Sony A1-2

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BrianSmall said:
I'll happily pay $7500..................the A1 is by FAR the best camera I've ever used in a 35+ year professional career. The A1ii will be that much better and now I can have an A1 as a back up. It's just a tool I'll use for my business and it will eventually pay for itself. When it's released I expect the A1ii will become the new industry standard. For the hobbyist it may be a different feeling.
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I definitely agree with your assessment of the A1. Minus some issues caused by firmware I don’t have issues with the current A1. I still think it’s probably the best overall camera out there. I truly do hope they will make an effort to continue supporting this camera, considering how much it cost. One thing that I will sort of disagree with you on is, I think the overwhelming majority of the Camera company revenue comes from serious amateurs such as myself. In my opinion, it Sony overlooks this crowd, I don’t think that will end well for them in the long run. I’ve known and talked to several professional photographers over the years and one thing most of them have in common is when they buy gear they hold onto it for a very long time. Most I have talked to don’t have anywhere near the amount of gear that I have being a hobbyist. In fact, I still know a couple guys that shoot real estate photography with DSLR bodies and make a good living at it. I just think they need to definitely focus more on the group that I fall into, Whether it be something between the A1 and the lower megapixel bodies or counting to support the current ones. like for my use and situation I have never one time shot in excess of 20 frames per second on the A1 and I have no reason to. They could come out with something similar respect with a slower frame per second with improved auto focus. That would be a dream camera for me. I certainly have no desire to have a higher megapixel sensor nor do I want a global sensor. I am very content with a sensor that’s in the A1 currently. Hopefully they will surprise us and come in at a lower price than the first day one. Although not likely, it would certainly show some appreciation for the people that buy them.
 
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ChrisM said:
What does this say about Sony's approach?
They appear to want to conquer the professional market above all when it comes to high performance cameras.
Nikon has a different approach it seems, and wants to cater to the amateur action shooter.
The Z8 is a very good option.
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Sony has probably the most radical market segmentation of any camera brand - they are really focused on avoiding overlaps as a way to force buying into multiple categories (under the guise of "we build the best tool for 1 job" ) - Canon does it too but their "cripple hammer" approach is less elegant (purely from a marketing standpoint, not a judgement on the success of their approach)

That works when the steps are not too stretched - with the A1 they were pushing that limit but the camera was so novel, they could get away with it. Market has changed in 4 years, and if they push the price to $8000 (with grip) they will certainly test the resilience of their strategy, especially when they are not really looking after those who already paid to get into the Sony system.
What portion of A1 owners will skip this upgrade? What portion will leave because they don't see a focus to serve their needs? What portion will put up with it because Sony still offers the best option for their needs but will resent the brand (never a great strategy)? What portion will be pleased? And let's go crazy, what portion will buy into Sony because the A1mkii will be so goundbreaking that $8k and a kidney will seem like the bargain of the century just like the original did? :ROFLMAO:
 
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FB101 said:
Sony has probably the most radical market segmentation of any camera brand - they are really focused on avoiding overlaps as a way to force buying into multiple categories (under the guise of "we build the best tool for 1 job" ) - Canon does it too but their "cripple hammer" approach is less elegant (purely from a marketing standpoint, not a judgement on the success of their approach)

That works when the steps are not too stretched - with the A1 they were pushing that limit but the camera was so novel, they could get away with it. Market has changed in 4 years, and if they push the price to $8000 (with grip) they will certainly test the resilience of their strategy, especially when they are not really looking after those who already paid to get into the Sony system.
What portion of A1 owners will skip this upgrade? What portion will leave because they don't see a focus to serve their needs? What portion will put up with it because Sony still offers the best option for their needs but will resent the brand (never a great strategy)? What portion will be pleased? And let's go crazy, what portion will buy into Sony because the A1mkii will be so goundbreaking that $8k and a kidney will seem like the bargain of the century just like the original did? :ROFLMAO:
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I agree with you, the Sony A1 was a milestone, and everyone from every brand was in awe of the performance and technical prowess.
But that was 4 years ago.
The Z8 may not match the A1, but for many is more than good enough at near half the price when Nikon offers a rebate.
The Canon R5II is apparently also véry capable, and even smaller brands like Olympus have a capable action body now.
I still expect the Sony A1II to do well, but the times have changed, and someone with a lot of Nikon glass will probably see the A1 and say "oh, nice", and go about the business of using his Nikon lenses.

That's quite a change from 4 years ago.

