Z8 Overheating

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Nimi said:
If you're predominantly a video shooter in the Nikon world, Z9 is clearly better. For stills, either is great with a tradeoff of weight/features.
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Yeah, I'm almost ready to pull the trigger. I do about 60% stills and 40% video, with the latter increasing more and more, so video ability is key. I've seen some reviews, but nothing concrete about the Z9 and whether or not it has dual native ISOs for video - 800 and 4000. Is that the case? I'm curious if there's a dynamic range chart somewhere that shows the DR at the different ISOs for video. Using the native/base ISOs is ideal for DR and noise, but sometimes, in a pinch, I need to go a bit below or above, so I'm curious how much DR I'd be sacrifice and how much more noise there'd be.
 
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urbo73 said:
Yeah, I'm almost ready to pull the trigger. I do about 60% stills and 40% video, with the latter increasing more and more, so video ability is key. I've seen some reviews, but nothing concrete about the Z9 and whether or not it has dual native ISOs for video - 800 and 4000. Is that the case? I'm curious if there's a dynamic range chart somewhere that shows the DR at the different ISOs for video. Using the native/base ISOs is ideal for DR and noise, but sometimes, in a pinch, I need to go a bit below or above, so I'm curious how much DR I'd be sacrifice and how much more noise there'd be.
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Gerald Undone has done extensive testing, as did Sidney Baker-Green, both on YouTube. Sidney especially addressed the noise in the shadows and gushed about it. CINED has an older review on their site, similar conclusions.

It's not clear whether it's dual-iso or just invariance. My guess is, it is dual-iso since it's essentially the same sensor as the A1 which is dual-iso. Regardless, youre going to get good dynamic range between 800 and 4000, especially if you shoot in flat profile, 10bit. The recent innovation introduced in FW4.1 is going down to Lo3 which is I think ISO 100 with same DR as native. There is no gain in stops, just a "sliding" of the entire scale. This technique btw is also in the new iPhone.
 
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Nimi said:
Take a look at the Fujifilm GFX100 mk II. It looks like an even more capable hybrid. The few clips I've seen will go against an Arri no problem and will blow away anything under $20,000. The native lenses are also superb, and the sensor size is not outrageous so most FF lenses would adapt. 14+ stops of dynamic range.
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Some big limitations…

petapixel.com

Fujifilm GFX 100 II Review: Pushing Medium Format Boundaries

The best parts of this camera aren't what Fujifilm advertised.
petapixel.com petapixel.com
 
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Went to a large, local camera store that sells Nikon, Canon, Fuji, Sony, etc., and tried to get a feel for things. I am ready to pull the trigger on the Z9, as I was saying above, but some real doubts from most of the folks working there with regard to video. Talking about NRAW not being compatible with some editors, how N-log is not great with DR and in post compared to C-log, and mostly how Nikon has no real history with video until now, and that Canon is a safer bet as they also have cinema cameras, have been doing it, committed, etc. Man, having small doubts, not going to lie.I can't disagree on some things (NRAW and Premiere for example), but they are not a Canon shop, and it was interesting.
 
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urbo73 said:
Went to a large, local camera store that sells Nikon, Canon, Fuji, Sony, etc., and tried to get a feel for things. I am ready to pull the trigger on the Z9, as I was saying above, but some real doubts from most of the folks working there with regard to video. Talking about NRAW not being compatible with some editors, how N-log is not great with DR and in post compared to C-log, and mostly how Nikon has no real history with video until now, and that Canon is a safer bet as they also have cinema cameras, have been doing it, committed, etc. Man, having small doubts, not going to lie.I can't disagree on some things (NRAW and Premiere for example), but they are not a Canon shop, and it was interesting.
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Watch Gerald Undone's YT. A Sony shooter. I disagree with their comments on DR; in my tests the Z9 bested the R5C and FX3. But you have to use Davinci if you shoot NRAW. I found that the Nlog is superior to Slog2 in DR and colors, better than Clog in DR but nothing touches Canon colors before you get into an Arri.

