel your passion. I caught the birding bug over 40 years ago working on sea going NOAA vessels talking to Cornell ornithologists on board doing bird counts.

 

[Richard Stern]

I'm with Isaac on this. There are really good birders and really good photographers, but not so many who are both. Merlin is a work in progress, and continues to improve with AI learning, but it still often makes mistakes. Becoming an expert at anything ( bird ID, playing a musical instrument, making a correct diagnosis, knowing how to invest wisely, etc etc.) takes more experience than downloading a 2 year old app and expecting it to do it all instantly for you . No doubt that will change in a few years, but then the fun and challenges will have gone.

 

[MikePapple]

What's in a name? That which we call a tern, by any other name would fly as graceful...

I've read something like that somewhere

Just call it a gull

 

[Larry Shuman]

I have downloaded bluestactks and I've been able to open Merlin, but that's about it. When I click get a photo I think it wants me to connect the camera. At this point it is far easier to ask google a ID question that it is to wade through Merlin.

 

[Patrick M]

I have downloaded bluestactks and I've been able to open Merlin, but that's about it. When I click get a photo I think it wants me to connect the camera. At this point it is far easier to ask google a ID question that it is to wade through Merlin.

On my iPhone, using the Merlin app, on the opening page, tap Photo ID then on the next screen tap Choose Photo

You can only see EXIF info for this image if you are logged in.

 

[Larry Shuman]

On my iPhone, using the Merlin app, on the opening page, tap Photo ID then on the next screen tap Choose Photo
View attachment 44769

I have Merlin on my desk top

 

[pochito]

Just call it a gull

Or (Sea) Swallow for that mater

 

[AlexY]

Larry, Here's a screenshot of Merlin from my Win PC

You can only see EXIF info for this image if you are logged in.

I've already chosen Photo ID. Simply drag your photo (jpg format) onto the camera icon. and wait. You may have to click on choose photo to find the photo that you've chosen - if so simply click on the photo and you'll be asked where and when you took it.

 

[Larry Shuman]

Larry, Here's a screenshot of Merlin from my Win PC

View attachment 44782
I've already chosen Photo ID. Simply drag your photo (jpg format) onto the camera icon. and wait. You may have to click on choose photo to find the photo that you've chosen - if so simply click on the photo and you'll be asked where and when you took it.

If I click on "Choose Photo" it does nothing. Should it take me to my picture folder?

 

[AlexY]

If I click on "Choose Photo" it does nothing. Should it take me to my picture folder?

Have you dragged a photo onto the Camera icon?

 

[Patrick M]

If I click on "Choose Photo" it does nothing. Should it take me to my picture folder?

On an iPhone, yes, it opens tne photo library

 

[Larry Shuman]

Have you dragged a photo onto the Camera icon?

In order to that I have to have photoshop and Merlin open at the same time on one screen, but I don't think photoshop will let me drag and drop into Merlin.

 

[AlexY]

In order to that I have to have photoshop and Merlin open at the same time on one screen, but I don't think photoshop will let me drag and drop into Merlin.

After I process a raw photo, I save the processed file - generally from Lightroom - as a high resolution jpg file in my photo library on one of my computer's HD's - Birds_2022 for example. If I'm going to use Merlin Bird ID on my computer as a further identification aid, I import the saved jpg photo from my photo library by dragging it to the camera icon on the Merlin photo id section of Merlin. I then tell Merlin where and when the photo was acquired and click on identify, cross my fingers, and await the results. Often it helps, but as others have pointed out, it sometimes misidentifies or cannot find a possible match....much like real life!

 

[Larry Shuman]

After I process a raw photo, I save the processed file - generally from Lightroom - as a high resolution jpg file in my photo library on one of my computer's HD's - Birds_2022 for example. If I'm going to use Merlin Bird ID on my computer as a further identification aid, I import the saved jpg photo from my photo library by dragging it to the camera icon on the Merlin photo id section of Merlin. I then tell Merlin where and when the photo was acquired and click on identify, cross my fingers, and await the results. Often it helps, but as others have pointed out, it sometimes misidentifies or cannot find a possible match....much like real life!