I won't upgrade myself, I still like the A1 a lot, have grown fond of it even, but I hated the ridiculous price (had far less issues with the price tag for the 600GM) and have no desire to swallow that again, especially knowing that Sony will no doubt starve it regarding firmware updates, which is a bit of an insult at that price.
 
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The Ladder of Inference is alive and well in this thread. Throw in a little drama triangle for measure as well.
I’m with Doug, I’m not forming an opinion based on a couple of rumors and a whole bunch of assumptions as to what it will or won’t be.
One needs to remember just because there is a new model doesn’t obsolete what you’re using nor force you to buy something.
Some want pre capture, some don’t care. Some want more fps, some don’t care. Some want a flippy screen, some don’t care. I could go on and on but the value of the camera will not be equal for everyone.
I suspect no matter what the features are of the a1MKII it likely won’t sell as well as the first model. I suspect a new Z8 or Z9 won’t either. All three of these cameras for their brand was a huge leap, updates won’t be as big of a leap.
I use my a9III significantly more than my a1’s. For shooting birds in flight and sports it’s the best camera out there. I’ll gladly give up 25MP for the increased capability. Add in the ergonomics, flip screen and the fps and boom you have a great camera but many either don’t care about the fps or don’t want less MP. To each their own.
 
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ChrisM said:
I agree with you, the Sony A1 was a milestone, and everyone from every brand was in awe of the performance and technical prowess.
But that was 4 years ago.
The Z8 may not match the A1, but for many is more than good enough at near half the price when Nikon offers a rebate.
The Canon R5II is apparently also véry capable, and even smaller brands like Olympus have a capable action body now.
I still expect the Sony A1II to do well, but the times have changed, and someone with a lot of Nikon glass will probably see the A1 and say "oh, nice", and go about the business of using his Nikon lenses.

That's quite a change from 4 years ago.

I won't upgrade myself, I still like the A1 a lot, have grown fond of it even, but I hated the ridiculous price (had far less issues with the price tag for the 600GM) and have no desire to swallow that again, especially knowing that Sony will no doubt starve it regarding firmware updates, which is a bit of an insult at that price.
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When the A1 debuted it was way out ahead of the other brands but in 2024 it seems more on par with the Z8/9, and Canon R5ii then ahead in any meaningful way. I have the Z8 which I picked because there’s nothing I can see in the A1 that’s game changing or better for me. 20fps raw is fine, there’s the jpeg precapture which works fine for many subjects once you get good at preediting the JPEGs profiles in camera as you would the raw files after shooting. It just lacks ai denoise. 10 FPS raw doesn’t matter for almost everything I shoot and the precapture in jpeg is more important to me than those FPS, but it’s a bummer it’s not in RAW. Nikons probably holding that back for the next gen.

I really don’t see any meaningful autofocus advantage anymore. Canon and Nikon seem just as good and it just depends on specific subjects which is slightly better or worth in a situation. The new Canons have some advanced subject recognition for certain subjects but how many shots are we missing these days? It seems like you can pick any of these up and be very confident you’ll get a bunch of keepers

It leaves the Sony looking overpriced. If I had one I’d probably just continue using it for a while as I’m really having a hard time seeing how they pry 7500 dollars out of peoples wallets without a huge update which at this point seems unlikely given the tech advance from Canon in the R1 (which seemed less than expected). We’re at diminishing returns and smaller increments in tech it seems like. I expect it’ll have some form of RAW precapture, and ai chip with a bit better subject recognition and a little more frame rate but not a lot of it’s the same sensor and the hardware limitations are still there. I expect a less spectacular set of specs compared to the A1 at its launch relative to what’s out there now. I expect that same issue for Nikon when the Z9ii arrives as well.

I wouldn’t be stressed if I owned the current A1 as it’s excellent and will continue capturing anything well for many more years to come. Hopefully they get better at firmware updates.

We live in a time of amazing cameras that’s for sure.
 
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DavidT said:
The Ladder of Inference is alive and well in this thread. Throw in a little drama triangle for measure as well.
I’m with Doug, I’m not forming an opinion based on a couple of rumors and a whole bunch of assumptions as to what it will or won’t be.
One needs to remember just because there is a new model doesn’t obsolete what you’re using nor force you to buy something.
Some want pre capture, some don’t care. Some want more fps, some don’t care. Some want a flippy screen, some don’t care. I could go on and on but the value of the camera will not be equal for everyone.
I suspect no matter what the features are of the a1MKII it likely won’t sell as well as the first model. I suspect a new Z8 or Z9 won’t either. All three of these cameras for their brand was a huge leap, updates won’t be as big of a leap.
I use my a9III significantly more than my a1’s. For shooting birds in flight and sports it’s the best camera out there. I’ll gladly give up 25MP for the increased capability. Add in the ergonomics, flip screen and the fps and boom you have a great camera but many either don’t care about the fps or don’t want less MP. To each their own.
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Exactly. The A1 was a huge leap in the market. Look what’s out there now. It’s a lot harder to make a leap like that against the current market. I’d expect the precapture with RAW and subject recognition improvements but not really much past that.