Canon has the best colors, but doesn't have an 8k hybrid body that doesn't overheat. Arguably the R5C if you can live with a fan. The R5 mk II are coming, maybe that.

Nikon is the least supported among your viable options for the reasons you had mentioned, so personally I'd start with which lenses you want to use. I find that the Z lenses are perfect for my use cases, and if I need to adapt (eg anamorpic) I use a PL. For building a rig, Wooden Camera has everything you'll ever need.
 
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Nimi said:
Watch Gerald Undone's YT. A Sony shooter. I disagree with their comments on DR; in my tests the Z9 bested the R5C and FX3. But you have to use Davinci if you shoot NRAW. I found that the Nlog is superior to Slog2 in DR and colors, better than Clog in DR but nothing touches Canon colors before you get into an Arri.

Canon has the best colors, but doesn't have an 8k hybrid body that doesn't overheat. Arguably the R5C if you can live with a fan. The R5 mk II are coming, maybe that.

Nikon is the least supported among your viable options for the reasons you had mentioned, so personally I'd start with which lenses you want to use. I find that the Z lenses are perfect for my use cases, and if I need to adapt (eg anamorpic) I use a PL. For building a rig, Wooden Camera has everything you'll ever need.
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Yeah, I watched Gerald's video. I suppose there's just a bias towards Canon, mostly because they've been in it for longer. People love that C-log and the "color science". I don't know how the Z9 colors from N-log are and how bad they need to be corrected or not. In terms of lenses, I like that Nikon has the 20,24,35,50, and 85 1.8 S lenses that perform well and don't look like cheap, kit lenses.
 
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urbo73 said:
Yeah, I watched Gerald's video. I suppose there's just a bias towards Canon, mostly because they've been in it for longer. People love that C-log and the "color science". I don't know how the Z9 colors from N-log are and how bad they need to be corrected or not. In terms of lenses, I like that Nikon has the 20,24,35,50, and 85 1.8 S lenses that perform well and don't look like cheap, kit lenses.
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Nikon colors are second only to Canon, to my eyes. But it's very easy to make them identical and the trick is to be comfortable when correcting to 709 if you shoot Log, in any system. I created a .cube for Nlog that works great for me in both Davinci and Premiere. The prepackaged one are too saturated.

The R5, R5C, Z8 or Z9 will all get you excellent 8k footage. If you can live with 4k there are more options.
 
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Nimi said:
Nikon colors are second only to Canon, to my eyes. But it's very easy to make them identical and the trick is to be comfortable when correcting to 709 if you shoot Log, in any system. I created a .cube for Nlog that works great for me in both Davinci and Premiere. The prepackaged one are too saturated.

The R5, R5C, Z8 or Z9 will all get you excellent 8k footage. If you can live with 4k there are more options.
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I can more than live with 4k, as that's what I'm delivering. As long as it's good quality, oversampled of course. It's nice to have 8K for times when I need it and more future-proof. What more options are you referring to? I need Z9 level of stills, AF, etc.
 
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urbo73 said:
I can more than live with 4k, as that's what I'm delivering. As long as it's good quality, oversampled of course. It's nice to have 8K for times when I need it and more future-proof. What more options are you referring to? I need Z9 level of stills, AF, etc.
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Sony A7Siii is probably the best hybrid I've used.
 
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urbo73 said:
Yeah, no thanks :) That's a video-oriented camera. I need the AF performance of a Canon 1 or D5/Z9 with a lot more MPs to punch in. I once used the A92 at a hockey game - horrible ergonomics, I couldn't get on with Sony.
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R5, 5C, Z8 and Z9 are your playgrounds.
 