I don't use lightroom, I still use my CS6 photoshop. do you have two separate windows open to do that?

 

[AlexY]

I don't use lightroom, I still use my CS6 photoshop. do you have two separate windows open to do that?

Yes I do...I also have dual monitors.

 

[Larry Shuman]

Yes I do...I also have dual monitors.

I just opened both photoshop and Merlin. After downsizing the windows I was able drag and drop into Merlin. However Merlin did not give nearly enough information that my google search did. All it did was identify the bird as a Forester's Tern, but not a juvenile with a description of the coloring of a juvenile Forester's Tern.

 

[Ken Miracle]

Just wanted to throw a few things out there. Bit of a rant so be warned!

First off bare parts coloration (legs, beaks, skin around eye on some birds) is extremely variable in seabirds and not necessarily a good way to make identifications.

Ibird pro is a great app but I don't think there is any substitute for a good field guide. Call me old school but there is something about thumbing through a book that helps solidify an ID and helps retain the information. My personal belief is that Merlin has had a negative impact on bird photographers. When people rely on it too much they don't properly learn the birds and are selling themselves short.

To that last point, the vast majority of bird photographers that I have met did not start as birders and I think the results show. You have to really know your subjects to be able to photograph them in my opinion. Sure it is easy enough to go to a local wetland or park where there are tame birds and shoot away. Or go to a local breeding colony or whatever. But then you get stuck in the same bucket as everyone else and are shooting the same birds in the same spots. You are also extremely limited in the types of shots that you can produce.

As a lifelong birder I have a distinct advantage over people that don't know the birds. Drop me anywhere in the US and I will know what every bird is, I will know the sounds, I will know about them, best time to shoot them, see them, how tolerant they are to humans, etc. It is that kind of knowledge that I think helps to not only produce photos of a wide variety of species but also allows one to be more creative in their approach.

I have stood next to some famous bird photography tour leaders who did not know the birds at all which just blows me away. Literally did not know the most common and basic stuff. As an aside my brother in law is the director of photography of a major television show. He did not start that way of course. He started as an artist with a great creative eye. Then he started filming weddings, then got into the lighting union and ran wire and eventually did the lighting for countless TV show and movies. The he started doing steady cam work on the same movies and shows and spent time learning from the directors. Basically he worked for years on every part of the scenes and was wonderfully qualified to be the director of photography based on experience and knowledge. The same goes for bird photography for me. You have to truly know the birds to be able to photograph them.

Point is I think it is best to forget that Merlin exists. I'd take field knowledge over AI any day of the week.

I am jealous of the time you have been blessed to be a birder. I am about 6 years into birding at 74. My go to paper research books are The Crossley ID Guide for Raptors, The Kaufman Field Guide to Advanced Birding and Advanced Birding by Kenn Kaufman (Peterson Field Guides) but they are not used in the field not practical for me in the heat of battle

I use Merlin with the knowledge that it may only give me a starting point or be completely off. I use it after most birding trips and find it incorrect or inconclusive on many birds.

I have a hearing loss, since I was 16, totally gone above 9,000 hz and marginal above 8000 so birding by ear not very usefull for me much of the time. I do now have hearing aids that let me hear some birds, like Song Sparrows, if they are close enough. The first time I had the hearings aids in and could hear a song sparrow I was photographing it was an amazing experience.

I use cornell all about birds on my computer and have it on my phone but seldom use it in the field when birding.

As I have gained more experience I can ID many birds by field ID marks even in flight. When I get images downloaded on to my computer I can usually ID from Cornell All About birds if needed. My biiggest ID challenge is late summer molting adults and juvenile birds growing up.

At home my "paper" still comes out and I learn a bit more every birding day. I also have a couple of ornithologist friends that help out and I help them out with photographs.

