Single point is still tricky (as it always has been I suppose) - I tell ya, the Wide (S) area is the ticket for BIF
Am I the only one who prefers DSLR?
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FB101
Well-known member
I just came back from one hour of shooting in 7F weather (-14c outside of the US) and the D500 with grip + el-18c battery performed like a trooper - and I have to say, now that I got rid of the el-15 batteries and moved to el-18, I don't see any battery drain, even at those temperatures. An hour of shooting, camera turned on the whole time and the battery hasn't dropped 1 bar. With the el15, shooting at -14c, it would have drained (probably not completely but likely by half if not more). I don't know that a Z6ii would have done any worse, I just love being able to grab the D500 or D850 and know they will just perform, even in challenging conditions.
I’m in the same boat with the 600. I will be buying a 600 in June. I’ve been debating this myself as I love my D850 and haven’t liked the Z bodies for wildlife. My plan was to buy a D6 this week and just stick with DSLR until Nikon figures out their path and produces a true pro level Z body.
That was the plan and then Sony announced the a1. I’ve had no real interest of switching brands but the a1 has checked off so many boxes I ordered one along with the 200-600 to test the waters. If it’s everything I hope it is I’ll buy a Sony 600 rather than a Nikon. I will likely hold onto the D850 and my other lenses for the non action stuff. I could see eventually switching everything to Sony but frankly if I’m using my 14-24 I’m not using a 600 so two systems shouldn’t be much of an issue.
This wasn’t an easy decision but frankly I don’t want to drop $12k on a 600 knowing Nikon is dropping a Z one next year. It’s likely going to be about impossible to get one and as of today they don’t have a body in the Z mount worth mounting it to. I don’t want to wait another 2+ years for a native Nikon Z 600 and body. So it’s likely Sony will get that sale
. Timing is everything, Nikon needs to step on the gas petal.
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R.Philip
Well-known member
Good luck finding a 600. I have been on the notification list since early December at Adorama and B&H. They're on back order for 2-4 weeks...it has been 8 weeks already. I have seen them elsewhere...Abe's of Maine, but I never did business with them before. After all the 600 f/4E posts I have been reading, I have concerns beyond the cost. However, I'll use it with my D850 and hopefully its replacement for 5 years or more. I'm 60 now...don't know how much I'll be into photography then. The mirrorless transition may transition me to landscape photographer and away from telephoto photography.I’m in the same boat with the 600. I will be buying a 600 in June. I’ve been debating this myself as I love my D850 and haven’t liked the Z bodies for wildlife. My plan was to buy a D6 this week and just stick with DSLR until Nikon figures out their path and produces a true pro level Z body.
That was the plan and then Sony announced the a1. I’ve had no real interest of switching brands but the a1 has checked off so many boxes I ordered one along with the 200-600 to test the waters. If it’s everything I hope it is I’ll buy a Sony 600 rather than a Nikon. I will likely hold onto the D850 and my other lenses for the non action stuff. I could see eventually switching everything to Sony but frankly if I’m using my 14-24 I’m not using a 600 so two systems shouldn’t be much of an issue.
This wasn’t an easy decision but frankly I don’t want to drop $12k on a 600 knowing Nikon is dropping a Z one next year. It’s likely going to be about impossible to get one and as of today they don’t have a body in the Z mount worth mounting it to. I don’t want to wait another 2+ years for a native Nikon Z 600 and body. So it’s likely Sony will get that sale
All fair points. I hope there is a D850 replacement but with Nikons recent comments I’m not sure they will offer one. I’d sure consider buying it if they come out with one.
R.Philip
Well-known member
I did not state my question properly. I meant to say is it possible to manufacture a mirrorless camera that has an F mount so everyone can use all of their Nikon F mount glass on a new mirrorless camera. I believe that would make a lot of Nikon faithful very happy if they did. Thanks for your response Steve.
R.Philip
Well-known member
Nikon is playing with fire. If My F mount glass no longer ties me to Nikon because of the need to switch to Z mounts, they risk losing a significantly loyal customer base that owns their F mount lens line up. If I have to switch, it sounds like Sony and Canon have better options for mirrorless than Nikon.I’m in the same boat with the 600. I will be buying a 600 in June. I’ve been debating this myself as I love my D850 and haven’t liked the Z bodies for wildlife. My plan was to buy a D6 this week and just stick with DSLR until Nikon figures out their path and produces a true pro level Z body.
That was the plan and then Sony announced the a1. I’ve had no real interest of switching brands but the a1 has checked off so many boxes I ordered one along with the 200-600 to test the waters. If it’s everything I hope it is I’ll buy a Sony 600 rather than a Nikon. I will likely hold onto the D850 and my other lenses for the non action stuff. I could see eventually switching everything to Sony but frankly if I’m using my 14-24 I’m not using a 600 so two systems shouldn’t be much of an issue.
