Z9 Firmware 3.0 Released

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I never needed to switch banks to use 3D tracking for anything. I have 4 banks for night, general, BIF and portraits all setup as I want. If I am in BIF and I want to subject track a subject thats not an animal it worked in version2 not v3. If I however change one setting and take of wide-l from my primary focus and I switch to dynamic or single (and even if I dont use it) then 3D tracking on my FN1 button just works.
 
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FWIW, Z9, today shot in the rain, 20fps, 1/1600 f/3.5, and focus acquisition was hit and miss under rain. [Wide-area AF (C2)] semi thin rectangular box, SD people. I can give size of rectangle if so desired. Had to use rectangle, as focus lost from head/face to vertical poles holding bars. Needed to wait ~1sec to capture face in rectangle, else your guess is as good as mine what the camera will pick in the view plane. Had to use people SD, as auto was pure hit and miss.

The issue also occurs if the frontal face is suddenly hidden for a fraction of a second, then focus is lost, rather than tracking the trajectory. Had person fall off, tracked the face until flip, then lost it to the background, then sudddenly recaptured when sprawled on the gound and face/head visible. NEVER EVER happened with my M1X.

[a3] Focus Tracking with Lock-On; has minimal effect and appear to be contrary to M1X setting. I need to test more. Setting of 2 seemed to be better.

Logic would suggest that a longer delay would cause the focus to keep track in the direction of the movement (eg: pole/object cutting the target path), pending recapture once the object is past. Not so with my Z9. I'm lacking some understanding. I imagined that delay in focus change is added with (4) and (5), and (1) and (2) focus reacts more quickly. So setting 4 or 5, allows objects to cut in front of the focus point, yet recover once the target subject is back in view (fractions of seconds). More tests to be done. Not a happy camper.
 
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I've finally had a chance to play with 3.0 a little more and there is something up with 3D. I had actually used 3.0 in FL while filming and shooting the 600 F/4 review (I had a Nikon rep's camera with 3.0 on it so I used a it a couple days before public release). Now that I've had more time to test, it's clear that 3D become erratic sometimes with subject detection on and without a target. (I did some tests with 2.1 and then the same tests with 3.0 and yes, there is absolutely a difference in behavior.)

This explains some of the weirdness I saw when shooting in FL. I often switch to 3D mid-flight and it would often stick really well - and on the next target, drop off immediately and start wandering around. I think in those situations, it either never recognized the target or had it and lost it. Once lost, it didn't seem to know what to do. So, far, I don't have a good workaround, other than not to use 3D with subject detection (which is basically the only way I use it).

I like the Z9, but man, it's the buggiest pro camera I've ever used... (my problems are not limited to this one bug - there have been lockups, weird ISO maxing, that sort of thing too)
 
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Steve said:
I've finally had a chance to play with 3.0 a little more and there is something up with 3D. I had actually used 3.0 in FL while filming and shooting the 600 F/4 review (I had a Nikon rep's camera with 3.0 on it so I used a it a couple days before public release). Now that I've had more time to test, it's clear that 3D become spastic sometimes with subject detection on and without a target. (I did some tests with 2.1 and then the same tests with 3.0 and yes, there is absolutely a difference in behavior.)

This explains some of the weirdness I saw when shooting in FL. I often switch to 3D mid-flight and it would often stick really well - and on the next target, drop off immediately and start wandering around. I think in those situations, it either never recognized the target or had it and lost it. Once lost, it didn't seem to know what to do. So, far, I don't have a good workaround, other than not to use 3D with subject detection (which is basically the only way I use it).

I like the Z9, but man, it's the buggiest pro camera I've ever used... (my problems are not limited to this one bug - there have been lockups, weird ISO maxing, that sort of thing too)
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Steve to clarify what myself and others have seen - if subject detection works - 3D works. If no subject is detected or subject detection is off you get the similar jumpy results. Yes waiting for 3.1as are others.
 
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BarkingBeansCoffee said:
Steve to clarify what myself and others have seen - if subject detection works - 3D works. If no subject is detected or subject detection issues off you get the similar jumpy results. Yes waiting for 3.1as are others.
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Yes, that's exactly what I'm seeing.

I wanted to post / confirm because I'll need to make a note of it in my update of the Z9 guide if it's not fixed before I get the update done. I think it'll be wrapped up in the next few weeks.
 
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Steve said:
I've finally had a chance to play with 3.0 a little more and there is something up with 3D. I had actually used 3.0 in FL while filming and shooting the 600 F/4 review (I had a Nikon rep's camera with 3.0 on it so I used a it a couple days before public release). Now that I've had more time to test, it's clear that 3D become spastic sometimes with subject detection on and without a target. (I did some tests with 2.1 and then the same tests with 3.0 and yes, there is absolutely a difference in behavior.)