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Nimi said:
R5, 5C, Z8 and Z9 are your playgrounds.
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Yes sir! With the former two about to be replaced :) Nothing is easy, haha. I know the Z8's battery life is not nearly as good as the Z9s, and that it will overheat, so I worry about having it do that when on a shoot at a client. Or fumbling with batteries. It's just too risky for me, so really, it's just the Z9. Like I was saying, I like the 20,24,35,50, and 85 1.8 S primes, but Canon has that 28-70 f/2 that would replace a few on that front. If that R3 had 40+MPs I would strongly consider it. But I guess that's what the R1 will be one day. Just not sure I want to keep waiting.
 
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urbo73 said:
Yes sir! With the former two about to be replaced :) Nothing is easy, haha. I know the Z8's battery life is not nearly as good as the Z9s, and that it will overheat, so I worry about having it do that when on a shoot at a client. Or fumbling with batteries. It's just too risky for me, so really, it's just the Z9. Like I was saying, I like the 20,24,35,50, and 85 1.8 S primes, but Canon has that 28-70 f/2 that would replace a few on that front. If that R3 had 40+MPs I would strongly consider it. But I guess that's what the R1 will be one day. Just not sure I want to keep waiting.
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Look at the Z 1.2 S. Vastly superior to the 1.8. And I think a 35mm is next in the release schedule.
 
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Nimi said:
Look at the Z 1.2 S. Vastly superior to the 1.8. And I think a 35mm is next in the release schedule.
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Sure, but they will have to wait a bit. I just purchase two Z9 bodies, 24-70 2.8, 70-200 2.8, 1.4tc, 400mm 2.8, 35 1.8 and 85 1.8. The primes for me are very good for now and not my most used. Hence the 1.8 vs 1.2 for now.

Time to delve into this camera inside and out and play.

One thing I am on the fence about - When shooting video on sticks, I don’t want to waste battery life (sometimes the cameras will be on for hours , filming on and off though out the day), so I want to use external power. One option is the dummy battery and AC wall adapter. But I’m wondering if it’s just the same using the EH-7P Charging AC Adapter, which is part of the supplied MH-33 battery charger. I can just plug the EH-7P directly into the USB port on the Z9 and do it that way. Any downsides to either?
 
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urbo73 said:
Sure, but they will have to wait a bit. I just purchase two Z9 bodies, 24-70 2.8, 70-200 2.8, 1.4tc, 400mm 2.8, 35 1.8 and 85 1.8. The primes for me are very good for now and not my most used. Hence the 1.8 vs 1.2 for now.

Time to delve into this camera inside and out and play.

One thing I am on the fence about - When shooting video on sticks, I don’t want to waste battery life (sometimes the cameras will be on for hours , filming on and off though out the day), so I want to use external power. One option is the dummy battery and AC wall adapter. But I’m wondering if it’s just the same using the EH-7P Charging AC Adapter, which is part of the supplied MH-33 battery charger. I can just plug the EH-7P directly into the USB port on the Z9 and do it that way. Any downsides to either?
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Congrats!

No idea, I only use external power (brick connected through USB) when shooting day-to-night timelapses and that's in the field.
 
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The battery needs to be in the camera, even when powering via USB-C, but it will only get charged when the camera is off.
 

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its not the battery but the storage medium where the bulk of the heat occurs.... especially when its used heavily, like video or a lot of high fps work. There's a heat dump on the cards, but it's limited.
 
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Patrick M said:
its not the battery but the storage medium where the bulk of the heat occurs.... especially when its used heavily, like video or a lot of high fps work. There's a heat dump on the cards, but it's limited.
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Not that simple. The cards may be the cause, but the heat is generated by/at battery. Hence shooting with external power even with a "hot card" alleviates the issue on the Z8. The battery in that case us simply a heat-sink since it is neither drawn down nor charging.
 
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Z8 battery is lower voltage (7v) therefore higher amp draw compared to Z9 (10.8). Z8 battery location (right beside cards) means battery heat has an impact on cards. Also the power regulation circuitry is likely in the same area making its own heat. The usb-c PD is capable of several voltages up to 20v which means it can more efficiently supply the needed power without creating as much heat.
 
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