This wasn’t an easy decision but frankly I don’t want to drop $12k on a 600 knowing Nikon is dropping a Z one next year. It’s likely going to be about impossible to get one and as of today they don’t have a body in the Z mount worth mounting it to. I don’t want to wait another 2+ years for a native Nikon Z 600 and body. So it’s likely Sony will get that sale
Yup. This is exactly what I’m doing. Trying out Sony, if I’ve got to buy new glass I might as well try out the king of the hill for focus tracking.
ruley74
Well-known member
This is exactly why i think Nikon need to fix the FTZ, it release a FTZ 2.0, with a good body released and on par adaptation of legacy glass to say Canon, they have at least a slim hope of retaining some customers or/and transitioning some to mirrorless. If we must buy new glass for equal performance I'd say a lot of people will switch away.... i will be if that doesn't occur when time comes.
fcotterill
Well-known member
This is one of Nikon's strategic errors - the incomplete FTZd - which keeps popping up in forums. The irony is laughable in the extreme contrast between legacy and technical excellence versus gormless mgmt of the company. Their engineers have the expertise to support the adapting of screwdriver AF to Z cameras, and full exif support, recording fstop settings, is surely simple.
What Pitiful arrogance of the only camera company not to leverage on the unique legacy of the F-mount - Prioritize the fullest possible support to use these lenses on Z cameras! The fully functional FTZd can be an optional accessory, obviously. Albeit Nikon will do well to bundle/subsidize it in special offers with explicit marketing at AFD owners etc. If available, it would likely sell a pile of Z5's etc.
On different but related subject, there's recurring speculation about a hybrid DSLR ie with EVF/OVF. Nikon has the patents for this, although such a camera will have a high price, its uniqueness might attract many Hobbyists as well as older Nikonians/Nikonites.
What Pitiful arrogance of the only camera company not to leverage on the unique legacy of the F-mount - Prioritize the fullest possible support to use these lenses on Z cameras! The fully functional FTZd can be an optional accessory, obviously. Albeit Nikon will do well to bundle/subsidize it in special offers with explicit marketing at AFD owners etc. If available, it would likely sell a pile of Z5's etc.
On different but related subject, there's recurring speculation about a hybrid DSLR ie with EVF/OVF. Nikon has the patents for this, although such a camera will have a high price, its uniqueness might attract many Hobbyists as well as older Nikonians/Nikonites.
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Eddietheone
Member
Thanks again Steve Wide (s) it is next time as wellSingle point is still tricky (as it always has been I suppose) - I tell ya, the Wide (S) area is the ticket for BIF
I’m in the same boat with the 600. I will be buying a 600 in June. I’ve been debating this myself as I love my D850 and haven’t liked the Z bodies for wildlife. My plan was to buy a D6 this week and just stick with DSLR until Nikon figures out their path and produces a true pro level Z body.
That was the plan and then Sony announced the a1. I’ve had no real interest of switching brands but the a1 has checked off so many boxes I ordered one along with the 200-600 to test the waters. If it’s everything I hope it is I’ll buy a Sony 600 rather than a Nikon. I will likely hold onto the D850 and my other lenses for the non action stuff. I could see eventually switching everything to Sony but frankly if I’m using my 14-24 I’m not using a 600 so two systems shouldn’t be much of an issue.
This wasn’t an easy decision but frankly I don’t want to drop $12k on a 600 knowing Nikon is dropping a Z one next year. It’s likely going to be about impossible to get one and as of today they don’t have a body in the Z mount worth mounting it to. I don’t want to wait another 2+ years for a native Nikon Z 600 and body. So it’s likely Sony will get that sale
The Sony 600mm is the best 600mm I've ever used (well, so far
) It's lighter and more nimble than the Nikon 600E, and I'm going to test the two against each other one of these days - but my "seat of the pants" estimate is that the 600 Sony is sharper both with and without a TC.Try smaller companies for the 600mm. Roberts and Procam are my pics. Procam found my 600 Sony in about a week.
Ahh, gotcha.
Technically, I think Nikon thinks they did with the D780. They didn't of course, but they think they did since they put the Z7 sensor and it's PDAF system in.
The sad thing is, Nikon has a patent to do exactly what you want - a hybrid DSLR. The way it looks like it works is you can use it as a DSLR and with a flip of a lever, have an EVF instead. To me this seems like a no-brainer. Anyone heavily invested in F-mount glass can have a 2-in-1 camera that works like a DSLR or mirrorless depending on what you need. If the D880 has this feature, they'd probably be out of stock for years. However, Nikon have been very conservative lately, so I'm not optimistic.
R.Philip
Well-known member
If it comes to fruition, put me down for 5. I'll keep one and sell the others at a premium to pay for the one I keep. Kidding....
FB101
Well-known member
There should be a good chance for this to materialize since I bought my D850 this past december and I am a lightning rod for Murphy's law
- based on my track record a game changing upgrade is right around the corner.
I think I speak for everyone here when I thank you for taking one for the teamThere should be a good chance for this to materialize since I bought my D850 this past december and I am a lightning rod for Murphy's law
I want a d850 so bad but I'm just going to wait this one out and see what is coming before I dive head first... Again.