This explains some of the weirdness I saw when shooting in FL. I often switch to 3D mid-flight and it would often stick really well - and on the next target, drop off immediately and start wandering around. I think in those situations, it either never recognized the target or had it and lost it. Once lost, it didn't seem to know what to do. So, far, I don't have a good workaround, other than not to use 3D with subject detection (which is basically the only way I use it).

I like the Z9, but man, it's the buggiest pro camera I've ever used... (my problems are not limited to this one bug - there have been lockups, weird ISO maxing, that sort of thing too)
Click to expand...
I’m glad in one sense that you noticed the buggy 3D especially when subject is lost or not identified. 3D would still lock on in V2 - I thought I was going mad in not understanding the WHY?! - hope they fix this soon meanwhile I have been using v2.1 and its a night and day difference.
 
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Yesterday I have found a concern after going to 3.0 and today I confirmed it. I was shooting deer and noticed the big moon to the east. Changed exposure comp to -3.5 and snapped the moon a few times. Went back to 0 compensation. All the photos following the moon were very dark. The NX Studio show I was at 0 before and after the moon images.
Did the same today, making darn sure I went to 0 exposure compensation after the moon, but all photos after the moon were very dark.
So I assume if I use the exposure compensation, I'll shut down the camera, pull the battery, do a dance and call a few friends, then hope the camera will be back to 0 compensation. Very upset about this as I lost buck photos both evenings. This is the first concern I have had with this camera.
 
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Well at least I can take comfort in knowing it's not just me....
After taking me a couple months of on again off again shooting with my new Z9 w/V2.1 I felt I was finally getting used to its mannerisms to where I was coming close to matching my D5 performance. Then I upgraded to V3.0 and it was like learning an all new camera all over again for birds and birds in flight photography, and NOT in a good way. I have been way frustrated, and find myself asking why I ever left my D850 and D5 cameras ! ☹️

Is it possible to go back to V2.1? (at least that was workable for me).

Here's hoping for V 3.1 very soon!
 
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VStammer said:
Well at least I can take comfort in knowing it's not just me....
After taking me a couple months of on again off again shooting with my new Z9 w/V2.1 I felt I was finally getting used to its mannerisms to where I was coming close to matching my D5 performance. Then I upgraded to V3.0 and it was like learning an all new camera all over again for birds and birds in flight photography, and NOT in a good way. I have been way frustrated, and find myself asking why I ever left my D850 and D5 cameras ! ☹️

Is it possible to go back to V2.1? (at least that was workable for me).

Here's hoping for V 3.1 very soon!
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Yes. Just follow the update instructions using 2.1. It will revert. I think I may try 3.0 further knowing that if subject detection isn’t working I need another AF mode.
 
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Steve said:
Yes, that's exactly what I'm seeing.

I wanted to post / confirm because I'll need to make a note of it in my update of the Z9 guide if it's not fixed before I get the update done. I think it'll be wrapped up in the next few weeks.
Click to expand...
Hope you have Nikon on speed dial........................... And they are smart enough to answer the phone!
 
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Charles Loy said:
Yesterday I have found a concern after going to 3.0 and today I confirmed it. I was shooting deer and noticed the big moon to the east. Changed exposure comp to -3.5 and snapped the moon a few times. Went back to 0 compensation. All the photos following the moon were very dark. The NX Studio show I was at 0 before and after the moon images.
Did the same today, making darn sure I went to 0 exposure compensation after the moon, but all photos after the moon were very dark.
So I assume if I use the exposure compensation, I'll shut down the camera, pull the battery, do a dance and call a few friends, then hope the camera will be back to 0 compensation. Very upset about this as I lost buck photos both evenings. This is the first concern I have had with this camera.
Click to expand...
Interesting. I had something similar happen in FL and thought it was just my imagination during a rapid series of shots. They were darker than expected, but I figured I just wasn't paying good attention. Maybe it wasn't my imagination after all.
 
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It's certainly challenging to explain the disparity being reported in experiences with Fw3.0 - or rather identify the core reason(s). One factor may be the differences in subjects: BIF or not, diversity of flying birds. Admittedly I don't do much BIF so nothing to add here :)

Different custom Z9 setups is the other factor. This is likely a major reason. I only use BBAF, with AF-ON+AF-area on Fn buttons. The primary AF mode is 3D tracking set with Red Record.

I tried late yesterday to break 3D mode on my Z9 with fw3.0, and it just worked well on different coloured/tones tree bark patches, flowers in a grassy meadow, garden implements etc with a 400 f4.5S. With/Without Subject Recognition, 3D mode picked up and stuck to targets.
 