You could see that in the Canon R1 and R5ii launch, people had super high leap frog expectations and we got some refinement but nothing like the A1 leap when it came out. I’d expect more of that from all the brands.

We will hit a point where sales slow for all these brands as people find that if they’re honest the camera they have is already great and they should get out more and shoot and practice getting closer to wildlife using blinds and other methods to improve the image quality.

If I owned an a1 I’d be excited for TC lenses that are probably on the way soon more than a body upgrade.
 
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Lee R said:
Exactly. The A1 was a huge leap in the market. Look what’s out there now. It’s a lot harder to make a leap like that against the current market. I’d expect the precapture with RAW and subject recognition improvements but not really much past that.

We will hit a point where sales slow for all these brands as people find that if they’re honest the camera they have is already great and they should get out more and shoot and practice getting closer to wildlife using blinds and other methods to improve the image quality.
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Well said!
 
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DavidT said:
The Ladder of Inference is alive and well in this thread. Throw in a little drama triangle for measure as well.
I’m with Doug, I’m not forming an opinion based on a couple of rumors and a whole bunch of assumptions as to what it will or won’t be.
One needs to remember just because there is a new model doesn’t obsolete what you’re using nor force you to buy something.
Some want pre capture, some don’t care. Some want more fps, some don’t care. Some want a flippy screen, some don’t care. I could go on and on but the value of the camera will not be equal for everyone.
I suspect no matter what the features are of the a1MKII it likely won’t sell as well as the first model. I suspect a new Z8 or Z9 won’t either. All three of these cameras for their brand was a huge leap, updates won’t be as big of a leap.
I use my a9III significantly more than my a1’s. For shooting birds in flight and sports it’s the best camera out there. I’ll gladly give up 25MP for the increased capability. Add in the ergonomics, flip screen and the fps and boom you have a great camera but many either don’t care about the fps or don’t want less MP. To each their own.
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Like I said, Sony is concentrating on sports. Fast focus, high fps, price is no object because the company the photographer works for pays for the camera or the photographer can write it off on their taxes. Nikon is concentrating on the pro and hobbyist nature photographer and Canon at least gives those people a more affordable option in the 5D MKII. I don't know about anyone else but if this A1II does come out at $7500 or higher, it's going to be a burr under my saddle to maybe switching to Nikon to get pre-capture and lenses better suited to wildlife and bird photography.
 
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RikWriter said:
Like I said, Sony is concentrating on sports. Fast focus, high fps, price is no object because the company the photographer works for pays for the camera or the photographer can write it off on their taxes. Nikon is concentrating on the pro and hobbyist nature photographer and Canon at least gives those people a more affordable option in the 5D MKII. I don't know about anyone else but if this A1II does come out at $7500 or higher, it's going to be a burr under my saddle to maybe switching to Nikon to get pre-capture and lenses better suited to wildlife and bird photography.
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Very well said and I am in the same boat.
 
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An A1II pushing $8K would have me looking over the fence a little more. But I've owned or shot everything over the fence already (Except the R1 obviously). And I don't see any advantage in the Z8/Z9 over the current A1, let alone the A1II. And I don't have any lenses in Canon that I'd want over my current Sony setup. The RF600 could replace my 600GM but the RF600 is longer and worse balanced so when I had it I always felt the 600GM to be a better lens. The 300GM is a game changer for me. The RF120-300 is nice but so much heavier than the 300GM.

But I did like the R5II....If Canon brings out some impressive TC lenses like the recent patents show then I'd actually consider an R5II over A1/A1II because it has RAW precapture (all be it in a half-baked implementation compared to A9III (A1II assumed)). The Canon R1 looks nice but I see no reason to buy that over an A9III. A9III looks better in every way.

Maybe Z8II/Z9II will bring something else to the table because Nikon bird lenses are top notch. I think those updates are at least a year away. Probably for 2026 Winter Olympics at earliest so late 2025 announcement.