Oosty
Well-known member
It's fascinating how technology driven photography has become and how it is becoming a fashion industry. I recognise that the latest offerings are amazing, particularly in low light situations but am surprised to see how many people are changing cameras with each new iteration. I look at hundreds of images each week on my screen, many taken with "old" tech and at screen resolution it's very hard to tell the difference between a well exposed and well composed D700 shot and a similar shot with an 850. I'm sure the differences are there if (very) large prints are required but wonder how many hobby photographers ever print even their best shots.
I also think that chasing the rainbow and trying to keep up with cell phone developments will lead to the demise of some of our favourite brands as it becomes more and more difficult to recover R&D costs before a product becomes "obsolete" This is what happened to Rolls Royce in the early '70's and it may end up sinking our old friends.
ruley74
Well-known member
I think the biggest thing that i come back to with the upgrade or newer vs older models is the newer features make the job a little easier for you as opposed to a better image. further, if you always wait just in case or live in hope there's a period of time that you're not taking the shots...
Although I've relatively new to this game than most on here i quickly realised this (for me) and it helped me make decisions... I could have continued wildlife stuff with the EOS R but man i had to work for it at times, so changing to a modern, proven DLSR and not the latest and greatest mirrorless meant, if i did it smart, minimal cost (until i went all in with the 600, but that was well after the change) to change over as I bought a hell of a lot used and I had to work less to get the shots... for me I achieved balance.
Although I've relatively new to this game than most on here i quickly realised this (for me) and it helped me make decisions... I could have continued wildlife stuff with the EOS R but man i had to work for it at times, so changing to a modern, proven DLSR and not the latest and greatest mirrorless meant, if i did it smart, minimal cost (until i went all in with the 600, but that was well after the change) to change over as I bought a hell of a lot used and I had to work less to get the shots... for me I achieved balance.
eaj101
Well-known member
Remarkable how we like to frame things as either/or. For a Nikon user, there are three advantages to adding mirrorless to your kit: 1) old lenses - IBIS adds VR to those non-VR lenses while focus peaking makes nailing focus with the manual lenses much easier, 2) the Z50 may be the best walkaround/travel camera Nikon's made, 3) there are some exceptional (seriously) Z lenses. Bottom line: I still use DSLRs a lot (mostly D850 and D500), but there are a lot of situations where one of the Zs really fits.
Ado Wolf
Well-known member
I personally think if Nikon improved the FTZ adapter, they will sell much more Z bodies than they do now.. it is the bottle neck for most photographers heavily invested in F glass.
I for example just decided to buy the D780 over the Z6 for this very same reason. I tried and hated the FTZ! It slows everything down.. and makes lens changing in the field a real nuisance..
@eaj101 : not all old lenses work on the FTZ adapter like they would on a D780.. but for those that do, "you’ll have three-axis IBIS available (yaw, pitch, and roll - one more axis than we had with regular in-lens VR. All menu driven)" (Steve)
I for example just decided to buy the D780 over the Z6 for this very same reason. I tried and hated the FTZ! It slows everything down.. and makes lens changing in the field a real nuisance..
@eaj101 : not all old lenses work on the FTZ adapter like they would on a D780.. but for those that do, "you’ll have three-axis IBIS available (yaw, pitch, and roll - one more axis than we had with regular in-lens VR. All menu driven)" (Steve)
R.Philip
Well-known member
I checked websites of these and others and the Nikon 600 F/4E is out of stock. I ordered it from B&H. I just booked hotel reservations for the Grand Tetons in late May. Hopefully I get it by then. If not, I'm hoping some 500PF's are available in time to get one before my trip.
Does B&H provide any details of expected delivery dates on items like this?
R.Philip
Well-known member
I just ordered on line and did not speak with anyone. I figured an actual order would get priority over customers on their alert email list.
Reading a lot of everyone's comments about technology renovation and then problems getting equipment is souring me a little. If this lens doesn't come by my trip, I may re-think my interest in wildlife photography and just focus on landscape photography. It appears to be easier and less costly. Foregoing the cost of this lens would allow me to venture into the mirrorless realm, if I have to...
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Perfect Light Camera and Supply in Idaho Falls, ID and Yellowstone Camera their seasonal store in West Yellowstone frequently has 500PF in stock. You can call and get one now or check with them in May when you will be next door in western distance terms. They quit carrying the big primes like the 600 several years ago when the likes of Tamron brought out the G2 and Sigma the Sport and Nikon the 200-500 and many people find the variable focal lengths fit them better. When the 500pf came out the pro photographer owner who has back problems tried one and fell in love so to speak ... he still grumbles about the occasional missed opportunity having a fixed focal length but he finds the 500pf fast focusing, great image quality and unbeatable at 500 mm in portability. Like me he almost never uses a tripod for wildlife and likes to move to different vantage points, angles and perspectives that a tripod inhibits and the 500pf encourages. It is amazing how fast he gets stuff from Nikon and Tamron and "might" be able to get you a 600 f/4E quickly. As I have read elsewhere in the forum that Bozeman Camera in Bozeman Mt. also frequently has 500pf etc. in stock or can get it quickly.