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fcotterill said:
It's certainly challenging to explain the disparity being reported in experiences with Fw3.0 - or rather identify the core reason(s). One factor may be the differences in subjects: BIF or not, diversity of flying birds. Admittedly I don't do much BIF so nothing to add here :)

Different custom Z9 setups is the other factor. This is likely a major reason. I only use BBAF, with AF-ON+AF-area on Fn buttons primary AF mode is 3D tracking set with Red Record.

I tried late yesterday to break 3D mode on my Z9 with fw3.0, and it just worked well on different coloured/tones tree bark patches, flowers in a grassy meadow, garden implements etc with a 400 f4.5S. With/Without Subject Recognition, 3D mode picked up and stuck to targets.
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Interesting - can I ask the the 3D button you mentioned was that set to the video record button or to red record instead of white - never understood, but it is very early where I am so maybe I just haven’t woke up lol !
 
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NicholasN said:
Interesting - can I ask the the 3D button you mentioned was that set to the video record button or to red record instead of white - never understood, but it is very early where I am so maybe I just haven’t woke up lol !
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I prefer to select the primary AF mode for the camera pressing Red Record and scrolling front-dial. This allows operating all the critical camera controls with only right hand - left handholds the lens, so rarely ever touch the AF-select button (camera left-front)

Activate 3D with AFOn ie BBAF

RSF on Fn3 set up to toggle SR ON/OFF - to expand on this, usually I only turn OFF SR in a Custom Area mode
 
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fcotterill said:
I prefer to select the primary AF mode for the camera pressing Red Record and scrolling front-dial. This allows operating all the critical camera controls with only right hand - left handholds the lens, so rarely ever touch the AF-select button (camera left-front)

Activate 3D with AFOn ie BBAF

RSF on Fn3 set up to toggle SR ON/OFF
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Thanks for clarification. I have the same red record for swapping my primary focus. If I revert forward to 3.0 I may give it a go just to see if it works with 3D on the af-on button - however at present I do prefer to handoff from wide-l on the af-on to fn1 3d which works great. I just need to reconfigure the wide-l a different way to do this and at the moment I cannot see how. I normally have wide-l on my af-on and 3d on my fn1 as well as fn2 and fn3 taken up by other focus modes and it works on v2 just not well in version 3.
 
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ajm057 said:
I strongly recommend all Z9 owners watch today’s Grays of Westminster live stream on YouTube where RICCI answers my questions on v3.0 AF changes and explains how 3D-tracking works on the Z9 and how this is different to how it worked on previous Nikon cameras AND yes Subject Detection should be enabled when using both AREA AF and 3D tracking OR use another AF solution.
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Yes I watched that and I hope the update is soon. Ricci mentions it by saying “The first thing that’s worth mentioning”- regarding v3.0 bugs questions around 37:40 onwards. “Nikon’s aware of the bug when you go from auto area to 3D with a function button and nikon is happy to say that they will fix that in a future firmware update.”
 
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I've followed this thread with interest since FW 3.0 was announced. I picked up my Z9 almost 1 week to the day before the FW update was released, had purchased Steve's guide to setting up the Z9 and was reading/studying it, and familiarizing myself with the new body before heading out into the field. There's a lot to digest here...something I haven't seen mentioned is tracking serial numbers to see if those who are experiencing so many of the issues (and it seems that not everyone is, or at least not all of them) have bodies that fall into a certain range of numbers. Coming from a D850 and a D500, it is a bit staggering just how much more complex this body is...just hoping that the range of issues that seem to be surfacing are all correctable in the (very) near future with additional FW updates.
 
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NicholasN said:
Be aware if reverting back to 2.1 - you must have prior 2.1 saved settings as version 3.0 settings would not be able to be loaded.
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Thanks Nicholas I want to the digital zoom for now so knowing the 3D is limited at least will have me prepared. Hmmm I don't think I have the most recent saved settings from before I upgraded. Thanks for the heads up.
 
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Just a thought: until Nikon fixes the issue, perhaps consider changing your button assignments? I have my Z9 set to using 3D on the shutter half-press and Wide Area on the AF-ON button, and have no issues w/ 3D. Subject Detect works fine on both.

Use the Wide Area (Small) w/ Subject Detect on BBF to get the bird sighted in, and then swapping to 3D on the shutter half-press to track and/or recompose. Single-point AF as fall back on the Fn 1 button in case the other two mess up. This has worked great for how and what I am shooting (songbirds and the like), and may not be everyone's cup of tea, but fortunately it avoids the 3D AF bug.
 
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FWIW, I tried different tracking setups with 3D and none of it changed the bug I was seeing during controlled tests. I tried shutter release AF couple with 3D + AF-On on the AF-On button as well as my standard configuration of 3D (no AF) on Fn1/3 and AF on the AF-On button. Both were the same.
 
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