In the end, I'll probably just buy the A1II as I really see it as my last camera. If it has 60FPS and precapture than I don't think there is much else I will lust for in 4 years for now. I could care less about global shutter. I didn't see any advantage of when I had the A9III for what I shoot over a fast scanning stacked A1/Z9 type sensor.
 
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I just put an order in with my retailer of choice for the A1II. Basically gets me to the top of the line (or close). Sounded like he already had others contact him. Even sent me an invoice with an order number which he will update with the price later. But nice thing is I can back out without any penalty any time if I change my mind.
 
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arbitrage said:
I just put an order in with my retailer of choice for the A1II. Basically gets me to the top of the line (or close). Sounded like he already had others contact him. Even sent me an invoice with an order number which he will update with the price later. But nice thing is I can back out without any penalty any time if I change my mind.
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I’m extremely happy with all my Sony lenses as well as the teleconverter. I could easily keep the lenses I have now for 10 to 15 years and never want anything. My biggest issue is, I wish there was something between the A7R5 and future A1-2. I think for folks like myself that don’t want the really high frame rates, It would be nice to have something in between. Something in the 40-50 megapixel range, perhaps even 20 frames per second with a stack sensor in the $4000 range. I would probably buy two of them to be honest. The A9 has never interested me, any version of it. The A7R5 image quality is phenomenal, but you also have to watch for rolling shutter and it’s not the best in low light. Hopefully at some point they’ll come out with a mid range option for folks like myself that don’t give a darn about high frame Rate. Maybe it will be an A2 lol.
 
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sh1209 said:
I’m extremely happy with all my Sony lenses as well as the teleconverter. I could easily keep the lenses I have now for 10 to 15 years and never want anything. My biggest issue is, I wish there was something between the A7R5 and future A1-2. I think for folks like myself that don’t want the really high frame rates, It would be nice to have something in between. Something in the 40-50 megapixel range, perhaps even 20 frames per second with a stack sensor in the $4000 range. I would probably buy two of them to be honest. The A9 has never interested me, any version of it. The A7R5 image quality is phenomenal, but you also have to watch for rolling shutter and it’s not the best in low light. Hopefully at some point they’ll come out with a mid range option for folks like myself that don’t give a darn about high frame Rate. Maybe it will be an A2 lol.
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Yeah basically like a Z8 or an R5II. I don't see Sony adding a model in that range. But maybe some day. They could make the A7V with a stacked 30-odd MP sensor but they would have to bring it up market so they probably won't.
 
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Bill G. said:
Me too
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But they insinuate it’s all in our heads whenever you contact them. Whenever you use an item as much as we use these cameras, you just know when something’s not functioning correctly. I’d like to just be back to 1.20 performance and I don’t think that’s asking a lot of a company.
 
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DavidT said:
Glad to see the adopted the a9III design and also happy to see the C5 button is there! Didn’t think it would get it!
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You will want it to boost to 60FPS (my guess at the max FPS for A1II).
My gut tells me this isn't going to support Type 4 CFe-A as Sony loves to cheap out and reuse parts (remember the crappy rear LCD on A1 that was replaced a month later on the other cameras with the "a" versions?). Therefore I think they will have similar buffer bandwidth at 60FPS as the A9III does at 120FPS. I found the A9III to be useable at 60FPS but 120FPS limited its use due to the buffer. Therefore A1II will be limited at 60FPS so boost it is....run it normally at 30FPS/precapture ON.
I really hope Sony has increased the buffer size and/or increased processing speed to write to Cfe-A 4.0. But I'm prepared for disappointment when it comes to buffer and card speed.
 
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arbitrage said:
I find it interesting that Sony uses Gold lettering for the A9III on the top plate but white lettering for the A1 (and all the lesser models). Maybe A9III is the flagship at $6K and A1II comes in at $5500.....or NOT....LOL

Also note the A1II branded strap in the box in the first photo.
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If you are correct and it were to come out at $5500, then I think it would sell like hotcakes. I would be tempted to buy it at that price. If it comes out at 7500–$8000 and I’m going to have to sink $4500 into it, if I can sell my current A1 that will be a hard pass for me. If what they’re saying is true, it’s going to be the same sensor so obviously it’s going to produce the same exact images. The higher frames per second means nothing to me, so the only thing I would be paying $4500 for would be an articulating screen and pre-capture. That’s definitely a hard pass for me. I really think once they’re out, I might go just find someone with a mint used first generation A1 and be happy as a clam.
 
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