My Ornitolgogist friends have edcuated me on why you need to be very judicious about using electronic calls for getting a bird photograph given the negative impact it can have on the birds especially if mutliple people are hitting them with calls in a day and day after day and they are being diverted from normal activities, like feeding

 

[Ken Miracle]

I just opened both photoshop and Merlin. After downsizing the windows I was able drag and drop into Merlin. However Merlin did not give nearly enough information that my google search did. All it did was identify the bird as a Forester's Tern, but not a juvenile with a description of the coloring of a juvenile Forester's Tern.

be very carfull of google searches for birds you will get a lot of incorrect information. Go to a reliable source like Cornell All About Birds etc..

 

[Isaac Grant]

I am jealous of the time you have been blessed to be a birder. I am about 6 years into birding at 74. My go to paper research books are The Crossley ID Guide for Raptors, The Kaufman Field Guide to Advanced Birding and Advanced Birding by Kenn Kaufman (Peterson Field Guides) but they are not used in the field not practical for me in the heat of battle

I use Merlin with the knowledge that it may only give me a starting point or be completely off. I use it after most birding trips and find it incorrect or inconclusive on many birds.

I have a hearing loss, since I was 16, totally gone above 9,000 hz and marginal above 8000 so birding by ear not very usefull for me much of the time. I do now have hearing aids that let me hear some birds, like Song Sparrows, if they are close enough. The first time I had the hearings aids in and could hear a song sparrow I was photographing it was an amazing experience.

I use cornell all about birds on my computer and have it on my phone but seldom use it in the field when birding.

As I have gained more experience I can ID many birds by field ID marks even in flight. When I get images downloaded on to my computer I can usually ID from Cornell All About birds if needed. My biiggest ID challenge is late summer molting adults and juvenile birds growing up.

At home my "paper" still comes out and I learn a bit more every birding day. I also have a couple of ornithologist friends that help out and I help them out with photographs.

My Ornitolgogist friends have edcuated me on why you need to be very judicious about using electronic calls for getting a bird photograph given the negative impact it can have on the birds especially if mutliple people are hitting them with calls in a day and day after day and they are being diverted from normal activities, like feeding

I am also losing my hearing some but thankfully can still hear all of the birds although they are masked a bit by the ringing in my ears.

I can not stress enough the difference that it makes to know the birds and what it is that you are shooting. Just tonight I went to a local shorebird spot and a birder friend said he was looking for a White-rumped Sandpiper which he had never seen. I explained to him what to look for and how to differentiate them from the numerous semi palms and leasts. Then I went to shoot. While laying in the mud a white rump was right in front of me. I motioned to him and got him on it. After sunset he mentioned how all of the things that I said were easily visible, most importantly how much they stand out from the other peeps once you actually lay eyes on them. You can spend a long time trying to turn a semipalm into one but when you actually see an adult white rump their size, wing extension beyond the tail, pale color, etc. stand out very well. If that was my target for the evening and I was not keenly aware of how to tell them apart I would have lost the opportunity of a close bird in golden light that was mixed in with 50 other similar looking birds.

 

[Ken Miracle]

I am also losing my hearing some but thankfully can still hear all of the birds although they are masked a bit by the ringing in my ears.

I can not stress enough the difference that it makes to know the birds and what it is that you are shooting. Just tonight I went to a local shorebird spot and a birder friend said he was looking for a White-rumped Sandpiper which he had never seen. I explained to him what to look for and how to differentiate them from the numerous semi palms and leasts. Then I went to shoot. While laying in the mud a white rump was right in front of me. I motioned to him and got him on it. After sunset he mentioned how all of the things that I said were easily visible, most importantly how much they stand out from the other peeps once you actually lay eyes on them. You can spend a long time trying to turn a semipalm into one but when you actually see an adult white rump their size, wing extension beyond the tail, pale color, etc. stand out very well. If that was my target for the evening and I was not keenly aware of how to tell them apart I would have lost the opportunity of a close bird in golden light that was mixed in with 50 other similar looking birds.

That would not be a regular scenario in my birding world ... although we get our share of shore birds coming through .... Idaho is not a shorebird hot spot Around here it would be more like sorting out a rare for here Goldein-crowned Sparrow or a White-throated Sparrow from the masses of White-crowned and Song Sparrows. I have a wall of rare for Idaho sparrows and a few other rare bird 8x10 prints in my bathroom where I can enjoy them sitting on the throne ... LOL